NEW! Gat Goren, Part 4. Now with PAE and LUTS!

Agreed, Dave. In my case, I've been watching my PSA # creep up for the last 6-7 years; not too keen on a needle biopsy, though. Do I have early onset prostate cancer? Statistically-speaking, probably a ~20-25% chance I do; DRE's always reveal a mildly-enlarged prostate with no "lumps or bumps". Now that I'm 3 weeks post-op on my sigmoid colectomy/laparoscopic inguinal hernia repair, I'm looking proactively forward to getting my prostate "issue" resolved. I plan on contacting Dr. Gat VERY soon to see if I can get in the queue for the G-G procedure!

i just heard from gat goren office. they are now doing the proceedure on cyprus at amercan medical hospital. she quoted me 17,000 euros. thats 23,147.59 USD! perhaps someone who just had this procedure could verify the costs. skip airfare and hotels. thanks

I received an email from Olga last night too, verifying that they have resumed performing this procedure in Cyprus; I didn't get a price quote however. All I can say is that I'm glad that I have a bubillion frequent flyer miles!

I am new here. I've been having BPH symptoms for about a year and a half. Have been taking tamsulosin and finasteride and not much has changed. I forgot my dose for a day and did I suffer! I'm considering having the Gat Goren procedure in Cyprus but the cost is hard to deal with. I heard recently about a study in Maryland where some men were treated successfully with PAE. Does anyone have any info on this? Anything is much appreciated at this point. I am seeing my urologist again in May. He wants to do a greenlight procedure on me which I am not so sure of, though of course my insurance will pay for most of it. I suspect that GG and PAE are the wave of the future, though would like to hear others' opinions on this.

Yes rphguy. I too sympathise.

However, I Googled PAE procedure and I saw a lot of encouraging material. The most satisfactory is that seemingly proper bone-fide medical trials are being performed using a control group to determine the true effectiveness of the PAE procedure.

This is in stark contrast to the Gat Goren procedure which has been around for a few years now and whose results are highly questionable. And as far as I am aware, no medical trials have assessed its effectiveness.

It seems that radiologists are taking an increasing interest in a field that was up until now, the exclusive territory only of urologists. Something that I had pointed out at the beginning of this thread.

Thanks for all the info! My e-mail is now visible in my profile. I'd love to hear about your experience with GG.

I have added my email to my profile and would like to hear from anyone who has done the GG or PAE.

Strange. A (negative) comment that I left less than 2 weeks ago has disappeared.

Anyway. I visited my GP yesterday and asked after the situation of another of his patients who had undergone the Gat\Goren procedure more than 8 months ago. The doctor told me that there was zero improvement. I am attempting to contact the person involved with a view to encouraging him to comment here and relate his experience himself.

I remember now that in my deleted comment, I had mused over the difficult fact that Drs Gat and Goren have not submitted their procedure to any proper medical study for assessment as to its success. Or otherwise.

The removal of my previous comment is very worrying as there was also another removed comment by another poster about a similar but different procedure explaining how that procedure had been submitted to proper medical assessment with a control group used to ascertain its effectiveness.

Can someone tell me what happened to my previous comment? This is not a political blog. When this one is posted, I will copy/paste it to preserve it.

ClapTheHammer said...
However, what I relate about my GP's other patient is relevant. The Gat/Goren procedure did not give any improvement.

Clap, encourage your friend to post periodically about his progress--or lack thereof--on this board. All first-person reports on GG or PAE procedures are welcome and appreciated. He might also want to contribute to the master tracking sheet that Nosheds is administering.

Hi Dave and Mr D.,

As I posted around Christmas, after my emergency surgery on Dec 10, I finally (18 months after the Greenlight laser procedure) got a very good stream. I think this is probably due to the resection of my bladder neck and removal of bladder stones during the emergency surgery to cauterize bleeders on my median lobe, bladder neck and urethra. It's only been 5 weeks, so I have no way of knowing if this improvement will last.
As I have posted on the topix forum may times, I can't personally recommend the greenlight for frequency or getting up at night. I still get up about 4 times a night and my frequency averages once every 1-1/2 to 2 hours, around the clock. But what the greenlight did do was eliminate my chronic urinary retention (which required periodic self catheterization) and lowered my post void residual. Now with my recent bladder neck resection I go with a strong stream, about 4 to 8 ounces most of the time. I do seem to urinate a better quantity with a better stream in the evening and at night than in the mornings or early afternoon. Maybe that is related to my taking a single 0.4mg flomax (actually tamsulosin, the generic flomax) around dinner time. With a smaller volume I still get a weaker stream. But I do get a good stream and volume many times during the evening and overnight. Before the resection I got a good stream once or twice in a month. I do drink about three liters of water plus coffee during the day. After years of bph my bladder doesn't comfortably hold more than 7 or 8 ounces, so I don't think any procedure could allow me to decrease my frequency, given the volume I'm drinking and my bladder capacity. Also, I've had frequency my whole adult life, so while the bph aggravated it, it wasn't the cause. If there's anything I learned it's that nothing is certain, there's no way to know what any individual outcome will be. Statistics are just odds. And statistics for all the procedures are very general.
Bob

Chicago Dave said...
Hi Mister D!

I'm a GG patient (May 2011). If you put your email in your profile, I'd be glad to talk with you off-thread.

I bet some PAE patients would be willing to share too. One of the posters on this board, Bob, also posts on the Greenlight Complications board. He is one of the (presumably few) GL patients with a disappointing outcome. He might also be an interesting person to chat with.

Post Edited (Bob_NJ) : 1/15/2014 5:25:55 PM (GMT-7)

I do get a PSA test once or twice a year. My PSA has been climbing about a half a point a year for the past 6 years or so. Individual tests can vary so an outlier should be retested (I've had an 8.7 which retested as a 6.5). Slow moving P.C. is not considered to be fatal to men in their late 60's or 70's, but it is my understanding that a fast moving P.C. is fatal and should show up on a PSA test as a very large increase (eg. from 6 to 12 or 18 in a year, rather than from a 6 to a 6.5 in one year). I may be mistaken, but that's how I understand it, and if this is correct, then the PSA test would seem like a good one to take, if looked at in that way.

DE-Marshall said...
I find it interesting that so many people are getting psa tests. In germany I have never had a psa test. The last one I had was 10 years ago. it was about 3.8.

The urologists in germany prefer to do ultrasound every year. There are so many false positive biopsies plus studies that psa tests don't really prolong life. It's interesting that they are still doing them in the states so frequently. Their are so many factors that effect the readings. Infection, recent sex, and diet. just a comment!

Bob - That is my "interpretation" of the PSA test as well, and how *I* treat its results. Mine has been incrementally climbing every year since I've been getting a PSA test, but the rate of increase has stayed about the same. Had a big argument last year with fired Urologist #1, after my GP got a 6.0 PSA score; test taken 12 hours after an ejaculation and 24 hours after riding my bicycle 55 miles. I advised him that the high reading was spurious due to those two factors - he replied that those events would not really affect the score. Follow-up PSA two weeks later - no sex, no bike riding - 4.4. The defense rests, your Honor...

Michael Daner: thanks for the info on Prost-P-10x. I called the company this morning to order. Spoke to Dr. Geo's partner. He was well informed. We discussed multiple brands of products. I am switching from the Life Extension Formula to their product. He was familiar with PAE embolization but not with Gat Goren.