Contradiction in Doxcycline/Bicillin Combination

Lately, my doctor has me taking both Doxycycline and Bicillin. Looking up combination drugs, I read Doxy can minimize effectiveness of Bicillin. Then I read in another study it does not.

Have no idea what to do as I’m trying to treat Bart with Doxy/Houttuynia and tick born relapsing fever with Bicillin.

Or if youre going to use doxy for bart+lyme, then youre just wasting the bicillin. might as well not even use it. consider combining doxy w/ a different antibiotic. bicillin should only be used as a monotherapy

I'm not sure if the bicillin w/ hit the bart. It says online that penicillins will, but thats probably a question for someone w/ good bart knowledge like garzie or quin

I only know what Dr K has told me. He's done actual studies himself on this, and says that bicillin is only effective as a monotherapy. I've read this elsewhere as well. And the logic makes sense. It's very slow acting, you wear them down by attrition. Doxy will send the spirochetes into cyst form. Bicillin wont. So if you combine doxy w/ bicllin you might as well jsut not take the bicillin. It's a painful shot and no sense taxing the kidneys if its not helping.

What about Biaxin + plaquenil? You'd be get action against both bart and TBRF and the added bonus of being on the DMARD/anti arthritic that you probably should be on regardless

Dr K says it is his go to for "chronic" lyme. This isnt for acute infection. I know solaris uses it and its the only thing that keeps his dysautonomia at bay. You cant use it w/ any other antibiotic if you want it to work its magic tho

i'm afraid its not an antibiotic i have looked into in any great detail - a quick search brings up a study that says bicillin seemed to work against bart cultures in vitro - but when tested in vivo - it was not effective -
it also says to be cautious in cases of renal insufficiency due to risk of unexpectedly high blood concentrations due to reduced excretion - that can then start to have CNS toxicity effects - so that's something to be aware of - but i guess that could apply to any drug that is primarily excreted through the kidneys

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/pmc415619/

is Methylene blue an option for bart from the perspective of the kidneys ? - doses are pretty small / at around 100mg a day - so typically that is a good start for renal implications - i have not looked at renal effects though

If you buy bicillin just go to this place.

https://canshipmeds.com/

Rite aid wanted $2200 for 5 shots. This place sold it to me for $575 for 10 shots. Showed up at my door a few days later, all i did was email a picture of the script.

$57/week isnt cheap, but its a monotherapy so maybe worth it. This was 2y ago tho no idea what the px is now w/ Biden's inflation.

shouldnt interfere w/ bicillin. i said biaxin not bactrim. $96 not bad glad insurance pays, doesnt for most people. maybe rainy can benefit from the link

I havent started plaquenil because my arthritis seems to be psoriatic arthritis, and its contraindicated

From the drug interaction site I use:

“Moderate
doxycycline penicillin G benzathine
Applies to: Doxy 100 (doxycycline), Bicillin L-A (penicillin g benzathine)
Talk to your doctor before using doxycycline together with penicillin G benzathine. Combining these medications may reduce the effectiveness of penicillin “

Is that the correct form of bicillin?

Horwitz is a big fan of using hydroxychloroquine with intracellular antibiotics - he says that it increases the pH of the inside of the cell and that's what makes the antibiotic work better

btw - RW - i don't know if your kidney function is significantly impaired ( eg 60% of normal) - or if you just have to be careful you don't tax them - but depending on how your kidney function is vs normal - i would expect that to have a potentiating effect on any antibiotics that are normally excreted that way - so you might want to check on that when deciding dosing.

drugs.com may have that information under "route of excretion"

Garzie - Your thoughts about dosing amounts is right on the money. I have been more careful for about four years now about what herbs or meds I take because of the kidneys. My doctors were acting as if there was nothing going on with kidneys when prescribing, even though the GFR was at 52. The naturopath I was seeing who would always sell me supplements wanted me to take one (I can't remember now). I had researched it and found it to be bad for the kidneys. I told her I'd rather not because of kidney issues, and her response was "But I really want you to take this." Honest to God that was her answer. I replied "And I'd like to keep the kidneys I have."

Normally. Bicillin is okay to take full dose. But because kidneys excrete it, I have needed to adjust the dose. Same goes for other herbs and meds. Some, like Doxy, don't need adjustment, according to everything I've read. So you're right - if it slogs down the kidneys, it's out.

dcd - Now it all comes together as I did not know Biaxin is the same thing as clarithromycin. Your point on how hcq potentiates the Biaxin or Doxy helps to really clarify why I have felt so bad in the last week. I think the hcq is making herx worse through the Doxy, or at least that is what seems to make the most sense. The Houtty added in is also part of it.

running wild,

Is the doctor you are seeing the one in Franklin, TN?

running wild said...
Girlie - I remember a post or two about your kidney numbers, but it seems like it was a number of years ago? I do think the antibiotics change the numbers, but too much of the wrong kind for too long can make it permanent.

Lymie24 - I do see the one in Franklin sometimes, but he is not the one who prescribed the Doxy/Bicillin combo. Did you mention before to me that you see hi?

It was 2018/19 when on the brutal bart/persisters protocol that my gfr dropped below 60.

I think the last test - the gfr was 77.
- Or maybe that was my husbands test result… lol

I’m happy if it’s over 70.