HealingWell
Search Close Search
☰

Having a tough time with Moderna vax #2, ten days later

Support Forums
>
Lyme Disease
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply
1 23
❬ ❬ Previous Thread |Next Thread ❭ ❭
Posted 9/24/2021 3:38 PM (GMT 0)

Mark F said...
I found it online. The 19 min mark is how to counter act the damage.

https://www.resistancechicks.com/natural-living/must-watch-doc-ardis-hope-for-vax-and-un-vax/

I'll check this out tonight.
Posted 9/24/2021 7:33 PM (GMT 0)
Hi astroman,

Just happy to see you posting again. I hope you get back to where you were feeling before you got the shots.

I watched part of the video (thanks Mark F.) and the doctor says to take a lot of Vitamin C (darn, I take 1000 mg a day), I think he said 10,000 which I couldn't handle (I would be in the bathroom 24 hours a day). He also states to take magnesium (I have been taking that for a long time) and selenium. He explains what each element does for people who are not vaxxed and for those who are. Maybe if I take less magnesium citrate then I could handle more Vitamin C. I would have to experiment.

Please keep us updated okay?
Denise
Posted 9/24/2021 7:51 PM (GMT 0)
@ astroman Your experience and posting helps us all, and thanks for that, sorry your symptoms have come back with the second jab, but it is all too familiar to have a flare-up and be bedridden/almost bedridden by normal exertion sometimes. That's for some of us, feeling sore after slightest movement and exercise if we are lucky to start exercising again...I was exercising and very careful with diet, then wasn't and starting not feeling well...and hearing this I am preparing for my second J&J booster soon, and trying to keep things on hand like Claritin (antihistamine H1 blocker) and vitamin C along with some adaptogens like Siberian Ginseng Root powder (Eleuthero..part of Buhner's protocol)...but they are saying the second vaccination booster (J&J numbers) creates a 94% something or other rate...some of us already feel like "long haulers" already...

Post Edited (borrelioburgdorferii) : 9/24/2021 3:31:28 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 9/25/2021 12:18 AM (GMT 0)
Astroman, good to hear you've seen some improvements. I have been praying for you.

10LymeB and Mark F, thanks for those very informative links. I've bookmarked the blog and downloaded the video.

Deejavu, the doctor did say 10g of Vitamin C, but he said to work your way up slowly, backing off when necessary. Diarrhea is to be avoided, since it wastes nutrients. It might help to switch your magnesium to a more absorbable form, such as glycinate. I can take up to 1200mg a day before I see any laxative effect.
Posted 9/25/2021 12:40 AM (GMT 0)

Deejavu said...
Hi astroman,

Just happy to see you posting again. I hope you get back to where you were feeling before you got the shots.

I watched part of the video (thanks Mark F.) and the doctor says to take a lot of Vitamin C (darn, I take 1000 mg a day), I think he said 10,000 which I couldn't handle (I would be in the bathroom 24 hours a day). He also states to take magnesium (I have been taking that for a long time) and selenium. He explains what each element does for people who are not vaxxed and for those who are. Maybe if I take less magnesium citrate then I could handle more Vitamin C. I would have to experiment.

Please keep us updated okay?
Denise


10 gm is a lot. I only do 4gm regularly which is the min on the protocol I’m on. I take the the sodium version or it would rip my stomach up.

https:// https://www.bronsonvitamins.com/vitamin-c-non-acidic-sodium-ascorbate-1000-mg-250-tablets.html

I’ve been trying to up with buffered but liposomal is the best but $$.

It took about a month to get to 4 grams.
Posted 9/25/2021 9:53 AM (GMT 0)
astro - not much i can add to assist - just an observation

the type of flare of symptoms you describe sound very similar to my own recent flare which occurred 2 days after visiting my brother - who's daughter turned out to have COVID.

have no way of knowing whether its connected - but after careful review i cannot find many other possible causes - the only other plausible one is some kind of immune flare due to taking astragalus - which i had been doing for around 4 weeks prior to the flare in low doses only as a trial - but if so there was a long delay of 4 weeks till flare symptoms and the flare was sudden and quite severe - esp. sleep disturbance for a few nights around 1 week. some mild sore throat and occasional sneezing too which doesnt seem to fit astragalus too well.

its the biggest flare i have had in around 2years - and had been making good progress
main symptoms -
-increased fatigue ( daily walking notably slower and getting less done)
-all over pain - feels neurological ( all over aching, tingling, burning, discomfort - worse at night )
-increased soreness / stiff ness after doing anything physical / excercise
-increased sleep disturbance - hardly slept at all for 2 nights
-increased headaches - and sensitivity to noise

BTW - these are all things i had to some degree before - but have just been ramped up by something

if it is COVID - not sure what i can do to shake it off / reduce the reactions -
- was already taking ivermectin in prophylactic doses - so have continued
- am still taking all the Buhner herbs - many of which are the same for covid / long covid
- was already taking 3g of vit C per day - continued
- was already taking vit D 4000iu per day - continued

its not awful - and i have bounced back a bit since the worst of the flare around 2 weeks ago - but seem a bit stuck at this point - frustrating as it has set me back around 3 months in my overall recovery - back to how i was in june / july time -
Posted 9/26/2021 10:44 AM (GMT 0)
FYI for anyone that may be following this thread and considering vaccination:

According to Dr. Marty Makary, he said research shows 3.5 times better immunity with Pfizer, if you wait three MONTHS (not three weeks) between the first and second dose. That's the schedule he followed for himself.

Dr. Makary also mentions trial data for a second dose of the J&J vaccine being given at six months and being twice as effective as second doses given at two months.

https://youtu.be/xs6osadejlk?t=1414

Of course, do your own research and discuss with your own doctor.

astroman: I hope you're feeling back to normal, by the time you read this.
Posted 9/26/2021 11:29 AM (GMT 0)

The Dude Abides said...
FYI for anyone that may be following this thread and considering vaccination:

According to Dr. Marty Makary, he said research shows 3.5 times better immunity with Pfizer, if you wait three MONTHS (not three weeks) between the first and second dose. That's the schedule he followed for himself.

Dr. Makary also mentions trial data for a second dose of the J&J vaccine being given at six months and being twice as effective as second doses given at two months.

https://youtu.be/xs6osadejlk?t=1414

Of course, do your own research and discuss with your own doctor.

astroman: I hope you're feeling back to normal, by the time you read this.

So..according to this ...6 months interval (longer than 3 weeks or 3 months) gives possibly greater immunity.

It's so hard to know with all the politically-biased opinions in the mix! Some commenters are either uninformed or misinformed or lack basic scientific knowledge, I include myself in this! lol


2 top LLMD's say "get the vaccine" something to the effect that it is the best we got to battle the worst of outcomes--and that it is why I got the J&J.
Posted 9/26/2021 12:09 PM (GMT 0)

borrelioburgdorferii said...
So..according to this ...6 months interval (longer than 3 weeks or 3 months) gives possibly greater immunity.

That timeline was specific to the J&J vaccine, according to Dr. Makary.

borrelioburgdorferii said...
It's so hard to know with all the politically-biased opinions in the mix! Some commenters are either uninformed or misinformed or lack basic scientific knowledge, I include myself in this! lol

I share your concerns, for sure. I'm also a layperson having to rely on what others report. Doctors are nurses are people, too, and can get confused, misled, blinded, and emotionally charged about things, just like the rest of us.

borrelioburgdorferii said...
2 top LLMD's say "get the vaccine" something to the effect that it is the best we got to battle the worst of outcomes--and that it is why I got the J&J.

I'm concerned about sweeping statements advising people to get a vaccine, not get a vaccine, how many to get, how long in between them, etc. Not everyone has the same health profile nor do they share the same medical history, age, race, genetics, and so forth. This is where having an established relationship with a well-informed doctor who knows our specific health history becomes important, as they would be able to give specific guidance. But, most of us don't have such healthcare providers or such relationships, these days.

Lastly, I wonder about doctors that advise their patients not to get any of the vaccines. I wonder what happens if the patient becomes sick and ends up going into ICU and even possibly (God forbid) dying. Will the doctor be held responsible for that death? It's a rhetorical question that I've pondered. Ultimately, it's up to people to do their own investigation and decide what's best for them. Hopefully, people are using reliable sources of information.
Posted 9/26/2021 12:52 PM (GMT 0)

Garzie said...

the type of flare of symptoms you describe sound very similar to my own recent flare which occurred 2 days after visiting my brother - who's daughter turned out to have COVID.

its the biggest flare i have had in around 2years - and had been making good progress
main symptoms -
-increased fatigue ( daily walking notably slower and getting less done)
-all over pain - feels neurological ( all over aching, tingling, burning, discomfort - worse at night )
-increased soreness / stiff ness after doing anything physical / excercise
-increased sleep disturbance - hardly slept at all for 2 nights
-increased headaches - and sensitivity to noise

Garzie,
Those symptoms sound a lot like how mold exposure affects me. When you visited your brother, did you leave your home and stay overnight somewhere or spend time in your brother’s house? If so, you could be flaring from seen or unseen mold exposure.
Posted 9/26/2021 5:06 PM (GMT 0)

WalkingbyFaith said...

Garzie said...

the type of flare of symptoms you describe sound very similar to my own recent flare which occurred 2 days after visiting my brother - who's daughter turned out to have COVID.

its the biggest flare i have had in around 2years - and had been making good progress
main symptoms -
-increased fatigue ( daily walking notably slower and getting less done)
-all over pain - feels neurological ( all over aching, tingling, burning, discomfort - worse at night )
-increased soreness / stiff ness after doing anything physical / excercise
-increased sleep disturbance - hardly slept at all for 2 nights
-increased headaches - and sensitivity to noise

Garzie,
Those symptoms sound a lot like how mold exposure affects me. When you visited your brother, did you leave your home and stay overnight somewhere or spend time in your brother’s house? If so, you could be flaring from seen or unseen mold exposure.

Hey WBF - thanks for this - but no - actually i was only there a few hours - and spent 99% of that time in the garden - only popping indoors for a minute to use the bathroom - have been visiting like this for a while

the mold topic bothers me as it seem really hard to rule out completely - but we have discussed it before and it doesn't seem to fit well
-my partner and i both became ill suddenly while on a short break in the UK away from home
-we were staying in a nice high end accommodation - no sign of any issues
-the area was one of the areas associated with lyme back then - the whole of teh UK is recognised now as medium high risk
-we had both been fit energetic people before then - and just never recovered
-my partner had severe radiculitis in one arm then the other ( a common lyme / maybe bart symptom) - 6month prior - and a kidney infection before that - which we think was the start - so we don't know how the sudden illness for both of us 6montsh on fits

the current house - which we have lived in since before getting ill - and my partner for 3 years before that is brick built - below 50% RH year round and no sign of any significant leaks anywhere - i have been in the loft and had kitchen and bathroom units out and not found anything at all suspicious

also - i dont react to mouldy stuff - like old carboard gone moldy with powdery black growths on it - or garden waste rotting - or mouldy leaflitter - nothing like that seems to affect me - and my level of illness is typically the same all the time -unless i do something to aggravate it - like taking a new herb or doing too much exercise - its not going up or down with the weather / when it rains

so i know the symptoms do look similar - and it keeps coming up - but as far as i can see mold looks unlikely - unless possibly - and i say possibly because its a real can of worms - "mold colonisation"
i know some may shoot me for saying it - but i just haven't been able to find any compelling studies that show colonization of humans internally with these super toxic moulds is an actual thing.

i think perhaps Bart gives such similar symptoms that it could explain the pattern
Posted 9/26/2021 5:54 PM (GMT 0)
Garzie,

Your last sentence was what I was wondering when I read your comments. Do you feel like those symptoms are bartonella for you?

In the beginning of my journey, I felt like Lyme/co was the beginning of my mystery illness and that my mold/fungal hypersensitivity was probably caused by Lyme or bartonella messing up my immune system, gut, and detox abilities. So much I will never know.
Posted 9/26/2021 5:59 PM (GMT 0)
astroman, Ive forgottem how to PM.

Could you PM me?

I have questions about reducing thyroid med.
Posted 9/26/2021 6:13 PM (GMT 0)

WalkingbyFaith said...
Garzie,

Your last sentence was what I was wondering when I read your comments. Do you feel like those symptoms are bartonella for you?

In the beginning of my journey, I felt like Lyme/co was the beginning of my mystery illness and that my mold/fungal hypersensitivity was probably caused by Lyme or bartonella messing up my immune system, gut, and detox abilities. So much I will never know.

yep - thats my current hypothesis - i have a positive lyme test from Armin labs
but i have lots of symptoms that seem to be more Bart than lyme - and very slow response to antibiotics more typical of bart than lyme.
also suspect our trouble started after being bitten by around a dozen horseflies while walking ( both my partner and i ) - but this was 6month before sudden illness and maybe just felt a bit more fatigue in that time thought i was just working to hard - which was true also - however in that time my partner has all of the above radiculitis and kidney infection - we did not suspect possible connection with the horseflies until later.

there are 2 documented cases of lyme and bulls-eye-rash from horse flies in the medical literature - but its comparatively rare - however its certainly a direct route for bart - maybe brucella or q-fever also - and who knows what else

the only way i see mold being a likely/possible issue is if the colonisation thing is real - as i cannot see any possible exposure here in the house - and i'm just not sure there is any evidence that that happens.
my partner has also recovered while living in the same house - so i think that would indicate whatever it is is not here. if you follow my reasoning

apologies to astroman - for the thread drift

hope you are bouncing back now astro!
Posted 9/26/2021 8:28 PM (GMT 0)

The Dude Abides said...
FYI for anyone that may be following this thread and considering vaccination:

According to Dr. Marty Makary, he said research shows 3.5 times better immunity with Pfizer, if you wait three MONTHS (not three weeks) between the first and second dose. That's the schedule he followed for himself.

Dr. Makary also mentions trial data for a second dose of the J&J vaccine being given at six months and being twice as effective as second doses given at two months.

https://youtu.be/xs6osadejlk?t=1414

Of course, do your own research and discuss with your own doctor.

astroman: I hope you're feeling back to normal, by the time you read this.

I have heard of this theory. I know the UK and Canada decided to wait 12 weeks between 1st and 2nd doses as to attempt to get the 1st dose to as many people as possible. The thought was it would save lives in the near-term. It'll be interesting to compare their long term immunity with the U.S. and Israel. I waited 6 weeks between my first and second doses. I did this because I was feeling deeply unwell with all the Lyme garbage at the time and was somewhat afraid of what would happen to my symptoms after another dose. Turns out nothing happened in regards to my Lyme related issues, but I wonder if my immunity would be longer lasting than those who had 3 weeks in between doses (Pfizer)?
Posted 9/26/2021 9:50 PM (GMT 0)
Astroman,
It’s been a week since you first posted. Any changes? What, if anything, have you started doing to counteract this?
Posted 9/27/2021 2:43 PM (GMT 0)

WalkingbyFaith said...
Astroman,
It’s been a week since you first posted. Any changes? What, if anything, have you started doing to counteract this?

I posted 9-24, just last friday. Same as that update. Better, not normal though.
Posted 9/27/2021 5:23 PM (GMT 0)
astroman - Sorry I'm not any help here but wanted to let you know my thoughts are with you on this. I have not had the COVID shot(s) yet because I have so much going on already, the concern for what it will do is holding me back. In the meantime, I am very careful about being in crowds. In fact, my daughter and I have tickets to see Mickey Dolenz and Mike Nesmith in les than two weeks, but I may have to miss it because of situation.

Knowing how far you have come, just hoping this is temporary and you get back on track. Also, I thought of you as I was supposed to announce a large bike race in Dalonegha, GA yesterday but couldn't because it was a 13 hour day, which I can't handle right now.
Posted 9/27/2021 6:14 PM (GMT 0)
Went to a very thyroid knowledgeable Dr this morning, who also has interest in the covid vax reactions.

The Dr was thinking I might have had a Hashimoto autoimmune flare from this, since I suddenly could not handle my normal thyroid dose after the vax and feel better with roughly 25% less. So I got a full thyroid panel blood draw with antibodies tested too and will compare that to pre-vax baseline thyroid data from two months ago. Drs passed along a website / poll for covid vaccination symptoms/reactions.

Did not sleep very deep last night and not for very long either.........so I should be tired. Im no longer wired, but my lowered thyroid med dose may still be temporarily too high (I guessed by feel) and that's why im not tired when I should be.

After googling "thyroid flare from covid vaccination", some info comes up on this possibility...here's one link- https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33858208/

thanks everyone

Post Edited (astroman) : 9/27/2021 12:54:14 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 9/27/2021 7:51 PM (GMT 0)
Good Stuff. I'm very interested in this subject and unsubscribed by mistake
Posted 9/27/2021 8:18 PM (GMT 0)
My husband takes thyroid meds and is also diabetic.

Since the vax - he’s noticed his thyroid doesn’t seem to be working as well - hasn’t tested it yet tho.

He also has had a weird thing on one of his fingers - the skin on one of the knuckles is tough and he uses Nail clippers to clip it off.
several weeks after the vax he noticed his knuckle is smooth and looks “normal”

So - one issue has improved but one seems to have worsened.

He had pfizer
Posted 9/28/2021 4:27 PM (GMT 0)
Are you on levo. astroman?

Will you be able to ask for a follow up test to find out if levels are ok?

I've wanted to reduce my dose but would have to admit it to MD .

Sorry since this is off topic from the vaxx.
Posted 9/28/2021 4:33 PM (GMT 0)
my thyroid is also inflamed and tender to touch since my flare started - had been quite well behaved / stable until then.
Posted 9/28/2021 4:49 PM (GMT 0)

Korissa said...
Are you on levo. astroman?

Will you be able to ask for a follow up test to find out if levels are ok?

I've wanted to reduce my dose but would have to admit it to MD .

Sorry since this is off topic from the vaxx.

I PM/e-mailed you per your asking the other day.

they electronically send lab results to me.

Levo did not do much for me, i,ve tried nearly all thyroid med avail in the last 25 years which many are no longer available, they were many more in the past. Levo and all other synthetic T4 meds did not do much for my symptoms.

Ive used 7 brands of natural pig thyroid in the last 12-14 years, yes...7, and many are no longer made. But they were all very similar despite different fillers used, which is the difference among them. They dont offer exact dose, so you create the dose needed with the few sizes they have and then spliting them. Its like making a whole dollar out of a pocket of change..That said, I can make whatever dose I feel like using.... provided I dont runout since the Rx is only for a specified # of tablets. I also always have spare bottles in case there is a shortage (that happens). Good Rx does not keep tract of how many you had/have like health insurance Rx coverage does. But they refuse to cover my pig thyroid, so I pay 100% out of pocket and use Good Rx at 50% off retail price. I cannot function on synthetic T4 thyroid med, if that is someday the only option I will need to go on hand made pharma pig thyroid capsules...or go on disability, not joking.

Pig thyroid can also be taken sublingual pretty close to your last meal and it will still absorb. T3 cannot bind to any protein like T4 can. But, most T4 absorption issues / binding with protein occur in the digestive tract, not you blood stream or oral capillaries. I have lab tested this theory myself, with out the Dr knowing what answers I was truly after. They don't like it when you outsmart them , or prove them wrong lol.
Posted 10/2/2021 3:20 AM (GMT 0)

The Dude Abides said...
FYI for anyone that may be following this thread and considering vaccination:

According to Dr. Marty Makary, he said research shows 3.5 times better immunity with Pfizer, if you wait three MONTHS (not three weeks) between the first and second dose. That's the schedule he followed for himself.

Dr. Makary also mentions trial data for a second dose of the J&J vaccine being given at six months and being twice as effective as second doses given at two months.

https://youtu.be/xs6osadejlk?t=1414

Of course, do your own research and discuss with your own doctor.

astroman: I hope you're feeling back to normal, by the time you read this.

Lymie24 said...
I have heard of this theory. I know the UK and Canada decided to wait 12 weeks between 1st and 2nd doses as to attempt to get the 1st dose to as many people as possible. The thought was it would save lives in the near-term. It'll be interesting to compare their long term immunity with the U.S. and Israel. I waited 6 weeks between my first and second doses. I did this because I was feeling deeply unwell with all the Lyme garbage at the time and was somewhat afraid of what would happen to my symptoms after another dose. Turns out nothing happened in regards to my Lyme related issues, but I wonder if my immunity would be longer lasting than those who had 3 weeks in between doses (Pfizer)?

I'd be willing to bet your immunity would be longer lasting than those who had only three weeks between their Pfizer doses. Like you, I'll be interested to hear the findings. Thanks for taking the time to read my comment and respond.
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply
123