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Advice for Best Oral Antibiotic for Neuro Symptoms

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Posted 9/12/2018 4:18 PM (GMT 0)
Hi All

Anyone out there dealing with tingling symptoms or nerve symptoms that had luck with oral Antibiotics that has had success?
Posted 9/12/2018 5:37 PM (GMT 0)
minocycline penetrates blood/brain barrier well...you could try that.



But, it also depends on which infection is causing the neuro symptoms.


If it's babesia....then you need to treat that....although I've read mepron doesn't cross the b/b barrier...so not sure. What I do know if mepron gave me and increase in head symptoms...

i have read Rifampin crosses blood/brain barrier...so if you have bart that could help with your head symptoms.


I have had some nerve symptoms subside with oral antibiotics. I used to have a tingling on the back of my head - it's gone.
My pulsatile tinnitus is gone...I think it could be nerve related.
That went away after treating Babesia with Mepron.

i still have the nerve pain, though...and shivering which I think is also nerve related.
Posted 9/12/2018 7:48 PM (GMT 0)
phillips says mepron def crosses BBB
Posted 9/12/2018 7:51 PM (GMT 0)

dbwilco said...
phillips says mepron def crosses BBB

Good to know...thanks.

Explains the increase in 'head' symptoms.
Posted 9/12/2018 10:58 PM (GMT 0)
This is what I wonder too... I have polyneuropathy which two weeks ago spread into my feet after a cold exposure... Could it be virus-related? Then I have a feeling of burning in head as well as a feeling of pressure in head... Severe ear ringing, light- and sound sensitivity, eye discomfort, fatigue, weakness (not sure if those are considered neurological?), pressure on the bridge of nose, sometimes paresthesias and other strange sensations...

My current LLMD now thinks the culprit to be Cpn/Mykoplasma and he gave me an oral antibiotic protocol for that... Tetracycline, Azitromycin + pulses with Amoxicillin and Metronidazol. After about two months having passed, I have not noticed anything yet but last Friday I was so afraid of taking such an amount of drugs so I discontinued them (GP said I should and I stupid listened...). Then the burning became more intense the same evening...! I don't know know what to do. All the other symptoms remained unchanged during the course so I didn't pay attention to the burning being milder.

This isn't a direct answer to your question, just my thoughts regarding the subject...

I wonder how long it will take for some effective AB to take the neuro symptoms away?! They say it takes time but really... how long can we risk other areas of health only to see IF it will help in time... This really sucks.

Tell us please if you find something that works for the tingling!
Posted 9/12/2018 11:20 PM (GMT 0)

Eaglet said...


I wonder how long it will take for some effective AB to take the neuro symptoms away?! They say it takes time but really... how long can we risk other areas of health only to see IF it will help in time... This really sucks.

I can tell you for chronic lyme and co's - it's going to be many months...to years.
So, if you're really worried/concerned about antibiotics...you might want to consider herbals.
Posted 9/12/2018 11:55 PM (GMT 0)
Cryptolepis/Sida Acuta is the best antibiotic I've tried for my Neuro symptoms. Just be prepared because neuroherxes suck
Posted 9/13/2018 12:15 AM (GMT 0)
I have been dealing with the tingling and burning since first becoming sick in 2013. My neuro symptoms have been the most challenging. I have tried many antibiotic combinations and have yet to find a combination that has completely eliminated the neuro symptoms. At the moment, I am taking Clarithromycin, atovaquone, amoxicillin and liposomal ceftriaxone. My experience is that the antibiotics help to minimize the neuro symptoms. For what it's worth, the ceftriaxone definitely helps minimize the neuro symptoms and has allowed me to function and work. I am about to add in liposomal oil of oregano, cinnamon and clove which fingers crossed will assist with reducing the neuro symptoms to an even lower level. I hope you find the right combination that works for you.
Posted 9/13/2018 11:18 AM (GMT 0)
antibiotics help to alleviate synonyms because they are not only killing bugs, but suppress immune system along the way, all of them, so if you suddenly drop ABX you'll almost always get symptoms spike, don't worry about it - it's not a relapse

for neuro one can add bactrim and clindamycin to the list, monolaurin probably too(the molecule is very small = good penetration). also azithro, which has a molecular weight slightly less than other macrolides

as to how much time does it take .. around 1..4 years of constant symptoms

Post Edited (Dmitry) : 9/13/2018 5:34:25 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 9/13/2018 5:00 PM (GMT 0)

Dmitry said...
antibiotics help to alleviate synonyms because they are not only killing bugs, but suppress immune system along the way, all of them, so if you suddenly drop ABX you'll almost always get symptoms spike, don't worry about it - it's not a relapse

When I stop abx I don't get symptoms spiking.
Posted 9/13/2018 7:09 PM (GMT 0)
> When I stop abx I don't get symptoms spiking.

thats actually a good thing ...

or ... did you have your level of d25 checked? the higher it is the less TLR receptors are expressed on immune cells the less are symptoms spikes while pulsing abx

Its important to have this marker around 12..20 ng/ml because of this:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/figure/fig05/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S141386701500224X

TLR2:
Borrelia burgdorferi

An explanation could be that 1,25(OH)2D3 induces down-regulation of TLR expression, and this may account for the attenuated response after stimulation with TLR-2 and TLR-4 ligands [6,38]. Indeed, we found a reduced surface expression of TLR-2 and TLR-4 associated with elevated vitamin D3 stores during summer which persisted throughout autumn.

Post Edited (Dmitry) : 9/13/2018 1:22:48 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 9/13/2018 7:49 PM (GMT 0)

Dmitry said...
> When I stop abx I don't get symptoms spiking.

thats actually a good thing ...

or ... did you have your level of d25 checked? the higher it is the less TLR receptors are expressed on immune cells the less are symptoms spikes while pulsing abx

Its important to have this marker around 12..20 ng/ml because of this:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/figure/fig05/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S141386701500224X

TLR2:
Borrelia burgdorferi

An explanation could be that 1,25(OH)2D3 induces down-regulation of TLR expression, and this may account for the attenuated response after stimulation with TLR-2 and TLR-4 ligands [6,38]. Indeed, we found a reduced surface expression of TLR-2 and TLR-4 associated with elevated vitamin D3 stores during summer which persisted throughout autumn.

I stop for 2 weeks.

Of course if I stopped for good...my symptoms would spike since I'm not in remission yet.

My vitamin d tests show I'm in the bottom of the sufficient range.
Posted 9/13/2018 7:56 PM (GMT 0)
Dr. Sapi's research showed Minocycline and pulsing with tindazole 2days a week works well for Neuroborelliosis. I was on them but came off due to severe dizziness ( occurs about 20% of the time ).
Posted 9/13/2018 8:06 PM (GMT 0)
Girlie, have a look at this graphs and compare your's vit d25 levels with presented ones.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/figure/fig02/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/figure/fig05/

to covert from/to nmol one should divide/multiple by 2.6

> I was on them but came off due to severe dizziness ( occurs about 20% of the time ).

that was a herx - i pushed through it with mino and it's relatively ok now(far less dizziness than before)
Posted 9/13/2018 8:12 PM (GMT 0)

Dmitry said...
Girlie, have a look at this graphs and compare your's vit d25 levels with presented ones.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/figure/fig02/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/figure/fig05/

to covert from/to nmol one should divide/multiple by 2.6

Why?

I haven't checked all my vit d tests...but one was 90 nmol/l
Posted 9/13/2018 8:37 PM (GMT 0)
Your d25 can be still too high(i.e. not optimal). Ignore sufficient/deficient lab ranges - the body downregulates d25 as low as possible during many chronic infections like lyme, tuberculosis, hiv, etc to increase the expression of TLR2/TLR4/TLR9 among other things - thats why the levels of pro inflammatory cytokines are higher at winter(less d25 due to less sun exposure) than at summer since activating immune cells through TLR leads to cytokines release(aka herx) - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/figure/fig03/?report=objectonly

TLR2 are used to sense bb - it's a macrophage/monocyte/neutrophil activation receptor. More details on the connection between levels of d25 and levels of TLR2 and the importance of TLR receptors in
immunocompetence against bacteria/virus and protozoa infections provided in the links above.

Doctors who prescribe D3(Vitamin D) are doing so to effectively down regulate ones immunity but if you tolerate abx well I see no logical sense in keeping D25 relatively high unless to make a life a bit easier on a herx front.

Post Edited (Dmitry) : 9/13/2018 2:46:50 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 9/13/2018 9:08 PM (GMT 0)

Dmitry said...
Your d25 can be still too high(i.e. not optimal). Ignore sufficient/deficient lab ranges - the body downregulates d25 as low as possible during many chronic infections like lyme, tuberculosis, hiv, etc to increase the expression of TLR2/TLR4/TLR9 among other things - thats why the levels of pro inflammatory cytokines are higher at winter(less d25 due to less sun exposure) than at summer since activating immune cells through TLR leads to cytokines release(aka herx) - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074219/figure/fig03/?report=objectonly

TLR2 are used to sense bb - it's a macrophage/monocyte/neutrophil activation receptor. More details on the connection between levels of d25 and levels of TLR2 and the importance of TLR receptors in
immunocompetence against bacteria/virus and protozoa infections provided in the links above.

Doctors who prescribe D3(Vitamin D) are doing so to effectively down regulate ones immunity but if you tolerate abx well I see no logical sense in keeping D25 relatively high unless to make a life a bit easier on a herx front.

From my experience Doctors are prescribing D3 when their patients show low vitamin d levels after testing.
This was the case with my MIL and also what was discussed with my own Dr.
Posted 9/13/2018 9:22 PM (GMT 0)
True, but they have no clue why the patient has low levels of d25 at the first place. So their intention to correct the "deficiency" is ill-formed(i.e. is not based on any science).
Posted 9/13/2018 9:31 PM (GMT 0)
So do you support the Marshall Protocol?
Posted 9/13/2018 10:11 PM (GMT 0)
To a much degree. But I really think everyone will extract the value out of optimized D25 levels. I view the studies quoted above as an independent validation of Marshall work(the one where they compare TLRs expression vs seasons is a unique).

Unfortunately, I did not find the study where they directly measured the increase/decrease of b.b. load as a result of D3 supplementation, but I've found the one where increased mortality vs toxoplasmosis was detected in mouses which immune cells were treated with 1,25-dihydroxyvitamin D3(active form of d25): https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15939587/

The authors concluded that this could be due to "inhibition of Th-1-type cytokines" but the thing is immunocompetence against b.b.(and many other infections) relies on Th-1-type cytokines too and vit d25 levels(via D3 supplementation/sun) inhibit Th1 cytokines: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2633636/

Just my basic understanding...

Post Edited (Dmitry) : 9/13/2018 4:14:19 PM (GMT-6)

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