testosterone shots

Michael wont use the gel since he is afraid that he will get it on me and it will cause me problems. He is considering shots. Any info you can give, opinions, experiences would be great.

Thanks
S

Hi Susan - I lurk a lot, but have been getting the T shots for the past five months. At my last physical my T level was 240, and my family doc thought the feelings of tiredness and "blahness" may be due to the low T. The doc consulted with my uro before starting the shots, and since I had been in the zero club for 2.5 years since surgery he was all for it. I get a shot every two weeks, and it has made a positive impact on my energy levels. It has also improved the ability of the ED pills to have a positive impact. I had a discussion with my uro at my three year visit (another zero) about the T shots, and he shared my opinion that even low T levels (my 240 reading) more than saturated the T receptor, so increasing my T levels would not affect the growth of any remaining cancer cells (if they existed), since the 240 level would be sufficient for their growth. He also indicated that at the last meeting he went to, this was also the consensus of the uros at the conference (although I realize this is still controversial). I had my T tested about a month ago, and it is now in the normal range, at 680. I didn't consider the gel as it seemed to me that using it would get most of it on my clothes, and not through my skin, as intended.

The shot is in the butt, and takes about five seconds (the T is in a viscous solution, so it takes a little time to inject it). It doesn't hurt, and I have not noticed any adverse reaction. Alas, my muscles have not increased in size either.

I wish you the best as you pursue your options.

If you HAVE prostate cancer, testosterone boosting will speed up the process....If you do NOT have prostate cancer, and feel testosterone boosting has something to offer, go for it...

Judging by the TV ads for "T" boosting products, this is BIG, profitable business....

Once Michael had the surgery the cancer is out. So with the low t, they are treating as long as the PSA stays low, which is why he has to be tested every 6 months instead of yearly. The thinking has changed on this.

Here's my impression of how the thinking is changing.

There is a spirited discussion going on right now in the PC world about testosterone and PC. Everyone agrees that castrate levels (below 20 ng/ml) will halt or slow the growth of non-castrate-resistant PC. ADT works. Nobody denies it. There is also an agreement that a normal level of testosterone (say, 500 ng/ml) will let the cancer grow since the cancer cell has T receptors which the testosterone will attach to and that will activate its growth. Again, nobody denies that, either.

Where the argument is going on is about T levels between the normal range and castrate levels, and to a lesser extent, about levels above the normal range.

Conventional wisdom:

If you assume that the relationship between T and PC growth is linear -- that is twice as much T equals twice as much growth -- then giving a man man with low (but not castrate levels) of T any extra by supplementation would make his cancer grow faster if he has any cancer present. This is the "throwing gasoline on the fire" theory.

Weird-Beard new Theory:

But if you subscribe to the "activation" theory (as described by profman above) then by the time you get to, say, 250 ng/ml (low in anyone's book) all of the T receptors on the cancer cells are hooked up with T molecules and adding more T won't make much difference because the cancer cells have a limited number of receptors, all of which are already activated. This means that if you aren't going to put a man on ADT (castrate levels of T) then you might as well make his T levels normal because it won't make his cancer grow any faster and it will make him feel better.

You can find doctors on both sides of this argument but the weird-beards seem to be making inroads.

G6 patients and G8+ patients get treated completely differently..It is in fact two different types of cancer...The risk factors are completely different..

It seems to me, I you are in the zero club at a 200 "T" level, then you will stay in the zero club at a 600 "T" level...

But this board has documented many zero club members dropping out after 3, 4, 5 years of membership...Does 200 or 600 "T" make any difference in this? Probably not....I just hope that boost produces the desired results....

What is the difference in treatments between gleason 6,7,8,9, 10, excluding AS. I realize the range of treatments and the gleason scores adaptability are different. Also there are camps on both sides of the gleason migration higher issue. This would play into your treatment difference how? Like must things about PCA, the variables and variants are so vast, I just wonder……. I can see it if it was a matter of life and death that you had t cells higher or even better quality of life,{ of course if you recure and need HT, you are back at square 1} you may do it. But just to have the energy, sex drive, and potency of a younger man and to feel vibrant, and i realize that is not the motivation in everyone but, don't tell me that isn'r the target group of the tv ads, and frankly some in the medical system, and for a reason. I don't know……. it makes me wonder. Makes me wonder if it isn't plastic surgery of the psyche.. hey to quote my generation, if it feels good , do it…..

Post Edited (logoslidat) : 2/3/2013 10:29:55 PM (GMT-7)

Susan - for what it's worth, I use two tubes of gel. I put it on in the morning after my shower. I go without a shirt for at least ten minutes to let it dry. When I do put on a shirt it's an undershirt.

From what I understand, at about the two hour mark - it is not longer harmful to anyone that might come in contact with it.

I almost was heading towards the shots cause I got off to a slow start. I'm glad I didn't cause my Uro would have monitored me even closer that one blood draw every three months.. And I would have gotten the shots from him several times till we got the dosage right.

As far as the other conversation, I was past the three and a half year mark when I started T Meds and my PSA had be less than .01 the whole time. My URO said that if I still had PC, I would find it out sooner or later...and that the T Meds would speed up the process.

Now over a year since I started the T meds, I'm still less than .01 .

Gibson,

The study on which my oncologist and I base our hopes for good chances of a durable remission followed men who were put on two years of ADT after surgery. As a side note it gave a median time of 11.7 months after the cessation of the blockade before men's T level reached the normal range. The reason they gave a median and not a mean is because you can't compute an average time for something that doesn't always happen. Only 89 percent of the men ever recovered a normal T level and only half of them recovered it within 11.7 months (one week short of a year.)

So I know it can be a slow process but I do plan to make it happen.

Based on the responses here, I am learning a lot about this issue. I have a appt with urologist tomorrow.
I will ask his opinion on it. I had mine tested about 6 mos ago and was 380. Gp said it was low but caveated that with something about more good kine than not. No it was not chlorestotal test. I am 39 years post op with good pathology, ceptin, gl upgrades. The 4 and tert 5 are concerning re this equation.
Any way I do have an open mind it and after reading my last post feel somewhat fuddy duddyish. Hey, why not have the energy, sex drive and potency of a younger man?? This is a good thread on a subject I knew Zip about. Plastic surgery for your psyche. I will use that line somewhere again…… ps I feel great, good sex drive , but even with viagra, it works but it ain't the same……. alas!

After 14 months on HT, (as part of SRT) I stopped and within 4 months my "T" jumped to 450 and my PSA moved up from undetectable to 0.8....So it was back on HT for me...

It's was interesting that my "T" level went up to 450 as it was 280 before I was diagnosed 3 years ago...I've been told that after 3 years on HT, the effect of the drugs becomes permanent and few men ever regain normal testosterone levels..

I bet if you compared the effect of "Androgel" with an inert placebo, the entire group believing they were getting the Androgel, the effect of the medication would be the same for both groups...

Think I'll stay with what I got, Im good with it. thanks for the input. Im closer to 70 than 69 also.

Dr also suggested that giving my hubby the degarelix injections to lower his testosterone again, would most likely help the pain from the bone mets..