PLEASE HELP: chronic diarrhea (bile smelling) with fat(?) newbie this forum

Hi Margaret. I'm sorry you're having such a hard time! It sounds awful. I honestly don't know a lot about bile to be able to confirm what you described. I hope someone can come along who knows more than I do. Holy cow- waiting until May is a long time to see your GI. Is there any way you could call and get in sooner? Or maybe you could go see your regular doctor and have their office call the GI's office and get them to get you in sooner. Doctors do that stuff all the time for each other. I just hate to see you have to wait. It sounds like you need to be seen ASAP. How long are you doing the bone broth diet for? Are you generally able to tolerate food? Or not really?

Green poop usually means that it's going too quickly through your system for it all to be fully absorbed, and the color is from the bile acids (I believe).

I'm not sure I know what fat looks like in a BM, but I'm wondering if maybe you mean it's mucous? That happens when I flare or my c. diff. is back. Have they tested for other bacteria?

Incontinence sucks. I will get super thick pads, like the ones you get after having a baby, or even Depends sometimes. That helps me feel like I have a bit more control.

Even though you can't see your GI quite yet, I'd ask them to go ahead and schedule a colonoscopy now. That's how they'd test anyway.

Hi,

Actually, yesterday, which was the first day I posted, turned out to be a horrible day. I was peeing out the bum, over and over again. I don't like Immodium, bc I don't like to retain bacteria, but I finally had to take it.

I still have no appetite.

When my diarrhea is less severe, I've seen the strands of mucous. HABs, when my diarrhea isn't as bad, I see the strands of mucous. They do look like DNA.

I tried the Welchol I have for the second time, and just like the first time, it gave me a huge migraine.

Scifi, what I saw was just this kind of residue on the surface. I just assumed it was fat, because I had looked up my symptoms on the internet.

I am so glad you told me about the incontinence, because that means I'm not the only one. I know it's awful for you too, but I'm still glad you told me. I am so embarrassed. Bladder incontinence is one thing, but this! is humiliating. Where do you get those pads?

My gallbladder is still there.

I live in NC, and I was seeing a GI doc. at Baptist Wake Forest Med. Center for C. Diff. When this C. Diff. test came back negative, he just blew me off, and told me to go see my family physician. The s---head (ha ha, bad joke) doesn't even examine my abdomen, and I forgot to show him my hernia.

I hate colonoscopies; is that really the only way? I get weak enough from the diarrhea I have without the colonoscopy prep without having to go through the whole thing again.

Are C. Diff. tests always accurate?

What do you folks do for progressive weight loss? It's a little scary, isn't it?

Thanks all, Margaret

I eat paleo ......when i was sick 2 years ago.... I started out with many things like you skinny stools
green stool switching from green to yellow... I started off SCD first ...removing alot of the fruit sugar..
I pretty much ate chicken .. I had the sheeeeeets to.... I ended up with a abscess.. hope it isnt your case.

My diet was pretty much scd... i tried to eat many things like chicken some low starch cooked veggies.
meatballs etc. get yourself some of this.... this was the first thing I used to build back my lining
http://www.metagenics.com/mp/products/glutagenics

it took about 5 weeks to get some effect... but worked for me. You need a good probiotic one free of many foods etc.... renew life 50 billion worked and still works well for me.

I ve repeated my self alot.... but in the end.. my cause was yeast... your big list 90 percent to be points to candida.. Try starting here with doug kaufmann ---the fungus link... try the diet and watch his videos www.knowthecause.com his diet http://www.robinallan.com/uploads/1/6/2/7/1627227/antifungaldiet.pdf if you try the phase one--- dont do nuts..

I went to feminine hygiene products section of the store and just looked for the biggest, longest ones. Sometimes you can even find some labelled for post-birth.

So mucous kind of looks like fat on a chicken breast before it's cooked.

I have c. diff. cultures that show up on colonoscopies but my last test was negative even though the colonoscopy was 3 days later and clearly showed it.

They can do bloodwork for CD/UC indicators, but can't really diagnose for sure without the colonoscopy.

Do you mean, what do I sleep on in case of an accident at night? If I'm worried about that, I put down a couple of towels under me. I also made sure to get a waterproof mattress pad. Those kind are slightly noisy because they can be a bit plastic-y, but try to get one that doesn't feel too much that way and then you just get used to it. Once the covered sheet is on it, it muffles it a bit, too.

Sorry if I scared you about it! Mine is really bad, I've had at least 6 recurrences in the last 2 years. Flagyl no longer works, nor does Dificid. I'm currently on Vanco but I'm actually going to be doing a Fecal Matter Transplant next month. I'm praying it works; my body is so worn out. If your test is negative, though, I wouldn't worry as much about it.....my GI doctors were extremely confused by the fact that it was negative even though the colonoscopy showed the cultures everywhere. They're just dormant for the moment.

If you don't trust your GI, get a new one ASAP. This is too important to not be able to trust your doctor. Sometimes when you're complicated and what they say doesn't work, their pride gets in the way. That's when mistakes happen, which is a huge problem. I had a PCP last year that literally almost killed me twice because he refused to accept he could be wrong. And it started with him being a jerk and proud and telling me it was all in my head and was being dramatic. 24 hours later I went septic.

Are you staying hydrated? How many BMs are you having a day? Ask your PCP when you go in to do a ton of stool samples....don't just check c. diff., but do like salmonella, e coli. So a full work-up of anything. Also get some blood work done (just the regular stuff).

Thin ribbons of BMs is better than it could be (as I'm sure you know since you've had c. diff. a few times). Is there any blood?

Hey Scifi,

Yes, I meant on the bed, in case it happens while you're sleeping.

So sorry about all your recurrences. I tried Flagyl, Vanco, and Tinidazole (?) and none worked. I did a FMT transplant (myself, at home), because at that point, the FDA had put a temporary hold on it.

Did you do yours at a doctor's office?

If you've had six recurrences, you MUST do the FMT. They have an extremely high success rate. I'm not sure if mine was as successful, bc I just did it via enema (and then did a shoulder stand!!).

My FNP gave me a name of a GI doc she really likes, and he's really nice. I'm seeing her again on Monday.

I can't drink Pedialyte, because of the sugar, but I make my own concoctions, using honey, baking soda, zinc, and potassium, and of course, a lot of water and tea.

Thanks for the responses,

Margaret

Thank goodness, scifi!! I was going to say, what are you waiting for?

Are you doing naso-gastric?

Margaret

if you look at almost all the symptoms people have on here..... and really look into them. for me I looked over everything as a whole.. many of these meds dont get to the real problem. they are here to help you and make you feel better. the problem with them is that they turn off things,, immune suppressant drugs -- your turning off a reaction your body is having. its having a reaction for a reason. the main problem docs cant find each and every persons problem. So the drugs help here turning off things. When you do this your turning off your immune system making others things infect you..etc and you dont know or feel it... example prolosec....acid pill. your removing acid ... you need acid , why are you overly acid. once you take this you turn off all acid...now allowing all kinds of things to grow in your gut... On top of that they give you steroids or anti inflammatory drugs to shrink the inflammation. But deep down there not finding the cause to the inflammation..

I understand people have problems , as ive been there. I feel for each and every person. For me I hunted the cause in my case. As for me There were others in my family tree that had crohns and colitis. as well diabetes type 2. For me personally , i saw over the long hall the weakening of the immune system and its effects as others in my family aged. SO When I got this terrible disease I became the HUNTER. not the hunted..

There are many reasons we get sick. but if you look closely it boils down to something breaking the barrier or lining anywhere in you tract. For me , probably like others on here you really didnt get answers as to why you were sick.. just ***** we are going to try these meds etc , or youll need meds the rest of your life. I my self was told that , and was yelled at while I was walking out the GI door ( over 2 years ago) I decided to skip that . I researched the lining / barrier of the gut. Foods , antifungals ,drugs what they do..,bacteria , yeast , food easly digested ones , and ones that kill bacteria. I quickly found the standard testing the GI's use is pretty dated and limited in my eyes (and research) theres many more tests you can do , not covered by insurance or even understood by your docs. there great at fixing you putting that band aid on you and fixing you... they just dont look for the causes well .

For me It began from research to correlate that many with gut and immune diseases have a high ASCA maker--- this marker is an antibody. This antibody is bakers brewers yeast. If your reactive to it you have a problem. I found GI's dont look at yeast at all. and fact even laugh at it . For me , I found in many research studies , wheat and gluten kill off a bacteria that lines the barrier. Beer etc does the same thing. Many foods feed this bacteria , leeks, garlic , onion, asparagus to bring it back..(this are low starch). Which many of us dont eat much of. I also learned from research that yeast can over grow-- yeast as in bakers or brewers or what naturally lives in you candida. When you eat a diet full of sugar , drink tons of beer , and eat tons of wheat you just lowered you gut barrier. At the same time you feed yeast. there favorite food. On top of that add in antibiotics or Nsaids or even anti inflammatory drugs -- they feed it. One they feed it , two they cause it to over grow more as you - one killed off you lining from the wheat and beer... you killed off the good bacteria from antibiotics. or maybe you just took antibotics...maybe dental.. When the good bacteria is low , your PH changes in the urine and gut . When its low you harbor more bad bacteria and yeast blocks thegood bacteria from growing - you can take all the probiotis you want they will not grow.. Yeast rob you of IRON, Calcium, B vitamins. Etc .When yeasts grow , you get hemmroids, migraines joint pain etc --as they release toxins too.

You quickly see the cycle. you have no choice but to take antibiotics because your colon etc is infected.
you have to take the drugs as your immune system is attacking the problem and attacking the body.You turn it off...... your inflamed you need the NSAIDS and inflammatory drugs.

now you have no lining , your good bacteria is low.... bad bacteria is in charge as well yeast. with out good bacteria you cant produce the fatty chain acids that ferment the food (fibers) which also protect you and keep your PH higher -- so bad bacteria and yeast cant grow. now the fiber makes you flare.... when you try to eat it.

at the same time you eat foods and or foods you can tolerate. with the barrier weak and thin for example you eat SCD,. Many of the foods on this list dont feed yeast-- but several do. as many then jump to more fruit. Bad bacteria eat sugar to. Im eating well and fruit... fruit is bad too... its all sugar

So now you have bad bacteria and yeast high.. they eat sugar.. sugar digests as (in the stomach) milk-yogurt , starches- rice ,corn, potatos and grains.. so you see theres almost no way to end the cycle . you get stuck.

You have no barrier.... you become intolerant to many foods as they are food proteins entering your system. As well those bad bacteria are getting in making you sick and same with the yeast. you back up you ll see many are reactive to yeast first. but the doc does nothing with it. For one they know nothing about it. Many of the foods you eat , you become intolerant to making you flare....at the same time foods that kill bacteria and or yeast that are anti fungal make you flare. you now see this endless cycle.

For me I wanted to dig deeper. and question my doctors knowledge.. I found he had no knowledge. his was the pills will help you. for me it was finding advanced tests and finding causes.

1)I found advanced tests that told me what I was intolerance to in the blood..
2) I then found tests that showed what I was intolerant to in the FECAL gut
3) I then used real testing not the hospital limited lab which really doesnt test for anything. I used an advanced lab not testing a hand ful of bacteria or parasites. ( hospitals are limited same with the local labs) they also dont look at yeast- if they do its almost a joke. I found a lab that tested 92 strains of bacteria. 48 yeast types and 22 parasites.... not a handfull of the most conmon ones like the hospital.
4) I then found an advanced lab that could tell me my levels in side.. what good bacteria I had.. I had almost none( mine was low)the hospital doesnt look at this ???? as well this lab looked at yeast which I was high from . as well many other advanced markers the GI has no clue about.
5) I then used an advanced OAT test for urine.. which no GP or GASTRO knows

I also added in many of the tests the GI uses. compiling all together. I found --

ONE I had low good bacteria.
two I had HIGH yeast --for me its was AMCA --canidida I wasnt bakers brewers , others could be this(ASCA)
three I had high bad strains of bacteria
four -- my PH is LOW
five-- I had many food intolerances
six- all the intolerances I had were hard to digest foods and foods that feed YEAST
seven-- I found the IBD EXPANDED PANEL-- a GI test that is almost NEVER used which shows you if your reactive to sugars a and yeasts, ( on insurance its listed a fungus test??)

I killed my yeast / lowered it..... took glutamine for my lining.. ate foods that feed the bacteria dealing with the lining.. as well removing foods that wear it down.

I ate foods , which had fat.... which the medical area is scamming everyone one on... GOOD FATS are good for you. Cholesterol is an antimicrobial as well

I formed a diet --- NO sugar , PALEO , low starch - veggies...
I ate foods from above- they feed good bacteria and are prebotic foods for probiotics. I took a probitoc free of milk , grain , sugar, starch etc (RENEW 50 billion) some times two a day..
Many experts will say good bacteria eats---starch. the problem when your out of balance the yeast eat it all ---why i removed it.

I worked with the advanced labs and re tested... and watched my bacteria go up my yeast go down...
as this happen I had the flares , migraines , joint pain , nasal drip..... which can also be effects of your body ridding itself of toxins ...Yeast / bad bacteria....

several months later my digestion is perfect best in my life.....I dont have all the so called crohns side effects any more. Today my yeast is low... bad bacteria low and good bacteria is 4x higher then when I was sick..

to me..... you have to start with the GREAT PLAINS LAB..
I have been lucky as I had the money and will to research it all. today my barrier bacteria is 13 percent.. the av person is 3 to 5 percent . when your sick diabetes / immune dieases it dips low.

Today I can eat ANYthing with out a flare.... except SOY(no flare) ... If I eat this I get a massive migraine.
I can drink beer .. eat a pastry etc.. the problem I stick to my low sugar- paleo low starch veggies
clean as whistle. I put my gut up against anyones - who doesnt have crohns . To me its about tracking your gut make up.( finding whats wrong) a month ago a went to a beer party-- drank 7 beers fri and 8 sat... the next morning all my friends sat on the bowl... Not me...all of them do not have crohns.

I ll share any tip or testing ive done with anyone... ask away... I aslso did the american gut project
to me great plans lab is import to get a base for your self.... as well your GI's IBD EXPANDED panel

this great plans lab was the start of getting my life back.. It took a big toll on my wallet.. i wont lie , but the best money I spent.... great plans lab, enterolab, and elisaact /bio...

This lab also to me to add in certain probiotic strains that would bad bacteria strains...
you dont buy into what I say...... look at this link of the antibodies we crohns stinkers have ( do you even know which of these you are reactive too?????)

http://books.google.com/books?id=1dnxloxhm8cC&pg=PA164&lpg=PA164&dq=antimannobioside++carbohydrate+antibodies&source=bl&ots=3upZt-5g_R&sig=_4yNqYgyIfJK4-TsBe5jx99Mb_8&hl=en&sa=X&ei=y_ZCU6n2KdPC2gXjuoEI&ved=0CIIBEOgBMAk#v=onepage&q=antimannobioside%20%20carbohydrate%20antibodies&f=false

Guy, I only got through the first part of your post, bc I'm really tired, but will read the last part later.

Do you know anything about Sacharromyces Boulardi? It's highly touted as a "probiotic" for c. diff. btw, if you're responding to scifi (and I don't know if you are), she's doing a poop transplant, now done by doctors, and they are considered highly effective and very healthy. Just think of it as "repoopulating" your gut (and no, I didn't make that up).

I agree about the drugs, esp. antibiotics and prednisone, and I just stopped taking Prilosec. I started taking Betaine HCL, but it actually made me worse, not better, so I'm just crossing my fingers, and hoping I can do without the Prilosec, Prevacid (I don't even remember what it was).

The question is, what do you do when you HAVE to take antibiotics for some reason or another, or for that matter, even antimicrobial herbs (which STILL affect my intestines)?

Scifi, back to you; I just started using a fleece dog blanket, ha ha, except it's clean, of course. Not sure about the rubber mattress pad, bc I hate getting up in the middle of the night to change my sheets regardless.

And yes, I bet Denver is a little bit more advanced than Houston (sorry Houstonites!!)

Let me know how your FMT goes. That sounds awful, about the pancreatitis. I hope I don't have anything of the sort, since I just found out about my liver values being off, and I can't eat fat.

My dogs had pancreatitis; sorry if I already told you that. The acute phase of that is absolutely miserable.

Margaret

what im getting at is one---- most of us are tossing darts at a dart board with are eyes closed...
many of the things we do may actually maybe making us worse.. For example.. the first thing I learned was I started with gluten problems.. so what do you you EAT a GF diet...I ran to the store....and did what others do...Im sure many of you have done the same... what is a GF diet??? you will see and notice people eat more POTATO flour, CORN FLOUR and RICE FLOUR..... what does this do.. feed YEAST..
my problem was YEAST/candida.. SURE I felt better not eating gluten but I was feeding my problem
I AM NOT SAYING EVERYONES problem is yeast...... What i point out it appears many of us with crohns seem to be reactive to it???? why who knows ... seems no one. because we are all sick. For me i found a link and ran with it.. looking at the LINK below.. Im pretty sure everything they list go me this way. if you look at diet , you ll see sugar is BAD.. even when you think your eating healthy you maybe eating way to much sugar.... sugar feeds bacteria it also feeds yeast
for anyone who want to test that idea---- log on to myfitnespal.com create an account. log all your food for a week.. you may quicly realize your eating WAY to much sugar.... fruit is good for you but all that sugar isnt...

I know and understand fecal transplants and see the data it works , Im for it. I read hundreds of medical studies reports etc

A simple read for all...... I my self was guilty of many listed here... to me no wonder I ended up with what I had...

http://chriskresser.com/9-steps-to-perfect-health-5-heal-your-gut

yesterdays article on YAHOO
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/04/21/research-shows-link-between-nsaid-use-and-gut-disease.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+thedailybeast%2Farticles+%28The+Daily+Beast+-+Latest+Articles%29

That is sad. I agree about all the flours; they ferment and cause bloating. The thing is, a high protein diet is bad for your kidneys, and my kidney values are up.

I'm not sure what to do, except eat lean meat, as I said, and veggies, and yes, fruit, otherwise, what the heck else am I going to eat?

Fat is definitely out of the question; it makes me much worse.

Margaret