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Posted 11/23/2007 11:50 PM (GMT 0)
I've been going out with my girlfriend for six months. She was upfront with me from the start that she suffers from manic depression. She's on Lithium daily and annually sees a psych to make sure everything is in check.

Recently though she's moved into her own place and this seems to have brought on more depressive episodes. Recently she has been extremely caught up on my past relationship - I was going out with a girl long term, we broke up and then I met her. What she can't get over is how I 'got over' this past relationship so quickly - I told her that I didn't - that I grieved and cried and hurt. She can't seem to accept this though - it's like her brain is 'stuck'.

Last night we were talking about it again and she started shaking, wanted to throw a glass at the wall and she kept saying 'it's in my head, it's in my head'. She believes me - but it's like her mind won't let her 'believe' it.

I had never seen one of these 'psychotic episodes' - as she called it - but I was supportive and comforting but I could see she was in a LOT of mental pain.

Then at the end of our long discussion she asked if we could 'just be friends for a while'? At first I was shocked but soon pulled myself together.

She said she needs to go into her own world for a bit, hibernate and get her thoughts together. She said she doesn't like partners seeing her in this state - and she just wants a bit of 'space' to work these thoughts through. She also said she can't handle the 'expectation' to work this out straight away.

So I've agreed to give her 'time' - she still wants to remain friends and hang out together and we both agreed we didn't want to 'lose each other'.

I spoke to her today and just let her know I wasn't going anywhere and she can talk to me anytime. To which she replied 'Thankyou but I don't think I feel like talking yet and I don't have any answers'. I said 'that's fine'. She said 'I just need to lie down on grass and think'. She's also been sleeping a hell of a lot since that night together and she is under quite a bit of stress at work.

I keep trying to tell myself this isn't about me - that she's not rejecting me - this is about her and her illness and what else can I do except still be her friend, don't pressure her and hope she'll give us a second chance once she 'sorts herself out'? It's quite a balance though to 'be there for her' but 'give her space' at the same time. By the way - two nights before she was telling me I had all the qualities she was always looking for in a man - then 'bang' - I'm on the outer...

Any advice much appreciated. I really love this girl. Cheers Evan
Posted 11/25/2007 9:06 AM (GMT 0)
Any suggestions or advice re my above situation most welcome. Thanks Evan

Posted 11/25/2007 1:42 PM (GMT 0)
Give her space and sounds like she needs to see her therapist right now.
Posted 11/25/2007 5:50 PM (GMT 0)
Evan,

Welcome to HW family and to the Bipolar Forum, I am glad you found us.

I totally agree with MMMNAVY, I thing she needs space to thing things out.  Don't feel guilty about what happened, it's just things didn't work out.

Posted 11/25/2007 11:48 PM (GMT 0)
Hi Evan,

You said she is bi-polar, takes Lithium and see's her doctor annually. Maybe it is time for her to make a new appt. with her doctor to let him/her know what is going on with her mood change.

Doing things like wanting to throw a glass at the wall and repeating that it is inside of her head, wanting to go into "her world", sleeping more and avoiding you, for someone who has bi-polar and  was stable  to then have their moods change suddenly like you stated, shows to me it's time to get in to see the doctor asap.

Posted 11/26/2007 7:03 PM (GMT 0)
Evan, as a spouse of a BP II, I will share it is a very hard life at times, and my H is milder than most. I can appreciate your compassion for this woman, and I agree with all the other feedback that she definitely needs to see her doctor asap. However, YOU can do nothing but suggest it. She needs to do that for herself, or gain that support through her family. You need to take a look at how this woman's condition is making you feel within the relationship and decide if you would want this for a lifetime; because THAT is what you will get if the relationship progresses. I am not saying she is not a wonderful and deserving person, I am sure she is, but the fact is...you have only been with her 6 months, and you have an opportunity to make some decisions for yourself as well about this. Regardless if she is BPI or BPII, living and making a life with a BP is hard. There will NEVER be a lifelong calm, stable environment. You may go through periods where it is better than others, but regardless of the degree that they are affected with BP, it is hard on them, and hard on the spouses/partners. It is a lifelong issue that will need constant care, understanding and vigilance on both peoples part. And as a partner, it requires much understanding and patience. I wish you well in deciding how deep you want to go with the relationship. Be less concerned about taking it as a rejection and view it as a time to make decisions for yourself as to what YOU will want about the relationship beyond a friendship with her. She has given you a gift....time to see it all straight on (and keep in mind she is in some ways trying to protect you too by stepping back and not letting you really see it all)…so TAKE the gift and evaluate things for yourself. If you stay, go into it with eyes WIDE open as to your future, and also if there are kids…etc… Otherwise, allow the relationship to drift away gently and wish her well with love. Stay in touch only as friends. You move forward for you and open yourself up to date and meet others. There is no right or wrong about this for anyone. Just choices to be made about what people REALLY want for their futures. So get honest with yourself about it all, and decide what path you will take for yourself. And know that if you stay patient and want to “work” on the relationship with this woman, in the end, it still will or won’t work. Only time will tell anyway….My best to you….LFW
Posted 11/26/2007 8:33 PM (GMT 0)
Thankyou everyone for your replies and suggestions - I'm quite overwhelmed by your support.

My girlfriend rang me tonight and asked if I wanted to come over to talk. So I did and we've just finished talking after 5 hours. I was able to ask her a lot of questions in a very caring and supportive manner - although I did back off when I could see her start to struggle.

The areas she got nervous about are 'if her drugs are working' and her psychiatrist (she only sees him once a year) - although she is going to 'try' and book in with him next week..

She basically wants a 'break' because she feels having a relationship is putting too much 'pressure' on her at the moment. And that word kept coming up again and again and again - 'PRESSURE'. And yet this was one of the things I tried most hard to avoid - putting 'pressure' on her to be a 'girlfriend'. It was her who made the first move on ME and decided to move in with me until she bought her new apartment - not me - and I never ASKED if she wanted to stay - I always let her DECIDE - simply because I didn't want her to feel 'pressured'. As I had come out of a long term relationship - she also 'felt pressure' to 'live up' to my past girlfriend - again I had reassured her that I was after something TOTALLY different. I also remembered I noticed a while ago she hadn't seen some friends for a while - so I told her to keep in touch with them (basically saying she didn't have to be with ME all of the time). And she feels 'pressure' that we work for the same company (although we never see each other)...and she felt pressure that I told her I 'loved' her a while back...

So she loved everything we had - but also felt it was too much to deal with. She needs this 'break' to 'isolate herself and find out who she is again'. I asked why it's only me she wants to isolate herself from - not her friends and family and she replied 'well they don't ask questions why I'm doing it' (they wouldn't know I suspect...)

She knew I had been reading a lot on BP and when I asked her if she wants me to print anything out she said - 'no maybe when I'm better'. I reinforced to her that I'm in this for the long haul - and it seemed to please her I was in quite a good mood - again she said that if I was down and depressed she would see this as 'pressure' to get back together again straight away.

But we did have lots of laughs and what can I say - the spark is certainly there and she doesn't think this is 'over' but still needs this 'break' and 'space'. Although she did confirm she has done this to other boyfriends - she doesn't think there is a pattern...hmmmmm. I tried to bring up the fact that this 'breaking up' behaviour could be due to her bipolar - but she either didn't understand or didn't want to understand.

So what can I say - you all told me there was no easy answer - and my God there isn't. I don't know if she is Bipolar 1 or II - I know she said she also had elements of 'schizoaffective??' diagnosed and is on a mood stabilzier and Lithium daily.

When I asked her why she suddenly 'sprung' this break on me - she said she had 'no choice' - it was either this or 'madness'.

So what to do? I don't know - I've never been in this position before. We connect on EVERY level and could have a great relationship - yet this is what scares her most - the 'pressure' of being in a 'relationship'.

Overall - she knows I'm there and will give her space. What more can a guy in love do?
Sigh...Evan
Posted 11/26/2007 9:02 PM (GMT 0)
Oh goodness Evan....I feel for you, and I have some wonderful stories to share and some supportive words for you. First, please believe every word of what I tell you.....YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO MAKE SENSE OR UNDERSTAND THIS DISORDER. So please, for the love of God, do not try to understand why she is saying what she is saying or why she is doing what she is doing. SHE DOES NOT EVEN KNOW. All you can do is manage it on your terms and learn to cope with it and learn how to let it or not let it effect your life at the time. Trust your heart. If the sparks are there, and you are both committed to a healthy life....meaning she will see her psychiatrist much more regularly and MAKE SURE she stays stable on her medication.....then choose the time wisely....and you can talk about realtionships.

I have learned from experience......ANY type of stress and pressure is too overwhelming for someone with bp, and the "easiest" thing to walk away from is the romantic relationship in their life. Not that it isn't heart-breaking.....but most of the times, it's all they can do to just perform the basic daily activities you and I take for granted without feeling overwhelmed, so they remove the "excess" stuff so they don't feel pressured. It probably hurts your girlfriend more than it hurts you b/c she is the one that's suffering....she feels guilty b/c she can't function like most normal people. that's why it is so imperative that she is in constant contact with her support network.....pyschiatrist, therapist, and stable on her meds.

LFW is right......it is a lifetime of patience and support and love.....and it may be harder on those who support those with bp. You need to be thick skinned, and aware of the cycles, and strong enough to stand firm in reality when the person you love may seem like a totally differen person.....

Trust me....you have no idea the strength required....you need to be emotionally, physically, and psychologically healthy enough yourself to manage a life with someone with bp......and that is even if they want to be stable and healthy.

But keep reading the posts and the board....it is possible...there are so many inspirational stories....it can be done. But believe me...everything your girlfriend is doing is not a reflection of you AT ALL. None of it is. Feel secure in that. Continue to be the man she fell in love with. Trust the love you have together. Be patient. Wait for her to come around and she will. She will come to you and talk when she is ready. When she is calm and lucid....have a conversation about her disorder and what her expectations are.....and in the meantime...think about your life and what you want for your future.
Posted 11/26/2007 9:12 PM (GMT 0)
*laughing because Casem hits it right on the money.*
Posted 11/27/2007 5:46 PM (GMT 0)
Evan, take the time to read the board from people in the throws of pain of how bad it can, and does, get for some. What it is like right now seems awfully mild and reasonable to me. But, when things go wrong...the pain is very bad, the isolation a partner feels, the betrayal, how controlled by their condition we become...etc. I am not saying to end it, I am saying to see the realities before you commit yourself, before you decide how "committed" you really want to be. Start first with the future YOU want for yourself. Does it include this level of daily and constant drama? Does it include the daily - weekly - monthly discussion how every little "PERFECTLY NORMAL AND REASONABLE" thing you do, translates as pressure for her? That issue over time alone can cause madness for the partner...TRUST me on that one. And again....I live with a milder situation than most. I love my H dearly with all my heart, but...I sacrifice a lot of happiness for myself to stay patient, loving and understanding for him. If it were not for my kids....I do sometimes question whether or not I would still be here. After living this way for 16+ years...if it were not for the kids...I don't know that I would. It is TOO hard, TOO inconsistent, TOO up and down for my taste. EVERYTHING is an issue, needs to be handled this way or that - to not trigger this or that. It gets hard and tedious. And again....I TRULY love my husband down to my toes. And believe me...my H is an amazing WONDERFUL man. He has a huge heart (one of my favorite things about him). But, the grind of life is just that...GRINDING...and it can and does wear you out at times. Think long and hard, do your research...GET HONEST about WHAT YOU WANT FOR YOUR FUTURE....That has to be your number one priority...YOUR FUTURE. Think about it clearly before you get too sucked into it all...because you will go on the ride too...her highs, and lows... Good luck to you. LFW
Posted 11/27/2007 10:07 PM (GMT 0)
LFW has a really dead-honest manner as always, scottyteal, which is refreshing and a bit brutal. She's absolutely right that a long-term relationship with we bps can be a real trial. Even the most self-aware and proactive of us is, obviously, prone to really vicious mood swings that are truly out of our control and are far more frustrating and devastating for us than they are for anyone else. But just try and keep up with it. tongue But it can be done. I like to think we're worth it. Bps are thought to be more creative than most, and passionate, and funny and our lows may be really low, but our highs are really high. Kay Redfield Jamison wrote a book arguing that most geniuses were bipolar. Hard to live with though? Well yeah. Maybe.
Posted 11/27/2007 10:37 PM (GMT 0)
I do appreciate all your posts - I actually get a bit emotional reading them - not matter how harsh - I need to hear every angle - so thankyou everyone for helping me and my girlfriend in this time of crises.

I DO want this to work with my girlfriend - I have NEVER run away from anything in my life - and there was a lot in retrospect I probably should have. But my girlfriend and this condition - no - I know a decent / honest / caring girl when I see one - no matter what condition she is afflicted with.

I just hope she gives me the chance and opens up again to me so I can show her how we CAN share our lives together and move forward as a couple.

Thanks for all your help. Evan

Posted 11/28/2007 5:22 AM (GMT 0)
Evan, as long as you consciously choose to go forward...SEEING the realities of what you face...and you still choose to pursue the relationship...that is GREAT! BP's who ARE committed to be responsible about their own conditions are brilliant, amazing and loving people with great depth to who they are, and they are very special. I am sorry if my straight forwardness seems harsh to you or anyone else (it is not meant to hurt anyone and I do love all my friends here and respect each of your paths), but when you are at the stage that you are....I believe the truth should not be sugar coated, because if you STILL choose to go forward after hearing it and really considering this from all sides (seeing what others have shared about their pain as partners), you do it then with NO illusions, but grounded in reality. Now you are free in some ways to learn immediately how to work together, how to tackle the BP when it get's away from your partner, what to do, what not to do that triggers, and you learn right away the adjustments that help make life work for you both. That is the best chance you have at seeing the relationship be successful in the long haul if there really is a future for you both. It doesn't, and never will mean, problem free...for either of you. But it can mean honest, and through that honesty, a real partnership and love. Good luck to you both. LFW
Posted 11/28/2007 10:20 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks so much serefena & loving frustrated wife - this all helps me so much...

So why after a mania stage do BP sufferers push their partners / lovers away once they have crashed into depression - and after they have hurt and tread on us - they then want us back again??
Posted Yesterday 12:35 AM (GMT 0)
I agree,she needs to see her DR or Therapist ASAP!!!
Posted 12/1/2007 11:56 AM (GMT 0)

Thankyou everyone for your messages of support - they give me so much courage when I get down...

The latest is with my girlfriend...she came into my office to see how I was the other day - I told her I was doing OK - she then said - 'Oh God - stop looking at me with those eyes - it makes me want to kiss you so bad'!!!

I couldn't believe what I was hearing! I told her I wanted to kiss her too - then she said she's going to book in for her labotomy next week! The spark between us was amazing but I stopped things going any further in case this brought back any 'pressure' feeling in moving too quickly again.

But I couldn't believe she had flipped this QUICKLY!!

Then the next morning she rang saying she was having an anxiety attack. She went to her professor's retirement dinner last night and it was a MAJOR trigger. She used to be a scientist - which she loved - but had to give it up because the Bipolar hit hard. And she's never really got over this loss...
 
She rang me in quite a state - wanting me to just talk to her - I then went over there and made us a cup of tea -  - and just kept talking gently to her - reaffirming her. She was pacing, couldn't sit down and vomiting - lots of deep breathing. She let me give her a hug - but it still took her a while to calm down. I convinced her to go to work - and she said she'd put on her 'work mask' (so true...).
 
I asked her if she had booked in with her psychiatrist and she said 'she forgot' - oh God - I've told her I want her to do it ASAP. In fact - in retrospect I should have made her call then and there - darn it!
 
She's left work to go home and sleep this afternoon - it really exhausted her and I know she didn't sleep much last night.
 
She called this an 'anxiety attack' but could it have been something more serious?
 
The rollercoaster continues...Regards Evan

Posted 12/1/2007 5:56 PM (GMT 0)
I'm sorry your girlfriend and you are having some rough times right now. I'm new to being bipolar and still am in the I don't know what is going on stage. I'm really happy to see you care for you girlfriend so much to look into and ask questions to help her.
With her forgetting I totally understand I forget everything >.< I have to write everything down. I forgot to take my lithium test and luckily someone brough it up in the chat to me...hehe So I would suggest maybe being there when she calls maybe...I always feel nervous talking on the phone so having someone there makes it better for some reason...it makes me do it.
As to your question earlier to why we push away then go back....I can't answer for everyone and will not but for me I pushed away my best friend a few times because I don't want to hurt her. I feel bad that sometimes I can't control my self and feel she is way better off without me. But she says she'll always be my friend no matter what...so I end always going back to her because I need to feel loved by someone. I think thats why...see i'm not even sure of my own feelings right now >.<
I hope she feels better soon and may the irish luck be with you!!!!

~kimmy~
Posted 12/2/2007 1:18 AM (GMT 0)
Scottyteal,

I can hear the frustration in your posts. It must be very difficult. Definitely push the psychiatrist issue. She does have a lot of "triggers" pulling on her right now, although I would say "stressors" -- things which she wants and seems to be afraid of having because the bipolar makes them somehow difficult. Well the bipolar makes MOST things more difficult, unfortunately. So, we have to kind of accept that and decide what's worth fighting for anyway.

But being pulled in all directions like this, I'd say she could use the back up of a more proactive psychiatrist. I can't believe hers only sees her once a year. Is that her decision or the docs? Is it her insurance? For comparison, mine sees me every 6 weeks when I'm stable. That's when things are going well! Every 2-3 weeks when they're not.

serafena
Posted 12/6/2007 12:40 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks everyone for your replies

I also found out last night she last had her blood levels checked FOUR YEARS AGO!!!

That combined with only seeing her psych once a year - surely a recipe for disaster. And this is a girl having MAJOR episodes - she's pushed me away - had two panic attacks in the past three weeks (they're the only ones I know about!!) and as she told me last night - sometimes can't get off her couch because she's fearful of walking five steps into her kitchen.

How can a psychiatrist prescribe her lithium annually - and how can he do this without seeing blood test results (I'm in Australia so maybe it's diff here - can any Aussie's here help?)

Surely her recent behaviour means her meds are way, way off????
Posted 12/6/2007 1:39 PM (GMT 0)
Hello Evan,

 

In your first post you stated: "She's on Lithium daily and annually sees a psych to make sure everything is in check."

 

Today you state: "I also found out last night she last had her blood levels checked FOUR YEARS AGO!!!"

You continued, "That combined with only seeing her psych once a year - surely a recipe for disaster. And this is a girl having MAJOR episodes - she's pushed me away - had two panic attacks in the past three weeks (they're the only ones I know about!!) and as she told me last night - sometimes can't get off her couch because she's fearful of walking five steps into her kitchen.

How can a psychiatrist prescribe her lithium annually - and how can he do this without seeing blood test results"

Ethan, you've asked yourself some very good questions. I think you know what to do. If you want to help her, find a new doctor. It sounds like she is more ill than you  first knew and that she is either irresponsible for taking quality care of herself or is incapable of doing so.

You have a long road ahead of you if you are committed to straightening all of this out with her. Again, you were asked some pretty stiff questions at the beginning of all of this from LFW & Serafena. I hope your girlfriend is as committed to her wellness as you are, otherwise you are in for a big struggle. Makes me wonder how committed she was to herself BEFORE she met you. Think about it, please.

Wishing you both wellness.
Posted 12/9/2007 8:42 AM (GMT 0)

Thanks Sukay

Good news - we had a great chat this week and whilst talking about her Bipolar, I was able to get to realise just how neglectful she had been and that whatever meds she's on and psych treatment she is getting (which is none!) - it's NOT working. So she agreed to see a new doctor AND psychiatrist! (She actually admitted to me she hasn't see a psych in 2 years!)

I booked her in to see my doctor this morning which went really well - she felt quite relieved to be able to discuss her current situation and panic attacks. She's also booked in for a blood test - the results of which she will get back next week.

The doctor has also suggested if she can't get into a psych straight away - she will see her herself on a therapy basis.

But I know we're not out of the woods. She was in a very good mood today and yesterday but her brother is going overseas indefinately tomorrow which may have a significant impact on her.

But hopefully this is all a step in the right direction. And as far as 'we' are concerned - bizarrely even though she considers a relationship far to much 'pressure' at the moment - we've never been closer. I hope psych care can help her ally this fear and take away some of that perceived 'pressure'.

Thanks friends, Evan

Posted 12/9/2007 3:15 PM (GMT 0)

Hi Evan,

Glad to hear you and your girlfriend had such a productive week. I'm glad you were able to convince her to get into seeing a new doctor and to start treatment for herself. What type of doctor did you get her in too see?

It's good that you are anticipating what may be some triggers for her, like with her brother leaving for overseas. You are right, you are not out of the woods yet. She has a long road to travel to wellness. But you are definately helping her to take all the appropriate steps needed to fullfill that.

Good luck Evan. You are certainly making a healthy difference in her life. You sound very sincere! She is very lucky to have such good support from you. A support system is very, very important to maintain wellness. Some people unfortunately do not have that, and my heart goes out to them.

We are here to continue to help support you along your journey.

Take care Evan.

Posted 12/10/2007 3:43 PM (GMT 0)
Hi i have been in a partnership for 9 yrs... I push her away Alot & have since moved out of our home. No clear reason just needed to push her away, needed space of my own & it is nothing short of hell for her. anyways... my opinion, for what its worth... read up on Borderline personality disorder. from what I understand A lot of Bipolars also suffer from BPD. The push away & shut downs are common with BPD.
On the subject of the "pressure" she feels, as a BP, Pressure is what we torment ourselves with & rarely has anything to do with others... I feel like a failure because I cant count on MYSELF! took me a long time to realize that... as silly as it may sound... we can rely on only 1 thing... we can not count on ourselves & dont want others to, esp when we're not doing well. I cant make plans or promises because Ive learned it only serves to put pressure on me that eventually leads to me pushing people closest to me away.. sometimes everybody. i do it also to spare them from me. being around others takes trust, trust that they wont reject us for letting them down... for being "too much" (as a childhood bipolar who has learned that im usually "too much" for most ppl) trusting others is hell when we cant trust ourselves.
And, yes, she should seek counseling as my counselor (who recently moved) helped me understand how & why bp affects me & helped me understand a lot about the disorder. i am also singed up for CBT Cognitive behavior therapy which is known to be of REAL help. Ive been in counseling a lot in my life... but never learned as much as I did with my recent shrink/ counselor a GOOd shrink/counselor makes a such a huge diff. AND btw NO ONE should be on lithium without regular blood work!! It can be extremely dangerous to our physical health & a lot of the meds out there loose their effectiveness after long periods of time.
I have to add, the sudden overwhelming love then disconnection is common for me.
Ive had two long term relationships... the one was better & sometimes easier because he was somewhat emotionally detached & because of that didnt take where i was at or what i did/felt personal. this relationship im in now is harder because we're very close and emotionaly attached & she takes things very personal... Good Luck!! & hang in there!!
Posted 12/11/2007 3:04 AM (GMT 0)
Hi Jmelynn67:

Welcome to the board! We're glad to have you.
Why not take a moment to start a new thread on the main board just to introduce yourself to our members and let everyone know who you are and why you're here?

Thanks,
serafena
Posted 12/11/2007 3:07 AM (GMT 0)
Evan,

Great news about the doctor. That was a real breakthrough and you did her a truly good deed. I hope the blood counts come back well and she gets in to see a psych soon. Especially with her brother leaving. Is she close with him? Is he in the military? That would be very hard.
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