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Who owns your prostate once it's removed?

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Posted 3/31/2022 8:24 AM (GMT 0)
My husband met his medical oncologist last week and we couldn't be happier. One of the things we discussed was genomic testing of my husband's prostate tissue. He suggested a test called OncoPlex that was developed at the University of Washington. We also asked about having my husband's prostate tissue transferred from the NYC hospital (where the surgery was done) to UW, and he thought that was a good idea. One of the reasons was that the hospital will keep the tissue for only a limited time while UW, as a research center, keeps the tissue forever. (That's what he said, anyway.)

So I called the NYC hospital and spoke with someone in pathology. I confirmed that they still had my husband's prostate tissue. (It's being stored in a warehouse, off-site, because it's from 2014.)

When I asked how I could have the tissue transferred, the woman told me that it couldn't be transferred. According to her, Lenox Hill Hospital owns the prostate tissue. They will cut slides from the block of tissue they have, and send those slides, but they will not allow all of the tissue to be transferred anywhere. She also confirmed that they keep this kind of tissue for 15 years. And then, presumably, they throw it out--but I didn't think to ask.

I never thought about the property implications of surgery and tissue, etc. Is this typical? Has anyone else run into this?
Posted 3/31/2022 9:56 AM (GMT 0)
From what I've seen just now, in the U.S. you have no control over donated tissue (except perhaps for needing your permission if a commercial product is developed from the research), and you may have signed away your rights to ownership in a procedure/surgery consent form. I believe most institutions will send slides or a tissue block to another upon request if they still have it--I think the 15 years your were told is the required minimum storage time in many states.

Our bodies, not our cells? (2016)

Do-we-own-our-bodily-tissues (2012)

Donors Retain No Rights to Donated Tissue (AMA Journal of Ethics, 2009)

I saw 2014 article title about a Canadian court decision that you do own removed tissue.

Anyone interested may want to check for more recent cases--things can change.

----------------------------------------------------

And what better occasion is there for telling the classic story about the very old mohel who, upon retirement, brings all the foreskins he kept from decades of circumcisions to the shtetl leatherworker and says "Make me something nice with these." He's told to come back in two week, which he does. "Here is your wallet" the craftsman says, "Isn't it lovely?" "Yes," says the mohel, "but I brought you jars and jars of skin and this small wallet is all you could make?" The letherworker replies "It's not an ordinary wallet. You rub it and it turns into a suitcase."

Djin

"I have Bright's disease and he has mine" --S.J. Perelman
Posted 3/31/2022 5:52 PM (GMT 0)
Fourteen years into my PCa journey, and today I learn that my long gone prostate isn't really gone. That is news to me, and I learn something new everyday. In a way it is comforting to know that my prostate is still out there in it's own orbit, but not doing any harm. Interesting, and thanks for the post.
Michael
Posted 3/31/2022 6:02 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks for the funny foreskin joke, djin!
Posted 3/31/2022 6:10 PM (GMT 0)
You may find the following tangential information of interest.

Selling hearts, kidneys and tendons for transplant is illegal. But no federal law governs the sale of cadavers or body parts for use in research or education. Few state laws provide any oversight whatsoever, and almost anyone, regardless of expertise, can dissect and sell human body parts.
Posted 3/31/2022 6:28 PM (GMT 0)
It's likely somewhere buried in your informed consent forms that your prostate/appendix/gallbladder/whatever else they cut out of you is the property of the hospital, to do with as they choose. At a major research hospital, there are literally thousands (millions?) of tissue samples that are used in research all over.

For an interesting look at the big picture, read "The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks"--an indigent african-american woman who had a particularly nasty form of cervical cancer back in the 1950's, was treated at Johns Hopkins, and they have managed to culture her cells up to today--and they have been used for numerous cancer treatment therapies for years, and her family has never gotten a dime. If you see a research report that references "HeLa" strain cells--that's them.
Posted 3/31/2022 6:31 PM (GMT 0)
There's a good idea for a horror movie in this somewhere
Posted 3/31/2022 9:30 PM (GMT 0)
Yep,
HeLa. I tended many HeLa cell cultures back in my lab days. The cells from that lady have been a mainstay in research for decades. I think her family is entitled to a benefit.
Posted 3/31/2022 9:49 PM (GMT 0)

centralPAdude said...
There's a good idea for a horror movie in this somewhere

Yes. You wake up one day and find that ....... your prostate is back inside you! !!!
Posted 3/31/2022 9:54 PM (GMT 0)
I read that book ages ago. It was very interesting to learn where the HeLa cells had come from, but disappointing to learn that her family was never compensated. I believe that some of her family members, if they had been given the choice, would not have given permission to do additional research or to keep her cells alive. Today some would argue that it was a good outcome if you consider the greater good. Definitely ripe for debate.

But in my husband's case, if LHH is going to throw out the tissue anyway, what's the harm in giving it back to us, or to another research institute? Looks like we may have to settle for additional slides that are cut from the tissue block rather than getting everything back.
Posted 4/2/2022 3:05 PM (GMT 0)

DjinTonic said...

centralPAdude said...
There's a good idea for a horror movie in this somewhere

Yes. You wake up one day and find that ....... your prostate is back inside you! !!!

Or your walking somewhere, and meet a cloned you....
Posted 4/5/2022 1:26 PM (GMT 0)
Garyi,
"Or your walking somewhere, and meet a cloned you.... "

And he's a real di c k head.
Posted 4/5/2022 2:38 PM (GMT 0)

alephnull said...
Garyi,
"Or your walking somewhere, and meet a cloned you.... "

And he's a real di c k head.

I'm reminded of the ballchinian in MIB II
Posted 4/6/2022 2:20 AM (GMT 0)
When I was in the army I had a minor accident and ended up with a chipped bone in my left thumb. Since I couldn’t bend my thumb properly I decided to have it fixed before I exited the service. I asked if I could have the bone chip and was told that no, it’s government property.
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