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Posted 11/12/2014 8:40 PM (GMT 0)
I hope someone can help with the IgeneX results that I just received. I only have one positive band:

IGG
23-25 Ind
31 Ind
34 Ind
39 Ind
41 ++

IGM
23-25 Ind
39 Ind
41 +
83-93 Ind

Thanks!!
Posted 11/12/2014 9:39 PM (GMT 0)
Hi dmw52—
Are you seeing an LLMD? Did he/she talk to you about your test yet? I believe if you look under the "new to lyme" thread at the top of the main page, you will find a couple of good, current references for IGeneX test interpretation. It's really good to familiarize yourself with that—even if you haven't spoken w/ the doc yet so that you can ask questions and understand the results better.

Looks to me like you have enough there for a strong suspicion of lyme (there are key lyme-specific bands that are showing up for you, plus "IND" does not mean negative, it simply means a low count detected). But a good LLMD would likely make a clinical diagnosis with the test providing appropriate contextual information.

For future testing, you might suggest to your LLMD what mine did—I first tested negative with ELISA. And then she "provoked" an increased immune response by giving me olive leaf extract over the next month, then we retested with the IGeneX and it came up very positive. My LLMD also said with all the complications of lyme, especially chronic lyme that was caught late stage, the IgG vs IgM (which would typically differentiate a newer infection) doesn't mean a whole lot.

-p
Posted 11/12/2014 10:17 PM (GMT 0)
Hi Dmw,
I use this site www.reocities.com/HotSprings/Oasis/6455/western-blot.txt to help me interpret the Western Blot test results. There is a lot more information there than what I give as they give links to articles explaining each band further.

But - if you have symptoms to match, you definitely look pretty strong for having Lyme disease.

IND means indeterminate, which means it's not a strong enough response to be considered "fully" positive, yet there was a positive response.

It doesn't matter whether the numbers are from the IgG or IgM response, they mean the same as far as what part of the bacteria they are responding to, but generally the IgM response means an active infection, and the IgG is a later response which can occur from 3 weeks to years into the infection.

Band 41 indicates the tail of the bacteria and can cross react with other bacteria of the same type (Borrelia) like Yaws and Pintas, Relapsing Fever, Syphilis, and a couple of others.

Band 25 is specific for Bb (Lyme in the strictest of sense) and indicates Osp C (Outer Surface Protein "C")

Band 31 is specific for Bb, and indicates Osp A (Outer Surface Protein "A")

Band 34 is specific to Bb and indicates Osp B.

Band 39 is specific to Bb and indicates Bmp A (Bacterial Membrane Protein "A")

Band 83 is specific to Bb and indicates a high molecular mass protein is all I understand.

Band 93 is specific to Bb and is an immunodominant protoplasmic cylinder antigen.

With this said, I would encourage you to see a LLMD if you aren't yet and get treatments started as you have a lot of Lyme specific bands show up.
Posted 11/12/2014 11:00 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks for the responses. I am dealing with a LLND but I don't have an appointment with Dr C until Monday. I have many, many symptoms, and feel that I have Lyme. I just found out that I have high levels of mold from the leaky classroom that I taught in. He is going to deal with this first before dealing with the Lyme. Thanks again.
Posted 11/13/2014 2:56 AM (GMT 0)
dm52 - are you in Canada?
Posted 11/13/2014 11:09 AM (GMT 0)
Girlie, I am in Nova Scotia.
Posted 11/13/2014 4:55 PM (GMT 0)
Dealing with the mold first is a good thing - from what I've seen, Lyme patients don't heal until the mold exposure had been dealt with.

Please do let us know how things go and if we can be of help!
Posted 11/13/2014 8:59 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks Traveler. You are a godsend to this group!
Posted 11/13/2014 9:29 PM (GMT 0)
Hi there,

I, too, just received my test results back from IGeneX and am trying to understand them. I'm waiting on a call back from my LLMD's nurse. I had my first appointment with this Dr. M 11/7/2014 and he ran his own set of tests that I'll find out more about next week. In the meantime, my PCP (who is so helpful) agreed to write the script for the testing through IGeneX. He read through the results and said it's negative to Lyme...However, when I look at it and read other posts on the forum...I think it may be present. Here's what it shows. If anyone has similar results and has responded to treatment, please share your experience and let me know what your treatment course has been thus far.....

IFA, B BURGDORFERI G/M/A 40 units (which the lab calls "EQUIVOCAL")

LYME IgM WESTERN BLOT:
IGENEX IGM RESULT: POSITIVE
CDC/NYS RESULT: POSITVE
BAND INTENSITY:
18 kDa -
23-25 kDa -
28 kDa -
30 kDa -
31 kDa -
34 kDa -
39 kDa +
41 kDa +
45 kDa -
58 kDa -
66 kDa -
83-93 kDa -

IGENEX-ICG-RESULT: IND
CDC/NYS-RESULT: NEGATIVE
18 kDa +
23-25 kDa -
28 kDa +
30 kDa -
31 kDa +
34 kDa -
39 kDa IND
41 kDa ++
45 kDa +
58 kDa -
66 kDa -
83-93 kDa IND

THANK YOU!!!
:-)
Posted 11/13/2014 9:40 PM (GMT 0)
Stacygar—

This is why you need to be working with a lyme literate MD.
By general standards we lymees consider, you are positive for lyme. According to the CDC and the medical industry, they'd likely consider you negative because they measure against VERY outdated information.

See Traveler's post above regarding the specific bands (31, 39, 83-93). The IgG / IgM differences are irrelevant because your immune system is inconsistent. My suggestion would be to educate yourself as much as possible before your LLMD appt—and then kindly share the info w/ your PCP if you feel he would be receptive. If he is being helpful, it will be useful for him in case he has other patients who are not able to get to an LLMD.

Good luck and please report back about your LLMD appt!

-p
Posted 11/14/2014 2:31 AM (GMT 0)
Dmw52 - Are you travelling to BC to see Dr C? Or is there another LLND with last name starting with C?
Posted 11/14/2014 3:20 AM (GMT 0)
I'm just curious...how could the CDC consider this a negative result when the IGM specifically says CDC positive.
Posted 11/14/2014 11:27 AM (GMT 0)
Yes, Girlie I went to BC to see Dr C. There isn't anyone in NS to treat Lyme.
Posted 11/14/2014 2:44 PM (GMT 0)
There is no way those results are CDC positive. You need 3 bands on the IGM to be CDC positive. There is a typo somewhere in there.
Posted 11/14/2014 6:29 PM (GMT 0)
Dm - have you had your initial consult with Dr C already? Are you able to do phone appts for a few months to save on travel costs?

I know several people who think he is great... I'm harder to please. He is nice and discusses options with you, but he doesn't have me on much for supportive therapy. He didn't ever mention detox either. But, he's all I've got unless I want to travel to Seattle.

I feel knowledgeable enough to work with him, so getting the prescriptions from him is huge for me.

The one disappointment was when we discussed cyst busting - I decided to go natural and do GSE - but he didn't recommend a brand - told me to buy one from the health food store. All GSE are not created equal.
Posted 11/14/2014 6:36 PM (GMT 0)
You need only two of double starred bands present from group 1 or 2.

Group 1 23-25, 31, 34,39, 83-93

Group 2. 23-25, 34, 39, 41, 83-93


Still isn't cdc positive


But, as we all know - it's a clinical diagnosis.
Posted 11/14/2014 7:34 PM (GMT 0)
Staceygar - I'm going to start a new thread & paste your post in there, so that we don't hijack this thread. Follow this link: www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=3243309
Posted 11/14/2014 8:02 PM (GMT 0)
Girlie, I saw Dr C last month but now I will only do phone consults. He also tested my Reverse T3, free T3, and free T4 through a lab in the US. My reverse T3 was too high and my free T3 was low. He put me on Cytomel. I was displaying hypothyroid symptoms and had asked my doctor to treat me but my TSH was low which is hyperthryoid and he wouldn't treat me. Dr Chan said I needed Cytomel based on my symptoms, even before the blood work came back. It is called Euthyroid Sickness and it is common with Lyme. He also prescribed Cortef (steroid) for adrenals but I can't take it. I was consulting with Dr R from Calgary but spending over $1000 a month for supplements was getting to be too much. Every time I talked to her, she would tell me to take 2 or 3 more. So far, I like not being overwhelmed with supplements. I am leery about the mold treatment since I get so many side effects from prescription drugs. I also saw a private doctor who pushed the supplements he sold, so I am enjoying not having supplements pushed at me.
Posted 11/14/2014 8:34 PM (GMT 0)
Dmw, the small amount of steroid in Cortef won't hurt your immune system much and will help your adrenals a lot! Although if you wished, you could use a natural medicine for your adrenals too - I use Standard Process "Adrenal desiccated". I take a large amount because I went into Addison's disease and we had to stop them from shutting down, but they are all natural, and not terribly expensive - unless you take a bunch like I have to right now.

And with your thyroid, there is also a time when the thyroid will go from being hypo to hyper, back and forth like that when it's really struggling - although I can't remember if it's when it's struggling with the hypo or hyper situation. Please look further into this.
Posted 11/14/2014 10:03 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks for the info, Traveler. I looked up the Adrenal supplement you mentioned......I like the price. I will run this by Dr C on Mon. The Cortef was a very small amount, 5 mg twice a day, but it gave me acid reflux which made my asthma flare up, which I haven't had in quite a few years. I only took it for a couple days but I felt terrible. I tried again the other day, but the same results. I developed severe acid reflux four years ago and I think it was from a steroid. It took over 6 months to get it under control. I couldn't even drink water without having reflux. It was a nightmare, so steroids scare me.
Posted 11/14/2014 10:08 PM (GMT 0)
Well, not such a bad thing considering you have Lyme! I hope this can be a good fit for you, I know that it's helped me tremendously. It's not supportive herbs, but actual adrenal gland -so be aware of any allergies you may have.

Hopefully it will work as well for you as it has for me though!
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