Question about Buhner's protocol and Traveler's Chronic Tonic

I can't comment on what's most effective. Buhner would know, I guess. Any word on why exactly that is? I'm curious.

As for the tonic, I believe Traveler said she just made it into tea, at least for a portion of her time on it (I feel like I've seen her mention making some tinctures, not sure if it was Chronic Tonic though). Boil 4 cups of water, put a certain amount of the mixed herbs in there, steep for 20 minutes or so, then drink a cup every few hours, like you would other medicines.

If you were to make tinctures, yeah, that'd complicate things a little bit as far as dosages.

But, she should be by with the specifics and to help you figure that math out, so I'll just leave you here.

Hope it works for you, Kim! It's quite the combination of herbs.

Buhner is no longer recommending capsules and his new Lyme book that's due out next month will include his latest greatest protocol which includes a shift from Cat's Claw to a Gou Teng tincture (a different strain of Cat's Claw).

This is per Julie McIntyre, Buhner's associate, as relayed to another mod on here, Mister Mike.

Still, it's clear that his older protocol is still effective as evidenced by vtspringer's experience (congrats, vtspringer - I'm so happy you're getting relief...and am amazed that you were able to start with 3 caps 3X daily :)

Each of Buhner's books includes a Materica Medica that lists how each herb should be prepared. His "Herbal Antibiotics" book (Kindle edition available on Amazon for $ 2.51) provides explicit instructions for the various methods of herbal preparations.

I just started making tinctures quite recently and very much regret not starting to do so sooner.

Admittedly, I was overwhelmed at the thought - brain fog detracted from my confidence in being able to figure out how to do it.

Many folks on here use the folk method for tincture preparation. I'm following the method used by the companies that make tinctures as outlined in Buhner's book.

This involves a certain ratio of herbs to liquid (which is comprised of certain percentages of alcohol and water)....and grinding the herbs to a powder.

The folk method requires 6 wks. of maceration since whole herbs are used. The way I'm doing it requires only 2 wks.

Buhner says that tinctures are the most potent form of plant medicine. After over a year of treatment, I want potent lol

PS I'll let Traveler know about the links - thanks for letting us know.

I'm pretty much a "by-the-book" type of person and decided to make tinctures exactly as Buhner recommends - with grain alcohol.

Some people do use vodka but, according to Buhner, this might limit the number of plant constituents that are extracted during the tincturing process.

Still, it seems some people are finding the folk method effective (basically just filling a bottle half full with whole herbs and then filling the bottle to the top with vodka and letting the stuff macerate for 6 wks. before straining/decanting)

Being that almost all corn is GMO, I bought organic grain alcohol here:

organicalcohol.com/store/

And, after extensive online research for lowest price, I bought my tincture bottles here:

www.glassbottleoutlet.com/

Mountain Rose Herbs (one of Buhner's recommended sources for herbs and they only sell organic stuff) also sells tincture-making supplies but their prices for the bottles are quite higher.

Rikky1 said...
i was using Buhner's old protocol for a bit (cryptolepis, sida acuta and alchornea) and what I can definitely say is the alchornea gave me diarrhea and a stomach ache so i had to discontinue. still using crypto and sida actua and i think its helping but it by no means has eradicated my babesia symptoms after 45 days.

Buhner's old protocol might have been effective back in 2005 when he authored his first Lyme book....and still might be effective for some.

However, his new protocol includes many more herbs which is a reflection of the large number of Babesia strains that have since been discovered....and continue to be discovered every few months.

I don't think there's any protocol out there that can eradicate symptoms within 45 days. These infections are just too complex.

And, true healing can't occur without rebuilding our immune systems. Otherwise, we're ripe for another infection.

Traveler uses Everclear grain alcohol that is usually sold in liquor stores unless state regulations prohibit it.

The company I used for organic grain alcohol will sell anywhere from 1-5 gallons one time. After that, you have to apply for a permit with an application approval process that can take up to 30 days. When you factor in shipping, it's pretty expensive but, still much cheaper than buying the tinctures ready-made.

I, too, started Buhner's old Lyme protocol but read the tidbits of his new one on here and slowly transitioned to it.

And, I'm totally with you, Kim, about drinking a medicinal tea - I'd be gagging lol

Best of luck to you with whatever you decide!

Can someone tell me where I can find Buhner's new protocol? I donated to his new book, so I will get a copy, but I would like to find out ASAP so that I can start on that protocol. Cowden didn't work for me.

Thanks.

Traveler, I did also find your threads that described the herbs you used and how you prepared them. I just don't see me being able to drink down 4 cups (plus the additional Houttanyia (sp) tea) everyday.

I'm like the most finicky eater in the world and it starts with smell. Right now I'm having everything I can so to drink down the water with Nystatin. It's like drinking a rancid mud puddle. I know it will make me better and as bad off as I am, I don't seem to be able to override the part of me that refuses to eat/drink something that my brain says "this tastes terrible". I really would rather starve.

When I had a colonoscopy, I cried and gagged for 2 hours to get down the required drink. Thank heaven everything was fine and I don't have to do that again. But I can't see repeating that everyday 4x a day.

I do however plan to give the CT a try. But I'm an engineer so I need alternative plans for everything. It's why I'm looking into these protocols. The LLMD I saw is canceling new patient appointments due to her own health and since i only met her once and we never came up with a treatment plan because my life has been in such an upheaval. I'm also rethinking abx because my Rheumatologist sees all scripts I get filled because they tap into the state database. I'm concerned if he sees scripts for abx (and related) he may drop me. Since I'm going to pay out of pocket for everything, I'd rather not have to fight with him to keep treating my "fibromyalgia" symptoms while I'm trying to attack Lyme and Co.

P.S. I know I can email you, but your plate is already full and I thought this discussion might be helpful to others. I can't be the only person who has trouble get teas/decotions down.

rowingmom, your post leads me to question which is the best form of herbs is best. You've been successful with some powdered and others tinctured. Is there something published that discusses which is the best form? I was looking in Buhner's books and at least in the abx book he give the different preps but I don't remember if he says which he prefers.

I do have to say that a shot glassful might be more doable.

If anyone knows about places to find info about the info in Buhner's new book, links would be much appreciated. I'm already getting a copy because I donated to the gofundme to get the book printed so I'll get it eventually but sooner is always better.

Thanks all, Kim

So, GKAMom, is there a reason why you don't just buy the premade tonic from Misty meadows? It's definitely herb-y, but distinctly sweetened with honey. Dosage on the label is 1 tbs 2x per day. I find it very do-able.

I'm glad to know that Traveller's tea might be another step up, but if there is no way you can drink that,then this seems like a good option. 2 bottles equal a month's supply as labelled.

mistymeadowsherbal.squarespace.com/new-products-1/chronic-tonic

I just started about 2 weeks ago. Good luck to us all.

...Oh, and Traveller, My guess is that Misty Meadows moved/changed info due to updates (better info) and restrictions (FDA laws). When I ordered the CT, she was very present in the transaction and offered to send me several documents. One was the PDF you'd linked to. Another was an updated info sheet. The web is a nightmare to keep updated. But, even if she doesn't appreciate your free advertising, I so appreciate your wisdom! : D


Ann

Ann,

On Misty Meadows website there is no information about what the is stated on the label. In the pdf of the document that has Misty Meadow's recipe it doesn't give the dosage only the instructions of how to make it.

So I wrongly assumed that the dosage was the same as Traveler's version and the instruction for that it 4 cups a day.

As far as ordering the Chronic Tonic from Misty Meadows, if 2 bottles only lasts 30 days then the cost is $70 plus shipping every month. One of the reasons to make it yourself is to lower that cost.

Now that I know that the dosage is actually in the tablespoon range, I'll have to look at it again to see if that's what I want to follow. I'm still undecided as to what protocol I am going to use. I was planning on an abx/herbal combo but my doctor bailed.

Thanks for the info,
Kim