Buhner – full protocol when to start seeing results?

My husband and son are on the protocol.
They had testing done through IGENEx which showed only band 41 for my son and a couple others for my husband.
It is going to be another month before they can get into the LLMD in our area. I started them on Buhner's Lyme protocol around 6 weeks ago.
My husband has had a lot of joint issues (and has tested negative for rheumatoid arthritis several times).
My son who is just 23, is constantly fatigued and has joint/muscle/neurological symptoms.

Since starting Buhner's protocol, my husband has seen improvement in his flexibility and he doesn't seem as sensitive to some of the foods he thought were causing him issues in the past. He initially had improvement in his hands (could finally make a fist) but I have since added NAC and now they are a bit sorer.

My son still has muscle weakness and fatigue but I see some positive improvements in his neurological processes--he has learning disabilities so it is difficult to tease out what is normal and what is lyme.
He is able to recall information better and carry on better conversations.
However, his motor tics are worse.

Asking my husband, he thinks the protocol is helping and wants to continue it.

Buhner has a lot of information in his book on tweaking the protocol based on one's specific symptoms. Perhaps you need to add something or increase the dosage of one of the core herbs?

FWIW i did his protocol for 8 months and saw zero improvement. The only positive tests I've had are bartonella and mycoplasma so i did those plus lyme. I had a couple weeks of die-off when starting but then nothing changed. I added in a babesia protocol and again, had some die-off but then no changes. I saw zero improvement on Buhner's

Personally, I feel the only reason that the Buhner protocol worked for me, is that I sort of did my own version. And I know that doing stuff on your own is a little bit risky, but my naturopath helped me a lot.

And I don't know that my approach would work for anyone else, but I do feel that if I stuck religiously to his guidelines I wouldn't have done so well. I tried most of the herbs though, I had to, to see what was going to help.

I don't remember how long it took to see improvement, but I think it was at least three months.

My insomnia causes me to wake up 30 to 60 times per night. I’m conscious of the awakenings and they only last 2 seconds and I go right back to bed. It might not sound bad but imagine someone with a tac poking you every 10 minutes throughout the whole night when you try to go into deep sleep. I never feel rested, ever. And I have to go to bed every night at 8 or 9 pm with very little exceptions so therefore I have no social life.

I also have been diagnosed with sleep apnea but it is a huge battle because the sleep doctors are completely bewildered when I explain how bad it is and that it’s ruining my life because I technically only have mild sleep apnea. CPAP, dental appliances, and surgeries have not worked. I have no other lyme or co-infection symptoms, just insomnia.

I'm currently taking Ashwaganda, Chinese Skullcap, Rhodiola, Schisandra, Japanese Knotweed, Red Sage, Cat's claw bark, Cordyceps, Andrographis, Kudzu root, Isatis, Hawthorn, Motherwort, Chinese Cat's Claw, Houttuynia, Sida, Alchornea, Cryptolesis, Bidens pilosa, Multivitamin, EGCG, Quercertin, NAC, Milk thistle, Tryptophan, Gelatin.

cppoly - I was tested for sleep apnea in 2014...before diagnosis.

I had a mixture of obstructive and central sleep apnea.

I gave the CPAP a 30 day trial...no help whatsoever...I didn't pursue other avenues.


But, I no longer wake in the night gasping for air, in a panic.

And...prior to lyme...I slept quietly...no snoring, no wake-ups.
Then after lyme...this happened..and my husband said I was very noisy - he had to wear ear plugs.

Now, with treatment it's much better. I no longer wake a few times during the night...and only on occasion am i noisy.

I am planning on wearing the monitor again one day and re-testing.

my advice is ok u do not see results with buhner.
BUT !
if on the span of 6 months you notice your health going downstairs, and u feel u get worse and worse with no better days in between, then i advise you reconsider what ever treatment u do and think of changing your treatment. either consider taking antibiotics or a different protocol, find a LLMD, change your LLMD, find a naturopath, do something else , do not wait for 1 year or longer without noticing anything and just hope things are going to improve. they will not. i did this mistake and i regret it now. i should have restarted antibiotics much sooner.

buhner also says if u do not see impovement over several months chances are
- your herbs are bad quality - if u drink colored water instead of andrographis do not expect to get healed
- your herbs are good but u take too low dosage - try increasing it
- you are missing a coinfection
- you are missing something else with you - thyroid problems, blood disorders , etc.... do more tests to find out

i would add to that above:
- your condition is worse enough and u need antibiotics for a while. even buhner used to treat some patients with antibiotics for severe cases
buhnerhealinglyme.com/symptoms/severe-derealization/

Stephen’s response:
"
We worked with someone with these symptoms (actually, same symptoms but more extreme) for over a year and they finally did correct. Here is what the combined protocol looked like:
Raintree Nutrition cat’s claw 4, 4x day
Source Naturals resveratrol, 4, 4x day
Lauricidin homeopathic for lyme
Huperzine A, 100 mcg 2x day
Pregnenolone as per lyme book
Epsom salt hot baths followed by skin brushing
Infra-red sauna 3x week or so
Lithium orotate for neuro toxin support
Collagen support protocol from lyme book
Neurotoxin (Quin) protocol from lyme book
Licorice root tincture full dropper 3x daily
Eleuthero as per lyme book
Colloidal minerals (72 trace minerals formula)
Ambient as needed for sleep
Valproic acid (for seizures)
Klonopin (for anxiety/panic attacks as needed)
Combination of antibiotics (abx) of minocycline, zithromax, plaquinal for 3-4 months
In the above situation homicidal rage was extreme, as were anxiety attacks.
As the situation resolved antibiotics were discontinued as were the rest of the pharmaceuticals and teasel flower tincture was used which seemed to be the final piece needed. This particular person was hospitalized several times due to the CNS problems that were being experienced. Back to normal at this point.
"

so notice please buhner recommends minocycline.... stop thinking he is some sort of herb god that heals people with herbs of any disease and the only thing u need is patience. it is NOT TRUE.... severe cases almost always require antibiotics and u have the proof above...

Cppoly - I don't know your full story, but I'm surprised to hear you don't have any other symptoms besides insomnia. Have you had other symptoms in the past? As you probably know, Lyme is a small spirochete bacteria that is pretty good in drilling its way into just about anywhere, so symptoms tend to be diffuse and systemic, especially if you've been infected for awhile.