Spine problems?

I'm the forum moderator for the lyme disease forum.  I've been dealing with lyme for about 5 years; a lot of my symptoms are musculo-skeletal.  Pre-lyme, I also was diagnosed with two herniated discs in my lumbar spine and also degenerative disc disease -- this was all at the age of 22.  No accident or major injury ever.  I was a rower for a year in college and always played lots of sports, but my orthopedist concluded my spine problems were just congenital.

Anyway, I have a specific question now about adhesions around my spine that I thought maybe some of you would be able to help me with.  I recently had a procedure done at physical therapy called "scraping" -- it sounds pretty scary, but supposedly it's really good for muscles!  The PT uses a hard vinyl tool to literally scrape at the muscle or area that's having pain in order to physically break up scar tissue and bring in fresh blood, so the area can heal properly.  I had this done on my entire back the other day, focusing on the paraspinal muscles.  My PT (who's really well known in the area for this procedure) was amazed at the number of "adhesions" (the same thing as scar tissue?) around and even over my vertebrae.  I could actually see what he was talking about later -- the most injured areas are the ones that bruise the most when scraped.  He said that he had never seen adhesions across the vertebrae like that (from one side of my spine to the other).

I'm just totally perplexed as to how I could have all this scar tissue around and across my vertebrae when I never even had an accident or injury.  I looked up "spinal adhesions" on google and every site said they are the result of healing after surgery or major injury.

Now, lyme can cause many weird things, but I've never heard of this one before.  Do any of you have experience with this?  Do you think degenerative disc disease could cause such bad scarring, even by the age of 27?  I'm a little worried about the future of my spine!

Goodmorning Alfers,

Your case is a bit similar to my Lymes case.  From 1995 to 2004 I had Lymes. (ouch!)  So I do oh so know how nasty this can be.

I'm going to write ya back when I get home.  (have an appt this morning)

Just to start, I developed Ankylosing Spondylitis whether it came from the Lymes or RA who knows? But the spine and back is always spastic (rheummy says it's hard/fibrous...)

I too have 7 bulging discs. Had neuro Lymes. Joint problems, etc... (I'm 25 by the way).

I'm going to read into my texts a little more when I get home, but I will absolutely get back to you ASAP this afternoon!

And you're darn right...Lymes can do and DOES cause a lot of complicated things.

Talk to you real soon,

Erin

Dear Alfers,

My apologies for being a slow poke!  Do you by any chance have Neuro Lymes? Is it in the spinal fluid?  Ever a lumbar puncture (spinal tap)?

I am familiar with "scraping".  Funny thing is that in the Art World (spent 8 years working in a gallery)...we use a tool that's made kinda the same way, it's called a bone...to scrape out bumps & dents & to make thimgs go flat. Your PT is basically separating the muscles and kinda pulling them a bit from the ligaments, bone & tendons. Sounds unatural but it's alright...bu that's correct it's suppose to renew blood flow & increase circulation.

I've heard very little of degenerative discs being congenital. (yes it exists but is ususally diagnosed pretty young)  Unless you are at a predisposition for osteopenia, and that could be quite possible. (an endocrine or metabolic disorder).   Basically, I've seen alot of young YOUNG people (25...27 years old) in an osteopenic state; that's my only thoughts on it being congenital.  I think it could be sports related.  Athlete's bodies take a beatin'!  

 One sort of disease is coined "Acceleration-Deceleration Disease"  which is found a lot in sports/falls/jolting motions/football players...etc. 

  **It would present as physical findings of pain, back & neck pain, pain at the exact location of injury, muscle rigidity, spasms** 

But yeah, disc disease definitely causes complications such as contractures, deformity, Ankylosis (which I'll talk about in your new thread), bony cysts, spurs.

In young women there's a common thing called Sacral-Iliac joint dysfunction.       And spondylolithsesis (which sounds a heck of a lot like what you have!) that affects athletic people.

As to what Lyme can do?  What can it NOT do.  Given the bacteria itself likes to spiral and drill it's way into joints...but the antibiotics can ALSO cause reactive arthritises!  So where do we win?

I am glad you keep up with a PT.

I'll be sure to fil in the blanks as I read things over again.

The best to you,

erin