Pomegranite tabs verus juice

Saw some of you on another thread are taking the tablets instead of juice which I am also doing.

Curious how many tabs/Strength you are taking.

I take pomegranite, Acai Berry, green tea and green barley all in capsule formats.

Larry

Like some others here, I don't take any supplements or even vitamins.

To start with, I don't feel or believe there is anything wrong with using them, so I am not negative to those that do.

I know my doctor's couldn't possibly be the only ones that feel this way, but its been interesting to me in the past year and a half, that my GP of whom has been seeing me above 13 years, my uro/surgeon, and the Radiation Oncologist I worked with in the end, all of them, independent of each other, all felt that all supplements and vitamins did with men was to produce expensive urine. It was explained to me that the body doesn't utilize the bulk of such things, and flushes it right out of the body. If only one dr. said that, I would dismiss it as a quirk to that doctor, but no one on my team puts much if any stock in any of the supplements or larger vitamin intakes.

Any comment? They did feel, that I that's what a patient wants to do, its not going to hurt them, in moderation.

Those same types of docs that pooh-pooh diet-supplements-vitamins-health foods also make no money on those things and do not look closely at published materials that may show some benefits or of them useful. These same docs and hospitals all pooh-pooh home remedies and old wives remedies and grand ma's stuff or anything that is not under their controlled sales or profits, as having any value on anything...no money in that endorsement...however all the new drugs you see on t.v. to treat all and any friggin condition of us patients...is supposedly our only salvation. Have you noticed all the new drugs with latin or fictious sounding names(as the type of material it is...keep us in the dark..) are out there now, and none are real cheap (duh). Notice too the long list of side effects alot of this new junk has???? Some cause death or other minor side effects (LOL). What a Country!!!!

Kudos-Casey and add Dr. Mark Moyad and his books relating to such and his thoughts about FDA in general, had him as a guest speaker at a PCa group meeting years ago. Diet, supplements and such are his life study and he does say that some of things do not do that much, but when he does endorse something..best to listen up.

One question with supplements is whether you really know -- with a sufficient level of certainty -- what is in them. You know what the label says is in them, but do you really know that is what's in there (absent FDA regulation, which does not exist for supplements). Another issues is whether the "supplement" does more harm than good. For example, someone takes fish oil, which could help with the Omega 6 to Omega 3 ratio, but may have mercury or other heavy metals.

Someone else mentioned the risk of masking cancer or the advancement of cancer. For example, maybe saw palmetto reduces psa. But does it reduce cancer or just make cancer more difficult to detect, by "artificially" reducing psa.

There are smart doctors on all sides of this issue. Drs. Strum and Meyers recommend certain supplements. I have heard Dr. Carter at Johns Hopkins, also a leading p ca expert, say he does not recommend them. None of these guys are dumb.

I am not anti-supplement. I personally take vitamin D and drink pomegranate juice every day -- though I am likely to soon switch to the pills, to reduce my sugar consumtpion. But the issue of what to take is not simple.

geezer99 said...
To the best of my knowledge (based on a search of the medical literature) the only published scientific studies of pomegranate were done using the actual juice. These studies were preliminary but the results were good enough to continue the studies.

So, we don't even know how valuable pomegranate juice is and have not even begun to investigate extracts.

Cost issues aside, I know of no negatives to drinking pomegranate juice.

I don't know what steps you took, but I can only suggest that you apparently didn't look very hard into studies of the extract of "nature's power fruit."

Nonetheless, this comment is correct:  "we don't even know how valuable pomegranate juice is."  We do know it contains powerful cancer-fighting characteristics which inhibits growth of tumors.  We know it is valuable, we just don't know completely how valuable is it.  Maybe it's a little valuable; maybe it's very valuable. 

The phrase that I like to use is that one "stacks additional odds" favorably in one's corner if you do things like consume pomegranate, exercise regularly, eat a heart-healthy diet, select an experienced surgeon, etc., etc.  Some people say that PC is merely a "crap shoot"; on the contrary there are lots of "levers" at our disposal to improve our odds...once we educate ourselves about them, it's simply a matter of whether we act on them or consciously choose not to act on them.

Pomegranate is widely known as "nature's power fruit."  I also call it "low hanging fruit."

Post Edited (Casey59) : 2/25/2010 8:28:57 AM (GMT-7)

I agree and figure even if I'm not improving the odds by taking all the stuff I am then I'm helping the Economy!

Larry

geezer99 said...
To the best of my knowledge (based on a search of the medical literature) the only published scientific studies of pomegranate were done using the actual juice.

Perhaps I misunderstood...but I thought you were asking about studies on pomegranate extract, which was what I had previously commented on.  I thought that you were asking, or stating, that you were unaware (or couldn't find) of medical studies published on the extract  versus "actual juice" (your words).

If you go to www.pubmed.com, which is a free online repository of medical research abstracts, you will find a lot of results...I just went (again) and found 125 "hits" for "pomegranate AND extract."  Some of the abstracts are accompanied by free access to the reports themselves (for access to most of the full reports, one needs to subscribe to the service), but even I—with no trained medical background—can usually understand the gist of the study & results by just reading the free abstract.

The "hits" for "pomegranate AND extract" are a growing presence on pubmed; here's the breakdown of the current 125 technical reports by publication date:

• 54 technical reports from before 2007
• 19 in 2007
• 19 in 2008
• 30 in 2009
• and already 3 published and posted in 2010

 

If you try using pubmed a few times, it can be pretty easy to use...even for a novice like me.

Did I misunderstand?   I didn't search beyond the terms "pomegranate AND extract" cuz that was the topic Larry started this thread with...  Try it.

Hope that helps...

 ----------------------------------------------

By the way, as a helpful addendum to my note above, pubmed has a nice search tool.  As you begin entering the key word(s) that you want to search on, it automatically provides options of the frequently occurring combinations of words which start with what you typed.  It's a nice tool to use in case you have problems spelling "pomegranate" (a lot of people do), or even "extract."  It's also nice because it "suggests" frequent combinations of other key words; combinations that you might not have thought of to expand your search.  "Pomegranate extract" is in fact, one of the frequently occurring combinations offered by the the tool as you begin to enter "p-o-m-e..." as a result of so many articles in medical journals...indexed in PubMed.

.

 

 

 

 

 

Post Edited (Casey59) : 2/26/2010 7:53:03 AM (GMT-7)

Casey:

I like the Pomegranite juice and I plan to drink 8 oz. a day. I am not concerned about the sugar content.

Are you suggesting that it is BETTER to take the extract?

If so, what brand?

Also, my understanding is that these supplements are not regulated so you might be rolling the dice on the actual contents (?)

Mel

I only heard about the possioble benefits of pomegranates last week

I tried looking for tablets. (I'm in the Netherlands by the way where they're called granaatappels)

The drug store had never heard of them
The pharmacist's assistent tried to sell me a cream for my skin that contained pomegranate extract! he then asked the pharmacist who told him they didn't stock the tablets but to to look it up on their suppliers list on the computer. The suppliers had it on their list but didn't stock it. They could get it for me for about €36 for 60 tablets, but it would take at least two weeks.

I have not yet found any pure pomegrante juice in any supermarket, the best I have found is a multi-juice at about €2 per liter that is only 20% pomegranate juice and contains twice as much sugar (15%) as the juice I normally drink.

My local fruit and veg shop sells fresh pomegranates (imported from Turkey) for €1.25 each so I've bought some of them. I have had no problems getting the seeds out, I'm okay with the taste and have been eating half a pomegranate a day. (Note that on the internet I read that there are various varieties of pomegrante which have different tastes and can be acidic or sweet - a bit like apples!)

I figure that even if the benefits are not certain that I'm not doing my body or wallet any harm buying and eating fruit.

And the proper version of the liqueur Grenadine is made from pomegranates, so is that likely to be any good?!

Alfred

“A little bit is better than nada…”; song lyrics by the Texas Tornados. 

 

It’s an approach I have adopted for situations in my life.  For example, I haven’t completely eliminated red meat from my diet, but I have dramatically reduced it compared to (let’s say) 10 years ago.  Once or twice per week is far lower than the American average, so I feel that I’ve done pretty good, and am likely to be improving my overall heart and prostate health.  (Well, I don't actually have a prostate any more, but I am improving my heart health!)  I didn’t go all the way and eliminate it completely, but a little bit is better than nada.  I make this comment here only because I relate it to the discussion on varying potency of available pomegranate extracts.

 

POM Wonderful publishes results that their brand of pomegranate extract tablets are the most potent available on the market.  On their marketing website they list 15-20 other brands they tested and found to be less potent…but then again, a little bit is better than nada.  (They also have a nice program one can sign-up for where they automatically send a 30-day supply every month, at a discounted rate—no shipping charge.)

 

Regarding the juices, literature says the best anti-oxidant results come from bottlers who constantly refrigerate and protect from sunlight.  Pomegranate martinis were all the rage in my neighborhood last summer; I was tempted for health reason to partake, but passed.

 

“A little bit is better than nada…”  

We did find 100% pom juice at our local supermarket. Not refrigerated; on the shelf.

But, good enough, I guess.

It's not bad (on the strong side). I'll drink 8 oz. a day.

Mel