Low testosterone count 2 years after PC sugury

Hello, My name is Pete and I just found this site. I had my prostate removed 2 years ago and my PSA is still .01 a good thing but my testosterone is at 150, very low per my Doc. It just dropped this year and with the drop came depression and a state of constantly being tired. My Doc has tryed several anti depression meds. but so far they haven't helped. He told me testosterone therapy is a no no. Has anyone run into this problem? Any suggestions??

Thanks,

Pete  

Hey Lefty, thanks for bumping me up! I see that you have information about your self at the bottom of your post. Is this  required? I don't remember my PSA & Gleason at the time of my sugery but it was very similar to yours. I had mine out at 50. My father died at 52 in 1973 of what I beleive was prostate cancer. Lynph glands to bones but not diognosed back then. This testosterone thing I have now is driving me crazy. I am more depressed now than when I learned of the cancer! I am just so tired all the time and can't seem to get any treatment to deal with it. I work over 50 hours a week and when not working I'm sleeping. I'm drinking over a pot of coffee a day. I hate to sound like a crybaby but I'm at wits end with this thing. I've also posted on several other forums and haven't heard back anything yet. But I'm staying posative. I can't be alone, I'm sure someone has beaten this problem, I just have to find him!

Thanks again,

Pete  

Thank You Swim, I'm 53 now, as I just stated right before I received your reply, I don't remember my Gleason or PSA off hand, I'll look it up tonight when I get home. I knew there had to be others like me out there! My wife isn't going to go for the Testosterone therapy, I just know she woun't. Have you heard of any othe treatments??

Again thanks so much for your reply!!!

Pete

I'm trying, thats why I looked up this forum. I just found out about this in my yearly physical. I told my Dr. I was tired and depressed and he guessed at it right away only to confirm it in my blood test last week. I had been on welbutrin and he changed me to effecsor but I don't think it will help either. You are right about how I am feeling and I will check with a different uroligist but I really had no idea that they do treat PC patients with testosterone, just what my Dr. and uroligist told me. Thanks for your help!!
Sincerly,
Pete

SOME patients are able to be treated with testosterone following treatment. You have a 2 year HX with undetectable PSA's. If your intitial PSA, Gleason score and post-op pathology were all low you may be one of the lucky few.
That's why I asked for them.

Let me get together some places to read later tonight when I'm free. Supposed to be working so I best get to it. Takle care in the mean time.

Swim

Just an update on my history: at 50 years old PSA was 6.6 at diognosis in May 2003, surgury was preformed at Johns Hopkins Hospital, Md on 8/22/03, Adenocarcinoma of the prostate with Gleaso grade 3 + 3 = 6, organ confined with no metastases, margins negative, with pathologic stage and margins : T2NOMX. I guess I lost a year somewhere! It was 3 years ago! I copied this right off my surgury report I dug out last night. Thanks for motivating me to find i!

Sincerly,
Pete

Pete,

I'm still gonna get to some artiicles on Testosterone. Busy getting next years lesson plans written. Gosh I hate it when they get new books!
Anyway, gooooood stats Pete. Your PSA was higher than Paul's so there was probably a little more tumor burden than his but it's the same as Paul's. Best news so far is, it's been 3 years, not 2! Even makes you more of a candidate.


Now, a place to search...one place anyhow. Google a Dr. Joel Kaufman and look for his articles There is more than one version ..A Rational approach to androgen therapy in men with prostate cancer is the title. One site to find it is www.schering-malehealth.de/content/bio_kaufman.htm
There are also articles by Dr.s PK Agarwal and MG Oefelin from Cleveland Clinc on the subject. Kaufman is a Urologist in CO. If your Doc won't be reasonable and at least discuss the possibility with you, switch. My husband told his Doc either "we can work together on this or I will do it anyway." Actually, he would have gon eto Cleveland clinic not too far from here and had his care followed by them. U of M is not about to let that happen...LOL!


As long as you clearly understand there are no guarentees that cancer won't resurface Pete. We do know testosterone feeds cancer but it doesn't cause it. You aren't the first to want T replacement and you certainly won't be the last. If younger men continue to be treated we're going to see more and more men wanting treatment for low testosterone. It's a matter of quality not just quantity of life. Your stats are low and it's been 3 years already. Paul waited a year...11 if ya count the 10 he alread suffered. Good Luck with that.

DIM...diindolymethane or endole carbinole/DIM, the better combination. Comes from vegetables and is used widely in women with a hx of breast cancer to help balance their good/bad estrogens. It's usefullness in men, besides being an amazing chemo preventative, it does help the body better balance that estrogen to testosterone ratio. Some men do very well as far as the DIM freeing up a little testosterone by competing for the same receptor sites as E2 while others just get the anti-cancer benefits. Look in Life Extension for the long ans short of it. men who use T replacement do have more E2 conversion. Most use something to balance that out. Paul uses DIM and it works fine for him. It was originally given to him as a chemo prevention....we KNOW the bad PCa hormone is estrogen..so men, get those tummies down! A good brand is Enzymatic Therapy's Estro Balance. Remember to take a little D with that. It has calcium in it but no D. Antoher good brand is Nature's Plus DIM PLUS.
Gotta scoot, Swim

Thanks for taking the time to give me all that info Swim, I must have writing back Letty while you were writing to me. I will check it out and let you know how I make out.
Thanks again!!!
Pete

  Yeah, I can come up with a few good places to start. Now if I could come up with a way to type without errors!

Pete,

You can expect some resistance concerning testosterone therapy but if you are serious, a Physician will eventually listen. Armed with enough information may change someone's mind. T replacement has long been thought an absolute contraindication for prostate cancer patients. Yesterday's thoughts are slowly changing though it is still a risk so many Doc's refuse to take. I understand why. If there are stray cells they could resurface. Understandable concern on anyone's part. What I understand more is my husband was 38 when he spiraled downward after losing his vital hormone and it wasn't getting any better. Heck, he still got prostate cancer and wasn't on T when he got it although adding it in late 2004 did lead to a diagnosis.

Thank God I pushed him to do something about his low testosterone then. Otherwise it would be sometime this year before he had PSA drawn. He turned 50 and that's the suggested age for testing. Had he waited any longer who knows how aggressive the cancer could have been. Actually he should have never been started on T in 04. His PSA was 2.7 (too high for a 48yr. old) then and should have been investigated before initiating T therapy.....goof Doc! He no sooner started on T when his PSA increased and a biopsy confirmed cancer. As soon as he stopped the T, his PSA stopped rising right away. His surgery was in 4-05.

That was the beginning of my education on testosterone and prostate cancer! I have read thousands of articles and studies on both subjects since and come to one conclusion.....I'll never know enough! Good Luck and stick around. I'd love to know more about the fishing trip and your search for a healthier tomorrow!

swim

 

A very special new Thread: To all my new friends!!!! from Pete Sr. was started....



Make sure you don't miss it!!!!!



It reminds us exactly what this forum is all about and how important sharing is!!!



Thank you Pete for having the courage to step into the sunshine and let it bring warmth and love and caring into your being.............



We will "always" be there for you and other who need our strength.... and at times we may need to pull from your strength…. So always remember how important your “journey” is for all of us.




yeah Please ~ Keep this thread: Low testosterone count after 2 years after PC surgery

going because of the topic and all the information & knowledge being shared!! Others will definitely learn from this journey’s posting as we take the next stepping-stone.

I told you I'd be back................. tongue part2....

Hi Pete ~


After re-reading your postings again… I have to say WOW again!!!



It’s taken me some time to process my thoughts and understanding of things. Sometimes this happens to me and I can’t just sit and type/write something. I have to feel it and then it just happens. Several times I’ve come to the computer to talk with you and my thoughts were going in all directions. Plus ~ I wanted to look at the Reel Recovery Website and understand what it is about!! It is obviously a very powerful / positive tool for helping to understand what one is going through and how one can pull strength from others. What an amazing story of giving by Stewart “Stu” Brown. What a strength to leave ~ for others to

pull from.



You have an inner strength that just needed a little nudging to move you into the s u n s h i n e.

And you will see r a i n b o w s now that you are freed from the darkness that surrounded you!



Thank you for opening up to all of us!!!! Your journey will be so very important for “us” and newbies coming along….



You have taken such “POSITIVE STEPS”…. In very “POSITIVE DIRECTIONS”

and we are so happy to be along for this journey.



I’m interested to know how you found out about Reel Recovery? Who ever directed you to this program obviously knew you were suffering silently… and that person deserves a huge HUG!!!!!! So here’s one for you and one for the person who set you on the right stepping-stone to move forward!!!!



!@#$%^&* H U G S for Y O U and that ”Special person who led you to the light” *&^%$#@!



Take care and know that we are so happy you’ve joined us.

Hi Pete,

I had my prostate removed a little over 3 years ago at age 47.  My cancer was locally advanced so I had chemo and hormone deprivation therapy.  My testosterone level only increased about a year ago and now seems somewhat normal.  Recently I had implant surgery.  I think I survived all of these changes in my body by focusing on exercise.  Soon after I finished the chemo, but while still on casadex I began running.  I hadn't run much before my diagnosis.  To make a long story short, eight months later I ran a marathon.  It was a great distraction away from all of the chemicals in my body and the surgery.  I continued exercising until I literally could feel the drugs leaving my body.  Lately I've been recovering from the implant surgery and have not been able to exercise and I feel lousy.  I can't wait to get back to the gym.  My suggestion is to try some type of physical exercise that you enjoy and set some kind of goal.  I don't think it can hurt.

Good luck, Daniel

 

Daniel,
That's an amazing story, guys like you are my heros and hopefully will inspire me! At the risk of sounding like more of a crybaby, I have other health problems which limit my abillity to exercise. When I was young I did some really stipid things after my Dad died after a long battle with PC. Lots of motorcycle & car wrecks and an awful lot of time spent in the hospital. I was the president of "the just say yes club" I just din't care about anything and never figured I'd live this long, but God has his reasons for everything.
I'm still here and have a great wife and two wonderful sons as well as neck, back, knee, shoulder, and hip problems for starters. The Dr's say I need at least 6 orthopedic surguries and counting. I've lost count of how many I've already had. To compound these problems, I had to have my thyroid taken out several years ago due to a egg size tumor growing around it. I've never been able to get the right mix of med's to keep me normal with that. I try to swim, but have limited access to a pool and can't handle the ocean anymore. I never thought I'd write about all this stuff in this forum because everyone has problems, and like Daniel, alot are worse than mine. After my 1st post which was this one about my low testosterone I started reading the other threads and reallized how many brave people are here and I must have sounded like a little ***** to most of them, complaning about MY problems. And after reading back over this post, I'm doing it again. Sorry people, I'm just in one of those moods and not feeling to good about myself today.
Pete