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First major scare for me. Any precedents?

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Posted 4/9/2017 1:37 PM (GMT 0)
Yesterday I began feeling an ache in my kidneys and a warm feeling in my limbs similar to the adrenaline dump I'd get after being chased by dogs on bike rides. As I was tucking into bed last night, the upstairs neighbors were being noisy again and I cursed at the ceiling. At that point I began shaking uncontrollably, mostly in my lower limbs.

Then it dawned on me that my kidney ache must have been my adrenals, which are located right above the kidneys. I also realized that since starting Doxy three weeks ago I haven't taken any magnesium because I worry about it binding with the drug. Adrenals apparently need a lot of mag.

I took an Epson bath and took both oral and transdermal mag, and felt a bit better but still shaking. What put the shaking down (for a couple of hours, anyway) was knocking out some sets of pushups and squats, which felt surprisingly easy. That proved my muscles were working just fine.

I slept a few hours but the shaking is back this morning and the heart rate is up again. I'm being treated for early Lyme but wonder if this is some kind of herx, or maybe my body just got sick of the Doxy and Nystatin. Trying to talk to a physician today. Chime in if you'd like. Thanks.
Posted 4/9/2017 1:47 PM (GMT 0)
Sounds like you have too much adrenaline neurotransmitter hormone…

Light exercise is probably OK for now but the detox soaks are probably better - try adding sea salt and hydrogen peroxide and titrate up the amounts of all 3, as well as the temperature (but never hot). There is a good mag product called CALM and might help you at bedtime. You don't want to stay at this heightened stress state.

BTW - are you taking anything to help support kidneys/liver process abx? Something like milk thistle seed or burdock root? Mine require both but they do wonders at helping process.

-p
Posted 4/9/2017 1:56 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks. I do have CALM and also transdermal mag oil. For detox I do take Milk Thistle, as well as Alka Seltzer Gold and lemon water along with the skin brushing and baths. Yesterday was my first full detox day. (Perhaps there's an "Ah-ha" in there.)

I already had overactive adrenals even before the Lyme diagnosis, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised. I just wonder if I should take a day off everything. I can't reach my LLMD (ND) today.
Posted 4/9/2017 2:22 PM (GMT 0)
You're doing great with detox. And yes, the full detox day could have triggered it, too. Wouldn't be a bad thing to take a little break from treatment but you still need some adrenal support to help rebalance cortisol and the other hormones/chemicals. Figuring out what your unique balance is can be a bit of a puzzle but pretty important. It's like a car engine idle being set too high.

Now that you mention that your adrenals were in overdrive already, I suggest NOT working out. It just drains them further. I'd go the de-stressing route. Slow down your body but specifically your mind. Find ways to disconnect and power down your brain. Do you meditate? There are great breathing tutorials on youtube that help power down. You have to kind of force it - won't happen naturally.

I learned through DNA testing that I have mutations that create a neurotransmitter imbalance, which is one reason why my adrenals are always stressed. There are likely other contributing factors like an untreated high viral load and GI trouble for most of my life. All those systems work interchangeably. Before I got dx and started Lyme & Co (herbs and abx) tx and understood adrenal exhaustion's role in my struggles I had 3 major (forced to quit-my-job) crashes over about a decade. When it gets that bad, your life stops and the only way to recover is to literally be immobile and when you step out of your life, it also forces your brain to slow down. So it's a forced de-stressing process and it's tough and has many repercussions ($) but it's the only way to recover. There are no meds and supplements are not a panacea. I finally learned my lesson.

You're somewhat lucky in that your adrenals speak to you with the aches - listen to the li'l guys!

-p

Post Edited (Pirouette) : 4/9/2017 9:06:55 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 4/9/2017 2:48 PM (GMT 0)
I do agree that it likely had something to do with the full detox day, and that you should be careful to not keep your adrenals "operating at high capacity". My adrenals did that and I wasn't aware of what was going on for sure and couldn't find a doctor that would even consider this, so they crashed - now I'm dealing with severely low adrenals, and that's a real pain!

Do get a hold of your LLND and speak to them about this. They should be more open to this condition than MD's, and she should have you start something to better control your adrenals. Maybe Holy Basil, ashwagandha or something similar.

And I agree with P - listen to those little guys!!!!
Posted 4/9/2017 3:06 PM (GMT 0)
Balance is the key.

You just started jk a week ago and it could be a herx. You over did the detoxing all in a day and that can make the toxins come out faster than your body can handle.

Today needs to be a rest day. Cut back on EVERYTHING. Let your body catch up with itself.

Lemon water is essential so don't stop that. Have some steamed vegetables and drink some bone broth. Tulsi (holy basil) tea is good and is generally naturally decaffeinated, but check the labels.

You do not need caffeine right now so lay off that and lay off sugar which can spike your adrenals also.

Here are some good breathing/relaxing techniques: I love the Qi Gong for the morning and the 4-7-8 for the evening/going to bed.

/www.youtube.com/watch?v=gz4G31LGyog

/www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNgWb3EDXCI&t=16s
Posted 4/9/2017 3:33 PM (GMT 0)
PeteZa--Thanks for the good info. Wondering if I should take a day off the abx, too, or at least my morning dose. And I do wonder if that is what clocked me (The ND who originally got me on abx warned of the possible effects of over-treatment. He put me on three weeks of Doxy only. Maybe he was right, but I'd be scared to cut short my current protocol.)
Posted 4/9/2017 3:38 PM (GMT 0)
It won't hurt to stop one dose. You really need to get your body calmed down.

Being that jacked up can do more harm than what you are trying to kill with the doxy.
Posted 4/9/2017 3:41 PM (GMT 0)
You do need to be aware that 3 weeks of Doxy won't heal the infection- that's far from "Over treatment". I hope that there are plans to continue treatment after that, or another abx will be added in soon.

ILADS has proven that a minimum of 4 weeks of Doxy at 400 mgs a day is what it takes to treat even the earliest of infections.
Posted 4/9/2017 3:53 PM (GMT 0)
Traveler--Yes, my current protocol with a LL naturopath calls for an additional month at 400 a day plus Nystatin and herbal stuff for cysts and biofilm. Discovering this forum is what sent me to a Lyme specialist, otherwise I would have just wrapped up my original protocol. So I'm doing six weeks total, though that will likely be longer now because of the symptoms I've had this week.

I thought treating it this early (rash only, no symptoms) would be straightforward. Boy was I wrong. All the discomfort I've felt has been since treatment STARTED. I felt perfectly normal before that, which is why this is so surreal.
Posted 4/9/2017 4:31 PM (GMT 0)
You made those spirochetes mad by trying to kill them. LOL!

They are running in circles trying to find a place that is weak and vulnerable in you so they can hide. They are hoping you will just think, "oh that ache is from a long time ago, it can't be lyme." Sneaky lil buggers.
Posted 4/9/2017 4:34 PM (GMT 0)
If only profanity could also be used as an antibiotic. This thing would be over in ten minutes.
Posted 4/9/2017 4:40 PM (GMT 0)

Roberts89 said...
If only profanity could also be used as an antibiotic. This thing would be over in ten minutes.

Oh yeah!! You should have heard the blue streak I had for those bacteria when I got reinfected!!!
Posted 4/9/2017 6:07 PM (GMT 0)
Roberts89, you have my full empathy! This sort of thing has been plaguing me more and more the past 4-5 months, even though I've been infected for decades.

Traveler, do you think that "too much adrenaline neurotransmitter hormone… " might be my problem too?

Mentally I feel fine at the moment, but I am shaking so badly I can barely type.
Posted 4/9/2017 6:54 PM (GMT 0)
When I had my coristol tested - they also tested my adrenaline, noradrenaline and dopamine.
This was when I thought I was having adrenaline rushes.

I remember having blood test and a 24 hour urine collection test done.

My cortisol was high in the 24 hour test...

My adrenaline, noradrenaline, dopamine were all good.
But, I don't think those tests are very accurate.

july - can you get testing without costing you anything...or costing you much? If so, it might be worth it...it could show something...
Posted 4/9/2017 7:06 PM (GMT 0)
Where, Girlie? And which test?
Posted 4/9/2017 7:08 PM (GMT 0)

julymorning said...
Where, Girlie? And which test?

Just at a regular lab - My non-lyme Dr. ordered it when we were trying to sleuth out what the heck was wrong with me...this was in 2013.

I don't know how it works there - how lab tests work - if you have to pay out of pocket - if your Dr. gives you a req?

Just tell your Dr. you're having what feels like adrenaline rushes all day long.
Posted 4/9/2017 7:09 PM (GMT 0)
You can also get testing done through ZRT Labs - saliva ...but that one will cost you a few hundred dollars.

I haven't priced them all out with ZRT - but I know it will be at least a few hundred for several tests.
Posted 4/9/2017 7:20 PM (GMT 0)
Yeah, see, I asked about having my adrenals tested when I had to see that neurologist who is in cahoots with my pcp. She looked at me and asked why on earth I wanted something like that done, it didn't have anything to do with the reason I was there, and I tried to explain and got nowhere. She said "I don't think we do that kind of testing here, you would have to go see and endoc. Which, from my searching, are too far away from this area.

So the saliva test can tell you if you are producing too much adrenaline neurotransmitter hormone?

No, I don't have a few hundred dollars, especially now, which is close to the figure I saw when I looked up the cost for that on line site, when I thought I had adrenal fatigue early Winter.

I thought maybe neurotransmitter hormones could be related to something a neurologist might be able to check.
Posted 4/9/2017 7:35 PM (GMT 0)
Yes - ZRT has Neurotransmitter testing.

- a Neurologist could check it...but really any Dr. should have the ability to test for it.

My Dr. just wrote it on the bottom of a regular Lab req. (since it's not one of the more 'common' tests)

If a specialist requested it for you - would it be covered then...or would it still cost you a few hundred bucks?

My Dr. tested it when she tested my cortisol.

In the end - my cortisol test came back high...and then my Dr. wanted to see if I had a tumor on my adrenal glands...and sent me for a scan...along with a referral to the endocrinologist...and another blood test.

Kudos to my Dr. ... for not ignoring these things though.

My cortisol went to normal range...on a retest a few months later...
Posted 4/9/2017 7:42 PM (GMT 0)
If any Dr. that I am sent to is willing to test for something, they submit the request with the medical reason why they want it done, and if it's approved by Medicaid, it's covered, except for maybe $2 or $3 that I would pay.

So far every test request that has been submitted has been approved and I've had it done, so I have no idea on this one but I must get a Dr. that I have history with to make the request.

The only thing that apparently wasn't approved by Medicaid was the portable air concentrator.
Posted 4/9/2017 7:51 PM (GMT 0)
Okay - I see. That sucks - that the Insurance companies can decide what's necessary...and not the Dr.'s.
Posted 4/9/2017 8:05 PM (GMT 0)
july - I should add that the only thing that showed was my high cortisol and no treatment to address that.

My Dr. said that the high cortisol was my body's response to the high level of pain I had gone through at the time (my initial lyme symptom)

- no treatment prescribed in my case - after a few more tests/scans to rule out what can cause high cortisol.

...and the my cortisol normalized a few months later.
Posted 4/9/2017 8:29 PM (GMT 0)

Girlie said...
Okay - I see. That sucks - that the Insurance companies can decide what's necessary...and not the Dr.'s.

Absolutely... I've said so before and that is exactly why we are all having so many problems getting Lyme & co., treatments covered. They do refer to their 'select' medical boards for their decisions, and with Lyme, for example, it was IDSA. I'm sure on any given day you might find pairs of insurance company ceo's on the golf course with some medical board 'sell-out'.

It's a business, and they want to be as cost efficient as they can, to keep profit margins up.
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