New to this page and confused

Hi everyone,

I have been using healingwell for sometime now although not on this forum. I usualy use the depression or bipolar one but noticed this earlier and thought id drop in to say hello. Im a guy in the army in the U.K. I have just returned from a three week intensive physio assessment at my local forces regional rehab unit. I substained a bad knee injury some 7yrs ago have had operations and what have you but finally after 5yrs of pain since and no body listening to my complaints of pain and difficulty of simple daily tasks I have had a dx. They say that I substained an ACL injury to the knee (which I understand) however it was missed during surgery and has since made its own repair as best it can. They now say that I am suffering from Cronic Pain and can expect to suffer from it for the rest of my life. Im so confused what does this mean, am i going to be dependent on pain killers forever? I feel like a hypercondriact as no body has taken the time to explain it to me. Im led to believe it's a pain but nothing medicaly wrong exists? To be honest I feel like i've just been through a meat factory (chucked a forces medical downgrade at the same time) and not even worthy of an explanation for why i feel like they think im waisting their time. Please help I hope this has'nt offended anyone sometimes the forces medical system is second to none and other times the U.K.s own NHS wins hands down.

PaLady,
Thank you and catch you around no doubt, HW really is a fantastic place full of brilliant people.

Tunny:

Welcome to this forum. I am sorry to hear of the pain that has brought you here. I can understand your confusion - it just doesn't make sense that one should have to live in pain. If I hear you right, you are not understanding how you can have pain despite the fact that your ACL is technically "healed" from the initial injury. Is that correct? I am not a physician, so please take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt (or maybe even a whole pillar of salt! ).

It sounds to me like you may have some symptoms of RSD (reflex sympathetic dystrophy) or as it is sometimes now called CRPS (complex regional pain syndrome). My understanding of this disorder is that our nerves have become hypersensitive and over-stimulated by the extreme pain and the lack of relief following an injury. Consequently, even after the injury has healed, the nerves remain "on" and continue to send pain signals to the brain despite the fact that the injury is over. That does NOT mean that the pain is imagined. Quite the contrary. It is VERY, VERY real. Your body FEELS severe pain even though the tests and scans and whatnot cannot detect and injury that explains the level of pain you are experiencing.

Again, I am NOT a physician. This is just my understanding from my own research and what doctors have told me in my quest to find a solution to my own pain problem. I would encourage you to research the issue yourself as being informed may help you on this journey. Also, if you have someone you trust who can attend appointments with you that might be beneficial as well. I wish I could tell you that you would not have to be on pain medication for the rest of your life. In my case, it is looking more and more like that might be the case. And worse yet, I am one of many CP patients who face the uphill struggle of finding a PM doc who is willing to prescribe sufficient medications to adequately control the pain.

I wish you the best and hope you will find some good answers here. I do know that you will find much support and encouragement.

Ry

Hey Tunny,

Welcome to the CP board. I, too, have knee problems, so I feel your pain.  My non-professional guess is that the ACL tear did not heal properly, but technically healed.  Military doctors often settle for "good enough" when it comes to injuries that heal up.  In the private sector, a good orthopaedist would probably suggest orthroscopic surgery to correct the incorrectly healed ACL.  The military would consider it "superfluous" or "elective" surgery since it's "technically" healed.  The amount of pain you are in is often times disregarded by military doctors, who often have a "patch 'em up, and send 'em back out" mentality.  They don't care that it's done correctly, just that it's done.  It's a problem with the US military too.  Heck, it's even standard practice with a lot of private doctors as well.

As far as having to take painkillers from here on out, it's just going to depend on how well your knee is rehabilitated.  It may take you seeing a non-military physician when you can, to see if there are other surgical options for you.  Personally, I'm just having to wait things out.  I need both knees replaced, but I've been putting it off for 28 years.  DR. still wants me to wait, since I'm young enough that if I have it done now, it will have to be done again in 10/15 years, and who wants to do that more than once?

Please keep us updated on your condition.  We're glad to help out whenever we can.

Leigh Ann

Dear Tunny,
I suffer from chronic pain as well. Mine is in my back and legs. I have had two surgeries and still I have bad days and worse days. It took 2 years to find the right pain killers. I hate taking pills but the pain out weighs the medications. I try my best to only take them when I need them. I can tell you, pain leads to depression for me. I love to ride horses but I know when I ride I will pay for it at the end of the day for a day or two. It makes it worse when we don't have anyone who understands us when you get the question "whats wrong?" a simple answer of "I hurt" gets old. Healing well has helped me when my depression flares up. I am the kind of person who hates to be told not to do things that will only make my pain worse. It makes me feel like I'm not a whole person. So I end up doing it anyway. I will say the more I do the better I feel emotionally about how I feel about myself. Who knows if you start working out, your knee might feel better. I would ask for a second doctors opinion. I would also take notes as Amanda has said. Trust me the pain is not in your head. Nerve pain is a hard thing to fix. The scare tissue in my back has made the nerve damage worse and I truly feel for you. Don't give up. You never know you might find a doctor with the cure for the pain you are living with. I know I haven't given you any answers but we are all here to support each other. Good luck........Okonner

Right im heading off to work for the first time in 3 weeks, ready to face a 12hr night shift and the pain associated with it. I just wanted to say thankyou for giving me the mora courage to face my shift and speak with my Sgt (Boss) about my dx and the limitations that means for me from now on. You really help I know that if i can face him tonight then I will be able to talk to the SSgt (Big Boss) soon and discuss the options. Thank you so much don't underestimate all you do your good people who face their fears. I hope who and all you do makes me a better person in time like I think it will.
Thankyou all of you

Hi, Tunny,
I wanted to get back to you with a bit more detail, although you've already been given some great advice. I'm not sure how bad the initial injury to your ACL was. I had a "small tear" in my ACL from a fall 4 years ago. That was at least the initial injury, but within a couple of months after I started developing lots of leg/buttock and foot pain issues. I believe in part it was from my body mechanics being off, plus the fact the fall was a very hard one and I'm in my 50's so my spine was already aging. Of course here I am 4 years later after lots of PT and various treatments and finally lumbar fusion surgery and still dealing with chronic pain. The knee injury was put on a back burner because the strengthening exercises for the leg aggravated my back. I was told at the time my ACL tear wasn't bad enough for a surgical repair, and the best I could do was strengthen the muscles around the knee to hold it in place. i was also told the ACL does not "heal" or repair itself, but it's something you can live with. However you sound like your ACL tear might have been more serious. But I write this to say that an injury to one part of the body that causes a shift in what's supposed to be a symmetrical structure (our body) can make a mess in lots of areas.

I'm not sure if your pain is located in one leg, or has spread to other areas. I'd look up RSD/CRPS and see if the symptoms seem to fit, and if they do bring that to your doc. However, I know here in the U.S. not all docs know how to diagnose this accurately.

I don't know if any of this helps, but thought I'd throw my 2cents in.

(and Ry as always, you did make me smile!!)

PaLady

Morning all ,
It's 2 in the afternoon here in the U.K. and i've finally managed to crawl out of my nest after my night working. I stuck the kettle on and came straight on here and all I can say is thank you so much. Although I have no one around here to talk with or share my problems with, to come on HW and see peoples messages and thoughts of encouragement really has made my day.

So I did it I made it to work, it was'nt easy getting out of the car in the car park and walking in to face the 'forces humour' (Bullying) that I knew faced me. The main instigator was on leave which took a lot of pressure off me straight away. A handfull quizzed me straight away about how I enjoyed my three week holiday being assesed at the rehab, which knocked me straight back down. Once the day shift had gone home I sat with two of my fellow counterparts and explained what had happened and what I had been told would be in their report to my Doctor. They both listened although I could see that their blank expressions showed no understanding for the condition. My Cpl informed me that the Sgt was also on leave, I can't tell you the feeling I felt of not having to deal with the questions last night lol. However the good news was instantainsly followed by words I did'nt want to hear. I am part of the army's security team and so act as armed response, as I have been struggling so much and letting the worries of my ex get me down recently. Sometime ago I decided it was time to distance my work life and personal life more and do something for me to take my mind off it all. I had applied to tranfer to become an Army Dog Handler still in my regiment but at Army HQ. A new camp, a new start, new people, a goal to focus on and one of my dreams come true. It had all been arranged and agreeed and courses booked for my trainning ready to give me the ability to use my work to switch off from the reality of my personal life and be doing something I loved.... That was the plan and it was all perfect.... Untill the Cpl last night said that the Sgt has decided that with the pernament medical downgrade that I have been given it is his recommendation and belief that I will be unable to continue with my plans of joinning the Dog section. Im gutted, my feet were just kicked out from under me.

Just as I was finding a coping startergy for me and to be strong they take it away from me. I know that tonight I will have to face the music on the Sgt's return and get quizzed all about ''My three week holiday''. I keep looking at the clock 3hrs to go.

Anyway as with your messages regarding my ex... Thank you. It really does help to hear an outsiders oppion. I managed to text her last nite to let her know I am still there for her as support if ever she needs or wants it. I got a reply and she said she was ok but thanked me. At least she knows im still there. I am going to keep plodding on for now, get my head around my dx a bit more and then when I get the courage tell her in time about it all and ask if she woud mind helpping me through it. I know that will be sometime away but I really want her support and help as I know she will aid me to reaching where I belong and more importantly make me face life and dealing with all the worry and self pitty Im currently scared of.
Thank you all of you, I will let you know how it goes at work tonight... This is going to be a tough one but I need to face it sometime and im sick of hiding .

Hi, Tunny.

Sorry to hear about the rough situation you've been facing. I can see how devastating that could be and just wanted to encourage you.

I do understand what it's like to come back to people who all tease about being on a vacation. I've found that if I keep my answer short ("I was so sick, it was a miserable 3 months") and then switch to something positive ("I'm so glad to get things back to normal & to be able to focus on going forward") that people soon move onto other topics. It will probably take a few days, but there are all kinds of other things going on in the world & in those people's lives and you will not stay the center of attention for long. Stay strong & hang in there!

Wish I could offer more help. I was just wondering if maybe talking to the sgt tonight could maybe end up not being as awful as you're expecting. I've never been in the service & know from friends of mine who are that there can be good sgt's who try to back their people as much as possible and others who only care about themselves, but I've also seen people who've really prepared for a difficult meeting with the latter, presented everything in a calm & respectful manner and ended up with a better result than expected. Maybe you can see if working as a trainer would be a possibility at some point down the road. I'm not sure, just thought it might be a little early to give up on that dream entirely.

It might be worth it to restate your desire to become a dog trainer & ask him what it would take to make him comfortable again with recommending you to that unit. Maybe you just need clearance from the medic or a period of time to demonstrate your recovery. I imagine it takes a lot of money to train someone for that position & he probably wants to be sure you will be able to successfully serve in that capacity for years to come. Sometimes people (even leaders) get nervous & make snap decisions based on incomplete or incorrect information; but, oftentimes those decisions can be reversed -- either immediately or over time -- when both parties have all the information needed. Perhaps you can practice for your talk with the sgt so you will be less nervous and better prepared to try to get information from him about why he's rescinded his recommendation and what you could do to move towards reaching that goal in the future.

best wishes!
frances

Hi Tunny and I too wanted to welcome you to HW. I have some experience with knee pain. I have had a total of six arthroscopic knee surgeries. I have had 5 on the left knee and one on the right. My last 2 surgeries were in the fall of 04 and they were three weeks apart. I ust have been out of my mind doing them so close together.

 

I have had torn meniscus problems on the left knee, scar tiissue that locked my knee cap from surgeries. The last surgery was for a partial tear of the ACL. Damage to the ACL is far worse than any meniscus surgery. I do not know how in the world you functioned with a torn ACL. My neighbor raced motorcycles and he of course had a bad wreck and tore his ACL. His dr wanted him in water rehab only, less forcefull to knee and non weight bearing. Rather than go to PT, his dr gave him a list of exercises to do and he did his PT in my pool. The dr approved this. He also had him in a knee brace for months and his ACL actually healed w/o surgical intervention. Mine was not the case, I had to have surgery. I was going to my dr for my first post op check up and caught the toe of my shoe in the lines of the sidewalk where the handicap ramp was at. I almost fell and in trying to keep myself upright, I twisted this new scoped knee something terrible. A new MRI showed hoe I had actually torn tendons and muscles. We opted to put me in what was called a Don Joy brace, it went from my ankle to my thigh. I had to wear it at all times except bathing & sleeping. It took 18 months for this stupid knee to heal. My poor dr was so sympathetic to me, because while waiting for him to come in the room, my knee swelled the size of a large grapefruit. He wanted to admit me to the hospital but I refused to go because my sister had just got here out of state. I took pain killers to no avail. I went back in a week later for another check up and my knee was in awful shape, it was so swollen & red, he feared a blood clot. I spent 7 days in the hospital but did not have a blood clot. It took a long time to get the swelling down, I spent most of my time with it propped up.

 

I am not a dr by a long shot, but an educated guess here is, your ACL has healed alright, although I do not think it has healed properly. Because it has healed does not mean everything is back where it should be. I know you are in the military, however, I would spend the money and see a civilian orthopedic specialist that deals with knee problems. A MRI of your knee will pretty much tell the story. I would not let the military drs manage this knee problem unless its done under the direction of a competent civilian orthopedic. You could possibly be a candidate for an arthroscopic surgery and get the problem corrected and not have to worry about being tagged as someone with chronic pain. Its worth the money to go out of the ranks of military drs and get your knee properly evaluated.

 

You should not be in excruciating pain while doing PT, sorry they are way out of line there. I do hope you will consider a 2nd opinion. Good luck. Susie