Any bodybuilders here, fitness fanatics athletes? How do you deal with needed protien/ BCCA's?

I'm trying to figure out how to keep my blood sugar naturally below 100 fasting, while incorporating protein supplementation/BCCA's or chicken protein to increase muscle gains.

Drs know nothing about these details. They mostly push drugs when its to late. And fitness people/advisors/trainers know little about health besides "big gains" LOL.


1)Low protein intake doesn't support my muscles as much as I want.

2)If I push my body, I can/have muscle catabolisim. An uncommon term for a common problem with athletes- the body can "mine" protein from muscle tissue for other body use. - Because per our DNA, survival is #1, not muscle strength.

3)If I take more protein, my 8hr fasting glucose can increase just over 100 (pre-diabetic in the US).

I've never reached a diabetic state of health probably since fitness has always been part of my life. Doing my best to avoid high glucose, as I did develop other autoimmune issues from Lyme disease. I eat a Paleo diet too, no junk food or glutan.

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This might be a little advanced (?) vs "first time diabetics in freak out mode".??

If so:

***Not many athletes talking about glucose issues online. They have to be somewhere. If you know a better forum site for these two combinations, please advise.**

Note: I'm on other forums here, first time here though, ......thank you

Post Edited (astroman) : 2/24/2018 1:49:43 PM (GMT-7)

Hello. As a health nut, I do eat very healthy to begin with, and appreciate your quick reply.

I get the green leafy veggie thing, but they dont fill me up so I tend to eat a lot of other veggies.

Higher levels of Branched chain amino acids actually are related to insulin resistance, I have read this in other places to:

/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4511294/

This is just not very well known in general diabetic knowledge , such as what Drs know.

An athletic body subject to higher levels of branch chain amino acids (in meat and muscle supplements) will use glucose out of the blood. Improperly working insulin response cant handle this much amino acids from protein.

My body feels better, but fasting glucose goes up with increased protein intake.. Chicken and veggie (pea/rice) protein mix will both do that. Maybe I should check the protein powder carb level. Chicken must have the lowest carbs of meat though?? Fish wont fill me up, I dont eat much beef.

I tried almost vegetarian diet a while ago, glucose was better, but I could not recover from workouts very well.

Our bodies are just a big chemistry plant, I've used many supplements for different things, I supose this is changeable to If I'm lucky enough to figure it out.

My glucose was high in the past with high cortisol too (from lyme and stress). Glucose goes up with elevated cortisol levels. I fixed that and dont have those symptoms anymore. I did not consume much protein then as I was ill and not exercising much.

Yes this is strange. Whats really strange is how lean, fit (my whole life), healthy food people can have insulin resistance!

I eat well as an adult, but maybe a little junk food in the 80's made its mark. Corn sucrulose?

thanks

Post Edited (astroman) : 2/24/2018 4:16:31 PM (GMT-7)

From your link- "Why Obesity Doesn't Cause Diabetes: The Genetic Basis of Diabetes
While people who have diabetes are often heavy, one out of five people diagnosed with diabetes are thin or normal weight. And though heavy people with diabetes are, indeed, likely to be insulin resistant, the majority of people who are overweight will never develop diabetes. In fact, they will not develop diabetes though they are likely to be just as insulin resistant as those who do--or even more so.

The message that diabetes researchers in academic laboratories are coming up with about what really causes diabetes is quite different from what you read in the media. What they are finding is that to get Type 2 Diabetes you need to have some combination of damaged genes well known to scientists. These genes are involved with the complex processes involved in regulating your blood sugar. These damaged genes are often inherited, but not always. The same kind of genetic damage turns out to be caused by a large number of pesticides, herbicides, plastics,and other environmental toxins which are found in alarming concentrations in the bodies of those exposed to them. These chemicals are found in the foods we eat, the water we drink, and even cosmetics and shampoos we apply to our skin. When these genes are damaged, they keep your body from being able to regulate your blood sugar. If you don't have these damaged genes, you can eat until you drop, pack on hundreds of pounds, and never develop diabetes."

/www.selfhacked.com/blog/leucine-health-benefits-side-effects/

"Leucine blocks pyruvate (a molecule that glucose is converted to produce energy) breakdown so that the glucose can’t be used for energy [R].

This process of restricting pyruvate breakdown may explain why glucose uptake and energy production in the muscle of rats decreases after approximately 45 minutes [R, R].

In people that fasted, leucine supplements also reduced energy production because it inhibited the insulin-mediated glucose uptake by the muscles [R].

[R, R].

The inhibitory effect of leucine on energy production causes problems when it’s supplemented to increase energy. Therefore, it is advised that bodybuilders consume a meal prior to workouts. Otherwise, the supplementation could actually be hindering the workout.

Because of the inhibitory effect that leucine has on insulin-mediated glucose uptake, people with diabetes and those taking insulin should stay away from or not fast before leucine supplementation. This could possibly cause diabetic shock due to low levels of insulin and glucose."

**That looks like the problem, I might need to see what form of protein (powder and meat) has less leucine. Funny, the protein powder companies market added leucine as great for anyone - its not.**

Post Edited (astroman) : 2/24/2018 5:22:46 PM (GMT-7)

There are so many variables to this.

I do less cardio (its been a much colder winter in my location) and way more weights this last three months (because I can now), that might be part of it to.

Maybe cardio burns more sugar than weights.?

I will resort back to my past (less) protein intake and see what that does to glucose levels.

Good for you. Couching (if not needed), is not the best choice, although a comfy one and certainly feels great after exercise!

I've been keeping any eye on it / keeping under 100 for a few years and that was with less protein..One sibling have very high sugar, but also had the high food / couch life style forever. My more "mobile" siblings dont have it. I am the most mobile of all of them and still need to watch it. Our parents didnt have it as far as we know. But if they each have half the genes, then their kids have both.

My Dr years ago didnt seem to care! His thought- "we will deal with it if your levels get higher", even though there was a slow pattern developing.

I was in the 100-120 range sometimes back then, and he though that was no big deal? I bought a meter and learned on my own. Part of the cause was lyme disease, part is just me.

Stress, exercise, > adrenals elevate cortisol > liver glucose "dumping"

/activatedyou.com/stress-cortisol-levels/

Ah- ha moment:

Cortisol levels and sometimes blood glucose are sometimes found to be elevated with those who exercise more intensely. Elevated cortisol signals the liver to release more glucose during stress or high physical activity.

If stress-cortisol does not lower to normal, glucose continues to be dumped in the blood at unhealthy levels. Low to moderate exercise almost always lower cortisol and glucose.

I think my higher workouts are also triggering higher cortisol, thus higher glucose levels. Might not be the protein as much as I thought. I will test this with cortisol lowering herbs, and test fasting sugar AM after.

Post Edited (astroman) : 3/4/2018 1:00:30 PM (GMT-7)

... which is exactly why we have to test. I would think that this is particularly crucial for type 1's.

I have read that at some point during or just after strenuous exercise our blood sugar will be elevated, and this depends on the individual of course. Then the blood sugar drops for sometime afterward, depending on the individual again.

Nowadays my 'intensive' exercise is walking briskly for about 40 minutes but I have never tested myself during that time. I do test before and after and can say that my blood sugar is good hours later even through dinner.

Then there was the member who was puzzled why he had a high fasting result on one test after he had jogged to his doctor's office. He thought his blood sugar would have been great but maybe he was in that window. Hard to say.

msOuchie said...
I and other Type 1's have experience with this. Type 2's are probably similar. Check blood glucose before, during and after exercise completion and correct with carbs, if necessary. Check ketones too.

"One of the most common causes of low blood glucose is too much physical activity. In fact, moderate to intense exercise may cause your blood glucose to drop for the next 24 hours following exercise. This post-exercise hypoglycemia is often referred to as the "lag effect" of exercise.

Basically, when you exercise, the body uses two sources of fuel, sugar and free fatty acids (that is, fat) to generate energy. The sugar comes from the blood, the liver and the muscles. The sugar is stored in the liver and muscle in a form called glycogen.

During the first 15 minutes of exercise, most of the sugar for fuel comes from either the blood stream or the muscle glycogen, which is converted back to sugar. After 15 minutes of exercise, however, the fuel starts to come more from the glycogen stored in the liver. After 30 minutes of exercise, the body begins to get more of its energy from the free fatty acids. As a result, exercise can deplete sugar levels and glycogen stores."

www.Joslin.org

I'm talking about hyperglycimia though not hypo. A I never have or had low blood glucose.

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In some people and athletes included, ELEVATED blood sugar can happen with exercise from the adrenal/stress induced liver response of making more glucose. When this happens with less insulin response, your blood glucose stays elevated.

Regular exercise does not seem to help this somewhat rare condition, as it seems to be the cause.

I have been athletic and fit my whole life, also an upper level endurance sport competitor for 25 years.

The less demanding exercise I do, my next morning fasting glucose lowers to healthy levels of 70's-80's.
The more intense exercise I do, my next morning fasting glucose elevates to 100-105, so it was like that all night sleeping but eventually lowers to 80's-90's as the day goes on.

Above was with the same healthy meals and protein for comparison.

I'm just trying to avoid per-diabetes and keep fasting glucose lower than 90, while exercising like I've always done. Since I'm not full diabetic, my blood glucose never gets to those levels like 250 as with some people.

This is backwards, but others have noted this same observation on fitness forums. And they are puzzled.

**I have my own glucose meter, how does one measure ketones??** thanks!

Post Edited (astroman) : 3/4/2018 1:01:25 PM (GMT-7)

Sometimes the more we learn, the more confusing it all is. With blood sugar and diabetes, it seems there are many variables that affect us individually. It could be just genetic or not; it could be other medications or diseases/conditions. I feel the bottom line is finding the best way to control our blood sugar to as near normal as we can in order to avoid complications.

Finding a doctor who is up on the latest research findings is also important, someone whose knowledge doesn't stop with medical school twenty years ago.

You can buy a little kit in a pharmacy that measures ketones in the urine. They are little strips that turn colors and you match them to a sheet. Have you ever tested the ph of an aquarium? It's similar to that.

I was just pointing out that the Joslin article explains, it is after about 10 - 15 minutes of exercising usually, that higher blood glucose appears but lowers afterwards after many hours. We normally end up with low blood sugars, sometimes dangerous. (been there) This is not unusual.

As far as what you are talking about, it is as you explained it but that also appears to be a normal response for non-Diabetics people. So it is not dangerous since it doesn't last for very long. Complications occur when they have mostly high blood sugars for several? many? years. If they get a complication sooner, then something else is going on.

Non-Diabetics who eat high carb foods also get a high blood sugar. I know this because I was curious and I tested "everyone and everyone's dog". Some experiments at takeout/restaurants. Ha! Sure enough, their sugars went high. This was many years ago and still none of them have Diabetes. I also watched a UK Study Documentary years ago about this subject. The blood sugar comes down within 2 hours. The GTT is another example, I think. Although, I've never had one.

As far as keeping blood sugars low...not much. It's mainly exercise, moderate(or low carb) foods, drinking plenty of water. Maybe's: Resistant starch. For Type 2's: Cinnamin, Termeric, Curcumin,
many more on the net which may or may not work.

How is your sister doing? Is she Type 2?

You are correct, some Doctors and Specialists shouldn't be. We had moved to a new area and I found a DR. closeby for our family. I asked him to give our Daughter some tests because she was having several symptoms. He refused and said that, "Children do not get auto-immune diseases". I was horrified! I then told him that I was dxd. with JUVENILE Diabetes at age 3, both of my brothers at age 4 and then me RA at age 24. My cousin JRA at age 10. The Doc did the tests and I got a new Dr. We have had more GOOD Dr./Specialists than dumb ones thankfully.

I do hope that you do not get Diabetes. It's a 24/7/365 PITA. It's not no fun and sometimes scary. No remissions. Other than that, it's not too bad, if the person can accept it.

Post Edited (msOuchie) : 3/4/2018 11:08:28 PM (GMT-7)

***How long after a meal is the usual highest glucose?***

That depends on what is eaten, how much is eaten, what the blood sugar was before eating, and the individual, two hours on average but with exceptions.

www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/14045621.php

www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/14045621.php


These links are from the site link in my signature.