Talking or Complaining

Fatherjohn,
I, for one, come here. Since I live alone, there's no one in the house to complain to! And the little bit of work I do is similar to yours - not somewhere I can talk about my problems.

I have one cousin who knows most all the gory details, and sometimes I know I have to catch myself because I think I overburden her at times, and forget she has her struggles and strains.

I think there's a real difference between venting and doing some "healthy" complaining, and dwelling forever at the bottom of the pit. I think that's why I love the fun threads here, and find them extremely important to my escape, but I know in a heartbeat (you've already seen examples) I can turn around and cry or scream about something painful or frustrating, and have many ears listening.

I have come to appreciate the benefits of not just connecting on the internet, but this forum (Healing Well) in particular. I've posted to a couple of others, but have never lasted. Having it be moderated I do believe helps, as it keeps the spammers out, keeps it family friendly, and somehow just attracts a great mix of people. I'd encourage you not to hesitate to complain or vent at times here whenever needed. In the next breath you can go over and "fly" and no one bats an eyelash.

Don't know if this is what you were looking for, but thought I'd toss my 2cents in (as usual!).

BTW you're a great new addition to the forum.

PaLady

In all honesty, I think the difference doesn't get recognized in most everyday interactions. I think you'll see that periodically in posts here. I think it takes a very special person (possibly a spouse, but not always, as you well know) who's willing to listen and learn.

If someone says they have cancer, there either people who are going to do anything they can to help and understand, or those who will back away in fear. But chronic illness that contains persistent pain or discomfort....I do think most people tire of hearing of it. I'm having difficulty articulating this because I'm still tryiing to get clarity in my own mind about this issue. I've worked with a lot of people with chronic illness, as well as MH/SA, but seeing CP from the inside out is teaching me an entirely new level of understanding. But I can't put it into words yet.

I think I'm going to start rambling if I go on any further, but maybe this will be flushed out more as others post.

PaLady

wow Skeye a journal sounds like a good outlet for you, I hope you can keep it up.
Fatherjohn, wow you asked a very hard question and looking back at me, I guess
I do complain a lot around my husband and daughter the most, as none of the
rest of my family would or could understand (plus they live over 2,000 miles away)
When people ask how I am, I usually just say "Okay" as they don't really care because,
they are going throuhg their own struggles..
So to me the question "How are you?" should just not be used at all, except maybe if asked
by certain doctor's.
Now back to the main point, it's hard not complaining and I think only a very very few people
can says they don't complain and one of those would've been Mother Theresa, and I
ain't no saint...
Thanks for making us think and reflect Fatherjohn!
Soft Hugz to all......

Just lately when I get to feeling really bad or sad, I go to the puter and
play White Stripes version of "I think were gunna be friends." (It's also
Conan Obrian's faborite song.

It was the theme song from Napolean Dynamite which is a "feel good" movie
for sure.

fatherjohn, my friend's mother was BEST friends with Huey Lewis's mother.
They were neighbors on the 17-Mile Drive at Carmel-By-The-Sea.
Lewis does some song I really like ... uh ... I can't remember what 'tis!

Pamela Neckpain

I'm with Char about the "how are you question". I studied linguistics in college & they said that in modern America that "how are you" should be classified as a greeting, not as an interrogatory (i.e., question). So that's how I handle that particular question.

As far as any more depth, I really learned a lot from a good friend of mine who lost her 5 year battle with cancer a few years ago. I always hear people say that those who have cancer are shown more compassion, but that just wasn't the case with my friend. Sure, when she was first diagnosed, everyone wanted to help -- bringing meals, signing up to give rides, calling every night -- but after that they were just as callous about her dx as mine. People would say dumb things to her & her husband (who worked at the same company as her) like "it can't be that bad if you can come into work" or "you haven't lost your hair so it must not be very aggressive or you would have been given radiation" or "yeah. i had a cancer spot removed once. it was horrible. (as if a spot on the skin was the same as metastasized cancer and multiple organ failure)" They would just be really dumb & cruel. She was an amazing young woman who handled it all with more grace than could possibly be expected, and I learned a lot from her b/c of that.

So, if I really need to tell someone my medical issues (though I'm pretty private, so I keep them to myself as much as possible), I have a few explanations prepared ahead of time. I have a slightly longer initial explanation (gen. 3-5 min) where I tell them that I have a birth defect & as a result need to have multiple surgeries & am in quite a bit of pain on a regular basis as a result. Then I have the shorter explanation (about 30-60 sec. tops) where I just remind them that I have a lot of pain due to a birth defect & therefore need them to _______ so that I can participate.

I think people like to feel in control of their lives & the environment around them. If you just say that you are in pain & can't do as much as before, it leaves them feeling helpless. Some of the more empathetic individuals may try to figure out how to help, but if they can't they may feel frustrated or angry or resentful, none of which helps either of us. So I give them a specific suggestion. A few friends have parted ways with me over the years, but most of them have stuck by my side. When I am in really bad shape & need to go to the hospital, they are right there by my side & bring me goodies and cards and flowers (just like the cancer patients :) but otherwise, we try to keep the relationship as "normal" as possible. We try to talk about happier things b/c in general, imho, that makes for better relationships anyways.

I don't hide my disability from friends, family or co-workers, but I try to make it as unobtrusive as possible. I can't walk very fast & can't make it long distances. I can't sit for long periods of time. I need to take pain medication & use my stimulator remote. But other than dealing with those few things that people can see, I try to convince myself that there's really no benefit to me to take my hidden disability & try to force it out in the open. That doesn't ever seem to help in any way. So I have this HW group to talk about struggles with -- you guys are the best -- & a couple close friends who understand and are willing to have a two-way conversation talking about our struggles, but mostly I figure this is my own burden to bear. It's between me & god & sometimes a counselor to sort out all my thoughts, feelings & fears about having the chronic pain. I do what I can & then if I can think of some practical way that someone can help me, I say so. That practical help may be "I need someone to help brainstorm with me how I can ______ (get along with my PM, cope with pain, convince my boss to modify my workspace)" but I try to keep it short & specific.

For me, that's the difference between talking about pain & complaining about it. Complaining about it has no end-goal in sight. Talking about it has an identified purpose. Please don't think that I expect others to share my view, but that has worked pretty well for me most of the time so that is what I stick with.

GB,
frances

As I reread my rsponse I saw I did a poor job on spelling. Forgive me. I have had a whole week of sleepless nights and have increased my meds to help and the mind is not working all that well.

Fatherjohn,
First off - don't worry about spelling and such here! We all redesign the language from time to time (i used to be such a precise writer and prided myself on it....oh, well). FYI, if needed you can edit your own post by clicking on the pencil icon. But you don't need to do that for us!

I had wondered about the issue you mentioned re: your work as I know precisely what you're talking about. Before I was laid off from my pt. time, I helped occasionally with the D&A IOP program. This was before I was on as much medication as I'm on now. Add to that if I was still working there, I would have to now be using the hospital pharmacy. I also knew my mind was not as crisp as before, and I did strain to make sure I covered the important basis with each person I saw (life & death issues, etc.) but knew I missed other things. And paperwork took me extra time.

It's so unfair that you are/may be put in this Catch 22. Periodically we have someone come on here who is stuggling with both CP and addiction and it is a challenge. There is much that D&A needs to learn about that. Lives get ruined by undertreated pain, too. I don't know what the balance is.

You've also started a great post here. Skeye's comment about sometimes people's responses actually make it worse is ringing with me. Somehow I've known that, but maybe it's accepting that telling certain people actually will hurt me more than help. Uh-oh, I'm rambling again!

PaLady
Mom - Hugs to you!!

okay...so how do you all respond to "are you feeling better today?". There are times, when in dire straits, that I imagine pulling the face off that person and then screaming "fine". Too angry? I usually smile and say "I'm doing okay." Heck the the "how are you?" question can drive me nuts. Do you really want me to answer ANY of these questions truthfully...
Just wish we had better greeting systems sometime...not that I'm complaining....

I think we have talked before how we just don't about our pain to anyone much except out drs. Mainly, because we are sick of being in pain and know most around us are sick of us bring in pain too. They get tired of hearing it all and we get tired of hearing it all. So, when I had insurance coverage for mental health I saw a psychologist that was awesome. I quit complaining years ago cause no one wanted to hear it. They just could not understand it. I always compare chronic pain to this; if I am cutting a tomato with a sharp knife and cut my hand I am going to bleed and this is going to hurt. So, if hubby saw me do this then he understands why it hurts, he can see why it would hurt. Pain is invisible they cannot see it therefore, they do not understand it. The only people that truly understand chronic pain is another person with chronic pain.

 

If someone other than the dr asks me how I am doing, I say fine. Its easier to say fine than to say anything else.  

 

Susie                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                               

Oh, how I hate that "how are you" question! I too always just answer "fine" or "okay."
It is much simpler than actually explaining how I am. Besides, most people could care less.
Like Frances said, the "how are you" question is more of a greeting than an inquisition.

Skeye

After reading these posts, I have come to a realization. If we have a hard time understanding Cp

and struggle with its effects, it is no surprise that others who don't have CP can't grasp it. It would

be great if we all could accept others and show compassion when needed. I just came through a

very difficult 3 days and got to the point that I wanted to scream its not fair, I did not ask for this.

Now I am back focusing on reality and settling in for the ride. As I stated earlier, I try not to complain

but the fact is I probably will from time to time. Oh if I were just stronger. If I were not so needy at

times. If I did not get depressed. If the side effects of my meds and the pain were not so difficult to

handle. Opps. I don't want to complain, but if I did this would be the right place. I will keep talking to

others and if they don't understand, they will have to bear that burden themselves.

John one thing I have learned is CP people are some of the strongest people walking on tis earth. Not everyone can endure what we do on a daily basis. So, therefore you are not weak by a long shot, you are a very strong person. Susie