stereofidelic89 said...
DBwithUC said...
stereofidelic89 said...
... Forever Aloe Vera Juice, taking a 1oz shot glass as the pain starts, and it seemed to sooth me internally, enough so the pain would stop. Despite whatever science says, it really did help me. Maybe you could give that a shot. :/
Stereo should not broadly present "science" as something suggesting aloe has no benefit. Its regular use has been scientifically linked to a number of benefits for IBD.
www.desertharvest.com/physicians/documents/DH127.pdfHowever, the only benefit that produces an immediate reaction (see Table#3) is the mild antacid effect. So if you do get pain relief quickly (like 20 minutes) you may want to see if you have some sort of GERD or small duodenum issue related to pH.Once again. I'm asking you not to belittle my statements on this forum, in such a way that displays how I seemingly refuse to acknowledge any research. It bothers me that you're on this kick to prove of my ideas and experiences with alternative treatment as unobtainable or imaginary.
Maybe I need to re-word my last subject on how Aloe helped me, from 20mins to an hour. All I do know is that pain subsides with this supplement and others may benefit just as I have during acute stages of colitis. Reminding you that this is a forum of support, where we casually offer suggestions and ideas based on personal experiences.
Stereo I think it is you who are belittling. You are belittling reason. You are mis-characterizing and belittling my contribution. I have never denied that any perceived benefit of aloe or other alternatives did not happen. With aloe (and generally) I have tried to do two things: 1) I ask HOW could some therapy have helped, and can we gain new insight from how it might have worked (e.g., it could be diagnostic, or it could point to new research avenues), and 2) I do push back when people don't qualify testimonials with words like "seemed" or "in my case", especially when recommending something that would have to be working faster/different that currently understood.
I think especially once the question of HOW is raised, and when the HOW is very unclear, that subsequent recommendations should be qualified with "sometimes" or "maybe" or "in my case", but instead we often get assertions like "it really works".
Even at 1 hour, you would still seem to be getting an antacid benefit based on my reading of the research I linked. This might be diagnostic in that it points to the small intestine. Maybe points to Crohns more than UC. It might also point to a better approach of taking a quick acting antacid (something stronger than aloe) when you wake up in pain. It might invite thinking about
what is different when you are vertical vs horizontal. Maybe standing up for a few minutes and taking a shot of anything would have helped a bit.
Even when asking "HOW could aloe work so fast?", I never asserted that something didn't work. It is possible that some unknown component or mechanism is acting as an anesthetic or antispasmodic in the colon within minutes. (Although it would be very useful to know how/why). The strongest thing I have said (other than asking and trying to answer the HOW question) was that I told another member to use caution before giving full face value to your strong unequivocal aloe vera 1oz shot therapy. This does not preclude still giving full credence, nor giving partial credence, nor even trying it to see. I only added that it was unclear why this would work.
Accounts of any therapy that is not studied under controlled conditions, are unable to make any clear distinction of therapeutic benefit from placebo effect (which seems to be >20% for UC), or form delayed benefits of other therapies in use. Placebo is not the same thing as "imaginary", it only means the therapy was not the cause. Also, IBS is often secondary to IBD, and can be the greater (not only) source of symptoms that involve spasms and bloating and cramping. There is an established mind-gut connection in IBS. Suggesting that some of the benefit in reduced symptoms may have arrived via IBS invokes neither "unobtainable" or "imaginary" - but it could be diagnostic of IBS.
Your points about
"support" and "casual" are well taken. It would be bad if any potentially useful suggestion went unvoiced. But these goals cannot dictate that things remain unexamined and un-discussed. I take particular note that you said "
seemed, to sooth me internally". I was glad to see that. But, I was a bit rankled by the "despite what science says". It seemed a jab, possibly playful, but nonetheless a jab. It was also an overly broad/unclear statement. So, I will own that I could have made the clarification that science does not suggest aloe has no benefit without attributing the assertion to you. It was confrontational. Sorry.
I agree that giving folks a rich set of suggestions and options is a good thing. Flooding them with myriad un-ranked, unevaluated, suggestions all presented as equally plausible and equally valuable, is not a good thing. It is chaos.
I think you are confusing any attempt to evaluate a suggestion as a denouncement of any associated testimonial. It is not.
Stepping back, I have now linked to medical research on several benefits of oral aloe vera. You have given one testimonial, and then resisted any attempt to understand what might have been going on. IMO, I have done more to promote aloe vera than you have.
Also stepping back, you suggest that it is the "alternative" aspect I confront, when it is in fact the "magical" aspects. Had someone posted that 12 hours after their 1st dose of Lialda, there was dramatic improvement in their IBD symptoms, I would have just as readily asked HOW that happened. What we know suggests these pills do not work that fast.