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New Symptoms: Nausea, Bowel Issues, Constipation, IBS-like...

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Posted 7/14/2019 5:24 AM (GMT 0)
Hey everyone. I'm having some new symptoms crop up seemingly out of nowhere which have been most unpleasant to deal with - especially while I was doing so well (around 75-80%+ on good days).
I'm at my wits end as to how to deal with this - any help would be appreciated.

Quick back story:
Dx 2018: 3B's, Yersinia, Coxsackie, VZV, EBV. LLMD Treatment within 6-8 months of symptoms.
No IBS related issues at all until now.
Currently targeting Bart on Doxy, Azithromycin, Rifampin (introduced in Feb '19), Artesunate (Dapsone pending for babesia (rare once-off night sweats after 8-9 months of babs treatment) after liver enzyme tests are good), various tinctures; CSA, Houttuynia, Andro, Skullcap, Salvia, Stephania probably more.

SYMPTOMS
These symptoms have been on and off for about a month and now slowly getting worse:
1. Soft Stools - haven't been able to form solid stools for about 3 months prior at least; Stools also smell very toxic - I remember Quin saying that bart stinks, could be that. I also tested for C Diff (results pending).

2. Bloating, Constipation - after noticing my bowel movements were reducing (usually go once per day) - they were decreasing to 1 per 2-3 days, i got worried and started laxatives; first was stool softeners - no result, moved on to bicasodyl (no result), added an osmotic laxative and enemas - had some result but fairly certain most of it hasnt come out.

3. Suspected partial stool impaction - still not getting regular bowel movements, some pain and discomfort in the sigmoid colon/stomach area, though still passing gas and very limited stools. Doctor prescribed 2x colonoscopy prep solution - 1st one wasnt too successful, lots was evacuated but i still feel very full in that sigmoid colon/stomach area, and can actually feel something hard and large in that area when i try and massage it - pretty sure its a partial obstruction.

4. Rumbling / Cramps - probably because of the laxatives(?) i can still hear my bowels trying to move things but theyre loud and i feel them all over my torso - like rumbly noises (both in the large and small intestine areas).

5. Now when i eat food, i have some nauseousness shortly after - I'm already avoiding Gluten, Eggs, Milk after food sensitivity test and haven't been able to find a correlation between types of foods and these new nausea episodes after food now.

6. Other: Burping, less appetite, more fatigue.


Sorry for the details but i've run out of ideas as to what it could be. I'm gonna push for a colonoscopy if this doesnt resolve on its own (doubt it). Ive also entertained the idea of H. Pylori (will ask doc about this), and waiting results on C. Diff from previous diarrhea episodes. Very worried about SIBO or IBD, Colitis or Chrons or something.

Ive also thought it could be resistant Bartonella, since that seems to be my biggest issue - tolerating rifampin very well but not convinced its doing a whole lot in all honesty, but thats another story.

But anyway... any ideas or other that had similar problems and resolved them?
Posted 7/14/2019 9:01 AM (GMT 0)
Hey there, I don’t have any suggestions but I am going through something similar.

I’ve been to my gp who did a basic stool test that didn’t show anything. My health anxiety has been loving all this and it’s really been bothering me, also tempted to ask for a colonoscopy.

I actually stopped all treatment 4 weeks ago and it seemed to kick off then, don’t know if it’s hornones or one of the coinfections. I’ve read bart and baba can cause GI issues.

Will be keeping an eye on this post and should I find anything that helps will be sure to share.
Posted 7/14/2019 9:30 AM (GMT 0)
Painful constipation, bad smell, bloating, gas... Yep, that is bart. The herx made it worse.
Posted 7/14/2019 9:55 AM (GMT 0)
Quin would the include diarrhea too?
Posted 7/14/2019 11:43 AM (GMT 0)
Deadman,

I would recommend getting a complete workup by a gastroenterologist to identify or eliminate conventional diagnoses. This would include abdominal xray and CT scan to look for obstruction or impaction, colonoscopy (see if they will do a biopsy to test for infectious causes), H pylori test, possibly a Hida scan to check gallbladder function.

Testing for Candida overgrowth or antibodies would be a good idea if that hasn’t been done already.

For symptom relief, the following may assist but pay attention to side effects as you seem to be experiencing both diarrhea and constipation.

- Natural Calm magnesium supplement can be taken to promote regular BM’s and to soften stool. For me, it works best taken in a single dose at night around 8-8:30 pm. Max dose on bottle is 2 tsp. I have had to increase significantly over time and recently had to go from 5 to almost 6 tsp. (I am not a doctor so I cannot say how safe it is to take that high a dose for long term use. Just reporting my experience.)

- Microbe Formulas tauts Mimosa pudica as a “gut scrubber.” It’s possible it could help push through whatever it is you feel is blocked. It can also cause increased constipation, so make sure you at least use Natural Calm to move things along.

- Berberine and olive leaf can assist with pathogens in the gut. I personally found a supplement called Candicid Forte to be beneficial. It contains a variety of herbs. It was mild but produced a large expulsion of gut pathogens after I started my 2nd bottle at full dose.

- Slippery elm and marshmallow root are often promoted for helping irritated bowels.
Posted 7/14/2019 12:01 PM (GMT 0)
My only trip to the ER to diagnose extreme constipation (no bowel movement for 3 weeks) proved no blockage. The ultrasound showed no build up of feces. A manual digital exam also proved no blockage. Clindamycin caused c-dif which was resolved with treatment. My symptoms of c-dif was up to 15 times a day of watery, bloody diarrhea. Antibiotics and the infections wreak havoc on our GI system. For the most part my stools are normal with intermittent constipation and diarrhea. Early on in my treatment I had a lot of bloating and horrid gurgling. I know longer worry about it. A colonoscopy showed no problems and maybe having that test would ease your mind.

Patty
Posted 7/14/2019 12:29 PM (GMT 0)
Sorry you are going through this!

It makes complete sense to experience nausea and fatigue with constipation. You are killing tons of pathogens and not eliminating their corpses! Even a healthy person's daily elimination being delayed by a few hours can cause those symptoms. There are Lyme doctors who advise stopping all treatment after even one day of constipation because elimination is the primary route of detoxification and can't be compromised. It's great that you are trying to address this!

Have you passed any blood? Any watery diarrhea? How often do you eliminate at this point?

What are you consuming in terms of probiotics? I imagine that while taking such a large number of antibiotic drugs and herbs, your intestines would need a lot of help functioning in terms of proper flora, so it would be key to find a time during the day when the probiotics would not be killed, depending on how you time all the antimicrobial herbs and meds.

Are you intentionally targeting gut pathogens? I never had GI symptoms until I began to treat a gut imbalance I found in a stool test, and the die-off symptoms caused a lot of rumbling, nausea, looser stools, etc. Perhaps you are unintentionally treating a gut imbalance you didn't know you had.

Did your stool test look for a variety of parasites? Candida? I wonder if the potential obstruction you feel could be parasites. Candida could cause a lot of these symptoms, and can flourish when someone is taking antibiotics. Probiotics and a sugar-free diet can help to keep it in check, but if that is the culprit here, then you might need additional supplements to get it back into balance.

Do you use coffee enemas or any other sort of enemas? Some say they are very helpful, but others find them irritating. Have you tried magnesium to soften your stools? Do you use any binders that could be constipating?

I agree that it makes sense to have a medical work-up for Crohn's and obstructions, but these symptoms do sound to me like they could be caused by meds, massive die-off reactions, and the resulting imbalance. One of the symptoms I have when I herx is gastroparesis, i.e. my GI tract stalls. Some refer to it as "Bell's palsy of the gut," as it is a neurological problem, fundamentally.

Frankly, when I read the list of anti-microbial meds and herbs you are taking, I thought that my gut would be destroyed if I were on all those at once. There is a possibility that this regimen is just too much for your system. Some can handle it, sure, but I know that I could not, for what that's worth. Long-term gut damage from antibiotic use happens sometimes, unfortunately. I'm curious what your Lyme specialist has to say about all this.
Posted 7/14/2019 2:43 PM (GMT 0)

Szabo246 said...
Quin would the include diarrhea too?

When I got bart herx my stomach would hurt. A lot of toxic stuff would build up and it was hard to poop it out. Eventually I would get diarrhea.

I thought I might have c.diff but it was just herx. Over several months it got less and less as the bacteria died off.
Posted 7/14/2019 2:49 PM (GMT 0)

Quin said...
When I got bart herx my stomach would hurt. A lot of toxic stuff would build up and it was hard to poop it out. Eventually I would get diarrhea.

I thought I might have c.diff but it was just herx. Over several months it got less and less as the bacteria died off.

Quin,

Did your LLMD tell you the gut issues were a bartonella herx? How do you know it is a bartonella herx and not a side effect of abx or die off of gut bacteria unrelated to bartonella?
Posted 7/14/2019 2:59 PM (GMT 0)

WalkingbyFaith said...
Quin,

Did your LLMD tell you the gut issues were a bartonella herx? How do you know it is a bartonella herx and not a side effect of abx or die off of gut bacteria unrelated to bartonella?

I got die off of gut bacteria from many antibiotics, but it was just diarrhea and not painful. This started once I took minocycline and killed the bartonella. I got other symptoms of bart herx at the same time, including fever, rash, and bad smell.

My doctor just said take probiotics. The probiotics reduced the diarrhea, but I think that just made it worse because then the toxic smelly poo would stay in there and hurt.
Posted 7/14/2019 3:25 PM (GMT 0)
I have toxic smelly poop, too, most of the time, especially if I have soft or loose bowels. I haven’t assumed mine was from bart. I assume it’s a toxic byproduct of gut dysbiosis.

I have recalcitrant constipation that is managed by Natural Calm magnesium supplement at high doses and ropeworm. In 3.5 years since the sudden onset of IBS-C (after a lifetime of “normal” constipation that didn’t bother me much and never had any odor probably because it was so compacted, LOL), I only had one breakthrough.

It was last April after taking Candicid Forte at full dose for a full month after having taken one bottle randomly at smaller doses. I expelled a lot of seaweed and ropeworm looking stuff. Had vomiting and diarrhea and nausea but felt much better afterwards. Had significant reductions in joint pain and muscle fatigue and was able to move bowels on my own for about 3-4 days before constipation started to return after I started eating more food.

I still expel ropeworm but never had another breakthrough on the constipation and have had to increase the Natural Calm numerous times to higher and higher doses. I have toxic mold exposure, too, and may have mold colonizing my gut, but I don’t know how to determine that. Wouldn’t do any good to treat that anyway until out of exposure.

Post Edited (WalkingbyFaith) : 7/14/2019 9:29:02 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 7/14/2019 4:10 PM (GMT 0)

WalkingbyFaith said...
I have toxic smelly poop, too, most of the time, especially if I have soft or loose bowels. I haven’t assumed mine was from bart. I assume it’s a toxic byproduct of gut dysbiosis.


Bartonella isn't the only thing that can cause smelly poop. C.Diff is also quite smelly. And if you've got ropeworms, that's a whole different cause of bowel problems.
Posted 7/14/2019 4:31 PM (GMT 0)
get all the standard test-know they often find nothing.
If they find nothing then think parasite or dental. you can
google the dental meridian chart and find out what teeth match your symtoms.
For parasites know that the stool test miss parasites all the time. Parasites can also be in gall bladder and that will never show up in a stool test.
Do the upper and lower first-it may find something
Posted 7/15/2019 9:06 AM (GMT 0)
Szabo:
Sorry to hear its happening to you also. Yup, my health anxiety is all over the show lately - doesn’t help at all.

thanks…I’m also on the look out and will update this thread if/when any improvement.

Quin:
thanks for chiming in - Yeah I’m suspecting Bart - but its so odd ive had no symptoms IBS related (beyond bad stool smell) and then its blown up within 3-4 weeks with no changes in diet, meds etc.

WalkingByFaith:
hugely grateful for your suggestions - excellent material.

Ill ask my GP for a referral for that specialist. Xray just showed a lot of stool but I gather it isn’t a complete blockage as im still going (just not very often and have a persistent ‘full’/bloated feeling in the sigmoid colon area all the time (worse with food).

Will definitely push for colonoscopy and ask for biopsy, H Pylori test, candida overgrowth.

Big thanks for the supplement suggestions! Will try them out.

Summer 16:
3 weeks is a hell of a long time - I also went to ER for it but they didn’t find a complete blockage, but a lot of build up - dismissed with enemas to no success. Have things improved for you since?

Saraeli:
Thanks for chiming in Saraeli!
That was my exact thought process also - Im not excreting any dead pathogens which could be causing some toxicity and probably some reabsorption (great!).

No blood (unless the dark/muddy water (lol) is actually blood).

Toilet trips are limited in success (small, not like they used to be, not fully formed) but still feel full in that area. Laxatives just seems to pushing out newer, more semi structured/liquid stools without pushing out any of the bigger/harder stool (IF partial stool impaction is the problem here).

Probiotics: Yeah I try have some after dinner/night away from all the drugs/herbs but its juggling the herb/med interactions during the day that make it difficult. I’ll load up on them and figure out better timing.

Targeting gut pathogens? - never actually thought of that - good suggestion. But I haven’t changed anything in the last 6 months really… haven’t even thought about targeting gut imbalance but im suspecting I have something going on - will ask fo candida other parasites test.

No coffee enemas - maybe try them down the track. Im on magnesium anyways since the start of my treatment. Ive backed off on binders about 1-2 months in case of reabsorption of toxins due to consitpation.

flora imbalance is definitely on my list of possibilities. Gastroparesis is also interesting - and i sure hope it isn’t - but most of my symptoms ARE neuro/occular so thats a scary thought.

Ive been on this regimen, tweaks here and there with approval from my LLMD since my original dx last year - its pretty heavy i admit! But I’m tolerating it pretty well with huge functionality with minimal/no side effects.
But on the flip-side, theres also no way i could handle slowing down with 30-50hrs/week study/work to be done with reduced functionality - im pretty much poor in a HCOL city and have no support (family/gov etc etc).
If I don't work, its game over for me and my treatment.

Will definitely go back and see what he says though - will report here with an update.

Magoo:
Yes, cynically, Im also expecting they’ll find nothing... they never do, it seems. Thanks for the input, i’ll also investigate those!



Thanks so much for all of your support.... I will be checking in with my GP and LLMD for the following:
colonoscopy, parasite/stool test/candida, h pylori, c-diff follow up, stock up on probiotics, check out some other supplements.
Will report with an update soon.
Posted 7/16/2019 1:22 AM (GMT 0)
I've had horrible constipation and bloating in the past and the only thing that has helped is a keto diet with very little carbs. Perhaps an elimination diet is in order. I know I can't tolerate a lot of weird things anymore for no apparent reason. I've noticed now that I'm having "cheat meals" on the weekends my bloating is starting to come back so it's definitely diet related...though I sure do miss eating carbs it just doesn't work for me it seems. Can't have your cake and eat it too as they say
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