first post/acupuncture for chronic pain?

Unfortunately I do not have any experience with acupuncture at all. I do however have some experience with acupressure for pain relief, although is was for acute rather than chronic pain. I bring this up because the two are similar in how they work by "disrupting" the flow of pain from its source to the brain as well as helping the body to release and use its own pain killers. When done by someone who knew what they were doing I had significant reductions in pain levels. Once again, when I had this done it was for acute pain caused by relatively minor but very painful injuries.

With that said I firmly believe that trying acupuncture is worth a shot. While many western doctors look upon it as one step above voodoo there is actually some sound scientific principles behind it.

Hi Viloadagamba and welcome to Healing Well's chronic pain forum. Although, I am sorry that you have to be here, I am very glad that you have found this forum. It is amazing how chronic pain can just take over every aspect of our lives if we are not careful. One of the very worst feelings is the feeling alone. At least to me, that was a big thing as I was once a very active outgoing person who suddenly found herself making every excuse in the world as to why I could not go here or there and then eventually people stopped calling because they figured they would be told no and they were tired of being told no. Granted there were times I could have gone some where but I was also use to being alone. At least by coming here you will find that you are not alone after all.

You asked about acupuncture and yes, I have had the traditional Chinese method done. I had been involved in a car accident and was hit from the rear while sitting at a red light. This happened on my way to work one morning. I thought I was ok until later in the morning I got a pretty bad head ache. By 5:00pm I had one stiff painful neck. I was seen by an orthopedic and went thru PT for three months. Nothing helped including the PT. PT felt good while I was laying there on the table but an hour later I was right back where I started from. My sister had convinced me to see a dr that she was treating with for the similar type of pain. She had been involved in two really bad accidents an she had significant injuries to her neck and was able to prolong neck surgery for many years because of doing acupuncture.This dr had studied the traditional Chinese method too. After 9 treatments my pain was totally resolved. But keep in mind, we are talking about a whiplash type of injury mostly muscular type pain. He also said I should be able to tell if it was getting better after the 3rd treatment. He said that the pain would move around and it really did and that meant it was working.

I know of several people that have done the traditional acupuncture for various reasons and it has been successful for them. I certainly think its something worth trying. It is not a painful procedure either. The needles they use are so tiny and thin there is really no pain when they are inserted. you are hearing this from someone that is terrified of needles too. To me the worst part was after all of the needles were removed the nurse would use alcohol swabs and wipe where a needle had been and there would be a little stinging and thats it.

Anyway, that was my experience with acupuncture. I also wanted to pop on and tell you welcome aboard. Please keep posting and let us know how you are doing. Take care.

I want to thank everyone for your concern and response.  Today is a real bad day.  It is only 1:30 p.m. and I have already had 120mg of morphine since 8 a.m., and am just starting to get the pain from a 10 down to maybe an 8.  I know what the person means who says they want to keep the meds in the botlle.  While I know I am opiate dependent after this many years on morphine what I want most is to be able to see my pain dorctor and tell her to start weaning me off the morphine.  I have no idea if I will ever reach that goal as the top orthopedic surgeons I have seen do not offer me much chance of improvment through revision or reconstructive surgery.  I am less than a day out from the first acupuncture treatment and I am putting a great deal of hope in it.  The traditional doctor I will be seeing seems to be quite honest so all I can do is wait for my daughter to pick me up and drive me to the office to see him.

As far as (Mexico goes) there is actually a fine gentleman who is quite a runner who has a web site for those who have had or whom are contemplating "elective amputation" of a limb due to uncontrolled chronic pain.

This man has appeared on television and is very supportive to those who have no other options left.  He had his foot amputated and still runs major marathons with the aid of new prosthetics.

I have been corresponding with him for several months now, and although I am not psychologically ready to have my right leg amputated, I can understand that if I learned that there was virtually no chance of pain rel;ief and I had to live the rest of my life the way i do now, that I might seek it as an option.

I have seen so many brave solldiers get around with excellent mobility after they have lost legs in the war.  While I am far from 20 years old, and no where near in the physical condition they are in, I would assume with the new prosthetics that are now available, I would be in better shape than I am now.

Richard has actually given me the names of several well thought of orthopedic surgeons in the Baltimore / Washington area who are open to discussing this option with chronic pain patients with no other option.

From a quality of life position if I now need to use a wheelchair of scooter to get even from room to room after the eleven surgeries I have had on my knee, and am consistantly sleepy from the level of opiates I need to get even some degree of pain relief, I wonder if over all I would be better off without the leg.  Even if I still needed the power chair I could eventually get off the opiates and get my life back.  As far as the issue of phantom pain, I understand from the literature that there are some excellent techniques for dealing with that in amputees.

Of course the number of doctors who would even consider this option as a form of pain relief in an otherwise functional limb are few, apparently there are some who understand just how chronic pain can take away any chance for a normal ife and are willing to discuss this option openly with patients and their famalies.

While I have not yet come to terms with that option I may yet have to look at myself and ask if I am ready to continue my life in one room of my home, counting the hours until I take my next pill and not being able to do very much but deal with the pain.

I just saw on this site that a woman passed away after some "minor knee surgery."

I don't want to get started with that as I now see how so many in the orthopedic community have used the idea of knee replacement surgery and arthroscopy as a cure all for any and all knee pain.. Hospitals are paying doctors to run dinner seminars at Hotels to talk to people about the benefits of joint and joint replacement surgeries, and hospitals all over the country are opening up so called joint replacement centers.  These surgeries are becomming cash cows for the orthopedic communities, the makers of the prosthetics and hospitals who know they can get a flow of medicare dollars for these surgeries.

What they do not tell you of course is that while some people do get relief from these procedures they are major surgeries and far more people than the doctors will admit are far worse off after knee and hip replacement surgery than before, and there are far too many complications needing additional surgeries.

At least in my case after eleven knee surgeries and a knee replacement gone bad most of the top doctors in the teaching hospitals that do not need the cases to make their living have told me that I have little to gain and much to loose with another attempt at surgery.

I guess where I am now is with my back to the wall with the hope that acupuncture will provide some relief, and if not I will really need to think about what is best for the time I have left,  life with my leg that will be full of pain or the chance at a fresh start without the leg, a number of months of physical therapy learning to walk with a prosthetic leg and the chance of some freedom from pain.

Will keep you posted and if anyone has any thoughts on this matter I would appreaciate hearing from you below.

Solarpowered,
Actually I have tried many options in western medicine, including epidurals, faucet injections, fentenol patches, creams and everything but snake oil.
It is rather strange since I have excellent range of motion in the leg, and no problems with infection now, or a loose prothesis. As far as the pain physicians say, they all seem to feel that I have massive nerve damage from one or more of the surgeries and that once the nerves become sensative they continue to transmit pain on an ongoing basis. There is only one option I have not yet tried, and that is a rather new procedure called knee derevation surgery. It is a surgery performed by plastic surgeons, and is considered perpharial nerve surgery, where the surgeon actually removes the perpharial nerves from the knee area.
There are only a hand full of doctors who do it and almost all do NOT accept any insurance. The cost up front, cash is about $25,000 which to me is worth it if it works. That is the key, if. Since it is so new there are not any long term trials on it yet. I have found ONE doctor at Harvard Med School who does the surgery and accepts insurance, but now he has a wait list of six months. I am on his list and should be able to fly up to see him sometine in late September of October. There are actually a number of physicians overseas who do the procedure, since it has only recently been approved by the FDA as standard treatment in the U.S. I have spoken with one company that arranges overseas surgeries and they have two plastic surgeons in India, which has a pretty advanced medical community, who perform the surgery and have done so for several years. However the idea of flying around the world to see a doctor I do not know, and cannot follow up with is really not a very good idea to me.
I intend to hold off on any decision regarding amputation until I at lease consult with the doctor at Harvard, once he sees you, I was told by his office there is still a four to six month wait for the surgery. The good part is that it is actually out patient surgery and you leave the Hospital walking on the leg as soon as the surgery is completed. I am a little concerned since the few doctors who do it have really big high class web sites and each one has really strong advertising. The man who pioneered the surgery advertises he has offices in Beverly Hills, Palm Beach and even in the United Arab Emerits, this is the guy who asks $25,000 before he will even make an appointment, I may have been born at night, but not last night, thank you???

   (I took the liberty of deleting your extra reply, as it was redundant. Please allow a little time for the reply to show up, once you click submit) Thanks! SE

Post Edited By Moderator (Screaming Eagle) : 5/2/2011 8:21:00 AM (GMT-6)

Well, I have seen first hand phantom pain and what it was like for a young man. He worked in the oil fields and sustained a crush type injury to his arm, resulting in part of his arm being amputated. He suffered greatly, as nerve pain as you know really is not helped all that much by pain medication unless it is in large amounts. Then its a matter of finding a dr that will rx it in such a dose. I would really hate to see someone end up like he did. On the flip side I think I can see some of where you are at in your thinking. You feel you have reached the end of line and no place else to go.

I would like to ask you if anyone has ever talked about an intrathecal pain pump for you? They do a trial on a patient to see if they get any relief. If you would, please go to Medtronic.com and read up about their pain pumps. There are different ones out there, but they seem to have the best site with the most information of any of the pump makers. I understand and we all do about the medication thing, but you know quality of life issues play such a huge role for many of us. I have a pain pump and my life is much better than it was taking oral medication. I don't sit and watch the clock like I did before. I am on less medication with the pump than what I was taking orally, thats the beauty of the pump.

I can see that you have really done a lot research into this and understand everything involved. I am with you on the traveling to India, for a surgery such as that, no thanks. With waiting lists like you have spoken of that tells me there are a lot people out there suffering.

Please keep us posted on how you are coming along. I really would not expect anything on my first treatment, it usually takes 3 to be able to tell any difference. I will be interested in seeing how your first appt goes. Take care.

Viola my pump is located up above the beltline in my stomach on the side,. They no longer install them at the waist line because people would put on tight pants and cause the pump to flip. This may tell you about the location and I would not have put in my back, yes, they probably do have some smaller ones on the market by now. They do not protrude out as much as you think either. Mine has been in since 2005. I do know they use the pump for nerve pain, but you can also visit Medtronic's website they have conditions listed that a pump will help.

Woohoo on being able to tell some difference after a treatment, awesome.

I must ask that you not to type in all caps, as it is hard to read and is considered shouting, which I know you are not doing lol.

Keep us posted.