one of the best ideas ive had

The latest thinking is that colitis is a disease of the parasympathetic nervous system. Do you have any idea or exercies or tips for controlling the signals from this system. The parasympathetic nervous system is very much connected with how we breathe. Incorrect breathing patterns effect this system. Correcting breathing should be via the stomach muscles and your lungs should expand out and in and not up and down. Difficult to break this cycle if you've spent years breathing incorrectly.

Look at a sprinter after they have finished a race and are panting. It is very obivous that they are breathing out and in and now up and down. Their diaprhram always remains at the same height.

This ties in with the Chinese medicine theory of colitis i.e. that there is too much "heat" or "energy" being vented up in the body and that this is causing inner distress. They view a connection between the lungs and the large intestine. Colitis is merely a symptom of an energy problem in the body in the flow of energy from the lungs to the colon.

1s,

I'm assuming that you think the key to remission is because of the posts I had up earlier in the year about mucus manipulation. In going over your remarks I noticed that you think that changing the viscosity and amount of mucus is not a viable option if it doesn't "stick" to the colon wall. I'm wondering how you come to that conclusion because you seem to be confused about the mucus theory.

I'll begin with your statement that you think you are passing "thick mucus." You couldn't be more wrong. What you are passing is EXCESS defectively made mucus that forms in response to inflammatory signals in the colon because of the disease process and inflammation. This mucus comes out that way because it is being produces in EXCESS and thus made VISCOUS, meaning that it may be PLENTIFUL but it is thinned out and extra runny compared to how it normally is. If you bothered to read the posted medical journal references about it that I posted before you'd know that in UC mucus is either thin or absent in the inflammed parts and was shown very clearly in PHOTOS. When mucus is THINNED out( meaning RUNNY) and becomes viscous the bacteria will cross through enmass and further aggravate and sustain the inflammation. The mucus becomes "pooled" in the rectum because it becomes so runny and that is why you think erroneously that you have THICK mucus. In reality you have just more thinned out mucus that is defective that has gathered in the rectum.

Your assumption that you have to FIRST reduce inflammation then the mucus will bond is also wrong. During the inflammation goblet cells are destroyed that make mucus and it's the goblet cells that have to come back before the mucus will be made correctly and as studies have shown, the better made less viscous mucus made by the correct amount of goblet cells, the less inflammation you will have. They have also shown that certain populations of people with UC have anti-goblet cell antibodies. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=9207267&ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

However, there are many many types of colitis but many of them will show this defective mucus no matter how it's caused. We have an ability as people with UC to manually manipulate this via phosphatidylcholine enemas to help THICKEN the VISCOSITY of the mucus, not increase the AMOUNT of thin runny mucus. Will this help everyone? No because of the vast variety of types of colitis. But inflammation in itself will destroy goblet cells and the mucus barrier regardless of the type of UC you have. We can change this ourselves WITHOUT having to take horrendous prescription meds. Yippee. This has been gone over before.

I think we also went over the idea of proper breathing to induce the parasypathetic pathway but I found that the actual receptor it works on is the nicotinic receptor eventually and as we all know taking nicotine has not worked out to induce long term remission for the vast majority that have tried that and this breathing technique would be analogous to that.

I'm not sure your idea about using hot peppers to induce mucus production is wise because this merely over excites the receptor that responds to the stimuli and temporarily at best stops the pain signals. Capsaicin cream is well know to arthritis sufferers and it's no long term treatment because eventually the body figures out a way to overcome the lack of this pain signal and now you have a new pain pathway upregulated that is worse than the original. Look up capsazipine and nerve ablation of this receptor and you'll see what I'm talking about. I avoid any kind of hot peppers for this reason. It is only a short term stop gap and long term it makes things worse.

I'm glad you think that mucus manipulation is a good way to control symptoms but it looks like you think this way for the wrong reasons. Look in the archives here for old postings I have about it. I do phosphatidylcholine enemas and have been able to lower my dose of asacol and my symptoms are basically non existant. I have tried to eliminate the asacol all together but the inflammation comes back as I'm not able to fully cover the entire colon with the enemas yet. Whatever underlying process is driving the inflammation is still there even though I use the enemas. It could be driven by an unknown virus, high phospholipase producing bacteria, antibodies, etc....However, one can substantially lessen the symptoms by getting a good mucus layer down.

Post Edited (Horus) : 10/29/2007 6:37:13 AM (GMT-6)

Horus-- not to hijack a good thread, but are you getting the PC enemas made at a compounding pharmacy?  I have started emailing around to some pharmacies and did you need an rx?  I am currently inquiring around to have them made, but so far no luck.  It appears to me impossible to make ones own using liquid lecithin, because lecithin is completely water insoluble.

 

Probiotic said...
Horus-- not to hijack a good thread, but are you getting the PC enemas made at a compounding pharmacy? I have started emailing around to some pharmacies and did you need an rx? I am currently inquiring around to have them made, but so far no luck. It appears to me impossible to make ones own using liquid lecithin, because lecithin is completely water insoluble.

I'm well aware that if you have it compounded that it can be expensive and a prescription is needed. That is why some have tried this phosphatidylcholine enema themselves. The water route is a bit tricky since
you need to adjust the PH so it won't sting. I find that if one has pan colitis that using water helps disperse the ingredients farther into the colon compared to the oil based fillers. Yes lecithin and water are insoluable and that is fine. One just has to make sure NOT to use too much water and hold the water as your electrolyte levels can be affected negatively. Since lecithin is fat soluable then mixing it in an oil base is fine for left sided colitis as the dispersion of the fluids is hampered somewhat because of the sticky thick nature of the stuff so it makes it harder to get it all the way throughout the colon.

Probiotic said...
Thanks for the ideas. I am asking around to some pharmacies because it basically seems IMPOSSIBLE to get such a thick, semi-solid medium to flow through an enema's tubing. I have considered using olive oil instead of water, but suspect that the olive oil itself would be an extreme irritant. Any oilds you'd cosnider safe? Can you please expand on what you or using yourself to get it to flow?

You should use emptied fleet enema bottles instead. Extra virgin olive oil is not an extreme irritant. How much lecithin/phosphatidylcholine are you using per dose?

Horus,

Well, I haven't successfully made a PC-enema as of yet, precisely because I haven't been able to find any way to get it to flow. The liquid lecithin I bought, by Fearn, is extremely thick and gooey, like molasses. I have no clue what the proper proportion should be, to try mixing it with olive oil. I guess I'll just have to experiment. I do use a lot of olive oil in my food and for cooking, but I also know that if it gets down undiluted into my throat it can create a burning sensation, so that is why I assume it might be irritating inside the colon.

In an ideal world, I'd be trying the enteric coated PC, but as has been previously discussed on this forum, even though that was used in the small but extremely successful ("too good to be true?") clinical trial in germany, finding someone to make those for you is basically impossible. Wish I has gotten into the supplement manufacturing biz myself so I could make my own private stash.

Christopher