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Interpreting IgeneX test results

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Posted 3/26/2016 2:41 PM (GMT 0)
Hi guys, I just had the IgeneX western blot done (after 5 months of antibiotics that I'm still taking) The result paperwork says negative and Indeterminate for the two tests but I disagree. Can anyone shed some light on my results. Any idea why some bands have multiple + signs? Thanks!

IGM
**39 IND
**41 +

IGG
**31 ++
**39 IND
**41 +++
58 +
**83-93 IND
Posted 3/26/2016 2:51 PM (GMT 0)
Here is the site that I use to help interpret these tests:www.oocities.org/hotsprings/oasis/6455/western-blot.txt You can go there to find supporting Pubmed articles showing what these bands represent.

An IgM result means that you have an active infection. It once was thought to mean an 'early' infection, but has since been revised. IgG means that the infection is at a later stage.

The more +'s you have beside a number, the stronger the reaction.

IND means indeterminate - not negative, but not quite strong enough to be "fully positive". But it means that you reacted on those bands and should be considered, especially when they are Lyme specific bands.

A "Lyme specific band" means specific for Borrelia Burgdorferi, sensu stricto - Lyme disease in the strictest sense. There are only two on the over 300 known strains of Lyme that is considered Bb, ss. Borrelia burgdorferi and Borrelia mayonii. Nothing else will turn a Lyme specific band positive other than Lyme disease - - even though there are over 100 different strains of Borrelia in the US that cause human illness.

Bands 18 & 41 (whether in IgM or IgG) are indicative of the tail of the bacteria, which can cross react with other Spirochetal bacteria such as Relapsing Fever, Pintas and Yaws, and Syphilis.

For some reason there is some that no longer believe that Band 31 is Lyme specific. I really don't understand this as no one can cite any credible sources other than their doctor or Igenex, but no one knows where they got their information. There are actually quite a few PubMed articles showing that Band 31 is Lyme specific:

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1520966


www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9440203


www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8406878


www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8005219


www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10030131


And more references can be found here:
www.reocities.com/HotSprings/Oasis/6455/western-blot.txt

Band 31 indicates OspA (Outer Surface Protein "A"), and as I said, it's Lyme specific.

Band 39 indicates BmpA (Bacterial Membrane Protein "A") and is Lyme specific.

Band 58 is thought to be Borrelia Afzelii - a European strain of Lyme.

Band 83 indicates a high molecular mass protein that is Lyme specific.

Band 93 is an immunodominant protoplasmic cylinder antigen that is Lyme specific.

So considering you have 4 bands that are Lyme specific that are/should be considered Lyme specific, I'd say that there's not much question to if you have Lyme disease and should continue treatments.
Posted 3/26/2016 3:01 PM (GMT 0)
Traveler gave you some great information and I am so sorry that you have lyme. I hope you continue in treatment.

Again, I am so sorry your test was positive.
Posted 3/26/2016 3:08 PM (GMT 0)
I'm happy it's positive, I needed some kind of confirmation since the doctors weren't sure. My LLMD says my test isn't positive for some reason. IgeneX says test 488 and 489 can be used to confirm my indeterminate tests. Anyone know if that is worthwhile? It would be over $200.
Posted 3/26/2016 3:31 PM (GMT 0)
Ask your LLMD if he is going to need that confirmation in order to treat you. I am a thrifty person and would save my money for treatment. I so dislike tests! Here is why:

My LabCorp Western Blot was negative
My Igenex IgM result was Negative
My Igenex IgG result was Negative
My DCD/NYS restult was Negative

But I had 2 bands Ind on IgM and 2 bands positive on IgG

I remember how good it felt to have Girlie tell me I was positive for lyme. Finally I had a diagnosis and I never took another stupid test! But that was me. You are you and we all are not alike. You have to do what your gut tells you. Just like I had to do. No judging here. Just different people.

And it was suggested on my Igenex test to take that confirmation test also.
Posted 3/26/2016 3:54 PM (GMT 0)
He's treating me but the antibiotics don't seem to be working anymore despite changing them. He keeps wanting me to take a break to see if my symptoms return. I don't want that. He thinks I don;t have any co-infections. Has anyone been tested for those with success?
Posted 3/26/2016 4:09 PM (GMT 0)
When the antibiotics did absolutely nothing I switched to herbs. I did not test for co-infections because those tests are even more unreliable than the lyme test.

So what I did was just to cover all the bases, I treated Babs and Bart. My symptoms all overlapped so I really had no idea which was which. I just called them all symptoms. And all I cared about was getting them gone!

It is a hard thing when we don't agree with our doctor. You wonder if you are dumb for not just going along with him/her. I mean, who has the medical degree? But sometimes you can't explain your body and you just get this gut feeling that you know something to be true. Do you go with that feeling and take a chance? If you are wrong, you can always change. But if you are right? Hallelujah!

I have found my journey to be one of trial and error. Since there is no set in stone protocol, we try and see if "it" works. And the name of the game is keep on trying.
Posted 3/26/2016 4:56 PM (GMT 0)
My husband had only + on bands 31 and 41 so his overall test was IND (even though he had IND bands on lyme specific bands 34, 39,83-93.

Our LLND suggested he have the epitope test done to 'confirm' band 31 was indeed lyme. (Seems to be some controversy in the past couple years....)

We did the test....mainly because the LLND was suggesting it, and my husband wanted to. (Even though he had a bulls eye rash several years ago) Also, if our local GP questions the diagnosis, he will have the paperwork to back up his 'claims'.

It came back positive.

But, it was only $100 - done on the IgM

I don't know why you'd have to pay $200 and have it done on both Igm and IgG.

We thought that $100 wasn't too much to pay at the time.

I'm concerned that your Dr. doesn't think you have any co-infections. Lyme rarely travels alone.
He should be diagnosing the co's clinically - on your response to the lyme meds, and trialling some Bart or Babs meds and seeing your reaction.
Posted 3/26/2016 7:09 PM (GMT 0)
My LLMD said that if you have co-infections the lymes disease will not get better without treating co-infections first. And he also said that at least 90% of lymes patients have co-infections and that they are a clinical diagnosis. So that is what he is doing with me by treating co-infections first.
Posted 3/26/2016 7:18 PM (GMT 0)
You can only do epitope test on IGG because you don't have band 31 on IGM. So it will only be $100 or so.
Posted 3/27/2016 12:20 AM (GMT 0)
My doctor says I don't have the symptoms of co infections plus I'm on multiple antibiotics (doxy/omnicef) I'm still worried because I'm not getting any better and it's been 5 months.
Posted 3/27/2016 12:42 AM (GMT 0)
I'm surprised he has ruled out co-infections. No improvement - but what about herxing?

You could share your symptoms here...
Posted 3/27/2016 2:44 PM (GMT 0)
As I believe has been said here, Lyme rarely travels alone. Very few people only have Lyme - but what you could have is asymptomatic Bartonella or Babesia. I did when I got reinfected back in 2014. Those infections stayed asymptomatic for about a year, then they started creeping in, so now I'm back in treatment for Bart and Babs.

Listing your symptoms as Girlie suggested might help in that we might be able to help you determine if you might have another infection that is stopping your healing.

And also as Girlie said, have you herxed and if so, how bad would you say it was? Not being able to detox well can also slow healing.

Lyme takes multiple abx, mono therapy rarely works, because this is an 'intelligent' bacteria that can change into 3 distinct forms depending on what kind of 'danger' it faces inside the body - plus it can hide out in biofilms until the threat is over, then comes back out again.
Posted 3/27/2016 8:22 PM (GMT 0)
Have you been on doxy/omnicef the whole 5 months?
Posted 3/28/2016 4:48 PM (GMT 0)
My symptoms have been mainly joint and tendon pain in my hands, shoulders, feet and knees. I herxed when I first started antibiotic Tx 5 months ago, but not since then. I was originally on Doxy and omnicef, but 2 weeks ago switched to minocycline and Plaquenil with no changes yet.
Posted 3/28/2016 5:51 PM (GMT 0)
I have read of people herxing in 3 days and those that herx in 3 weeks.

It is so hard to tell when things are working. I keep a very good journal just for this reason. Some of my ailments slowly go away and without a journal I wouldn't remember how horribly intense they were at one time.
Posted 3/28/2016 5:58 PM (GMT 0)
Being on that combo for 5 months was too long in my opinion. It seems all of us find one antibiotic that may work better for us. For me, so far, it has been azith. So if you are at a standstill after a month maybe 6 weeks I would start looking to change it up.

Mino is a good antibiotic, but I believe plaquenil just makes it more effective. So you are not really hitting it hard. You could always add some herbals in if you didn't want to add more antibiotics.
Posted 3/28/2016 11:45 PM (GMT 0)
Are there any herbs that are most effective against babisia/bartonella?
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