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Posted 1/4/2013 6:39 PM (GMT 0)
Luie when did your pills get stolen and do you know who took them? I hope you don't say it was someone that was a friend. Was your home broken into or what?

Susie
Posted 1/4/2013 6:51 PM (GMT 0)
I lived in a boarding house and was moving because I had problems with my alcoholic super, most likely it was him. who admitted to "checking" if my room was clean.
Posted 1/4/2013 9:36 PM (GMT 0)
Ok heres the deal, and this is coming from me as a nurse for 25 plus years as well as a CPer for about 11. When you stepped up to the PA to give urine for testing you immediately told them it was going to be "off" meaning you didnt have something you should have in it as well as the hydro you shouldnt have. Big neon lights go off as to what did you do with your meds? You know what the 1st thought of the PA,s? you either are selling them and they cannot take that risk,or your taking far too many and taking anything else you can get your hands on when your out. Sorry this happens everyday in many offices in every state. Not saying you did this just its their thinking.

Please read my reply to you as I also am reading between the lines here with others and since you have had more then alittle trouble keeping the contracts and keeping Drs this is a recourse for you not to have to suffer thru this with no help.

We really are trying to help you whether you believe that or not. Im done here. Good luck to you.


Post Edited (nvrthesame98) : 1/4/2013 2:42:59 PM (GMT-7)

Posted 1/4/2013 9:54 PM (GMT 0)
Just food for thought..... and please don't blast me for my own opinions, lol.... but I think we need to be really careful calling someone out on their situation. I've seen MANY people get on here and have *inconsistencies* in their stories.... to ask a few questions is one thing; I think that's fine. But I feel like this thread is starting to go beyond that. Again, just my opinion....

I think voicing your care/concern about someone is fine. But... the bottomline - if you don't agree w/ someone or think they aren't doing the right thing.... I personally would just opt out of the thread.

I don't feel one way or another on this thread; just my opinion, though, in how things should be handled in general on the forum.

Take care all.... --Tina
Posted 1/5/2013 5:16 AM (GMT 0)
The truth is not always easy to hear, but to say nothing is an even greater disservice. Luie - your situation sounds pretty rough and I think your doctors handled the situation poorly. Try to hang in there and use this hard learned lesson to make better decisions in the future.
Posted 1/5/2013 7:37 AM (GMT 0)
Tina, I completely agree with what you said. I hope this thread gets locked because some of the comments are going a bit too far and others are simply uncalled for. There's a difference between speaking up out of concern and just plain trying to call someone out. Trying to 'catch' him in a lie serves no purpose - if he has a problem with pain medication, believe me he already knows it. And if he doesn't, well he doesn't. Oh, and a long time ago I lived in a 'boardinghouse' and our creepy super used to enter our rooms (unannounced) to make sure our rooms were clean (as in housekeeping-wise). I lived there because I had nowhere else to go and no money to go if I did. Luie - I hope things start turning around for you.

Post Edited (Splashdancer) : 1/5/2013 1:07:28 AM (GMT-7)

Posted 1/5/2013 10:33 AM (GMT 0)
Totally agree, Tina and Splashdancer. My feeling is that this post violates the rules of the forum. It is not our place to misbelieve anyone who could be hurting or having difficulties.

Hope things get sorted out for you Luie, you are in a difficult situation. Is there nowhere safe to keep your medication?

Jane
Posted 1/5/2013 3:13 PM (GMT 0)
I am just speaking for myself who has been a member here since 2010 and that I absolutely do care about everyone who comes to this board.

I was just expressing my concern over Luie who has admitted to crushing his MSContin/Oxycontin, taking more of the Oxycodone than prescribed, and giving medication of his own to his brother who lives with him, and then now has this particular issue come up...so for me, yes, those are red flags that I think we as a community shouldn't just ignore.

I would rather try to help and have this person upset with me and say my peace and raise those concerns so that they will hopefully take a step back, do some soul searching, and IF they feel they need some help, we are here to cheer them on no matter what.

We have a few members here who are recovering addicts and that does not take away from their need to have empathy and to be treated for their chronic pain. There was one member who just posted yesterday and was very honest about his past of not being able to handle having actual pills to take for pain as he would get carried away and take too many so he is now on the Butrans patch and is absolutely thrilled.

Many of us were just trying to figure out what was going on with the situation and when there are things that don't add up, this is when it causes worry.

Luie could be my son as he is only 22 years old...I truly hope that he can see that we do care and want what is best for him and I will just end this with saying that I do pray that he will seek out help IF that is something he needs.

Post Edited (Snowbunny21) : 1/5/2013 7:54:33 PM (GMT-7)

Posted 1/5/2013 6:43 PM (GMT 0)
I'm also a chronic pain patient and have been following this thread since the first post by Luie. While I agree in some part wIth those who feel there are inconsistencies in the story, perhaps Luie was posting incoherently due to the panic phase of WD. Or maybe the story didn't add up because he/she has a problem.
Whatever the true story is, let's hope that Luie receives whatever help is needed, regardless of what that "help" is. I would say more, but I think I will leave it at that for now.
Hope everyone is doing ok today. Embrace each day.
Posted 1/5/2013 10:49 PM (GMT 0)
Snowbunny,

I have to agree with the last post by you. I also would rather say something to someone than to pretend that there isn't something wrong with taking more of your meds than you are allotted each day, running out early, "loosing" a prescription or going to multiple doctors/dentists/ER's for additional pain meds or ignore obvious red flags that can ultimately jeapordize any future treatment of their painful conditions and in the tidal wave of onslaughts against opiod treatment for chronic pain in the mainstream media, wind up putting each one of our continuing ability to maintain treatment in jeapordy.

One of the things that first attracted me to this forum a couple of years ago, was the no tolerance stance that it took when it came to not following the rules of opiod treatment. For me personally, I have far too much at stake to do anything that might jeapordize my ability to continue recieving the medications that I need to function. Things have changed here, and while I still love this forum and the people in it, I don't post as often anymore because I can not /will not ignore obvious red flags in someone's posts. Especially when it comes to repeated red flags.

It doesn't help the person who is misusing their meds, no matter what the reason is, and it doesn't help anyone else who comes here and reads posts about patients who do abuse /misuse their meds, unless there are posts that discuss the ramifications for doing that.

Sometimes it is not so much about managing pain but feeding a need to misuse the meds and that leads to many problems, for the poster and for all of us who don't misuse them.

My doctor, even after all of the time that I have been his patient would dismiss me and any other patient in a heartbeat for not following the contract. I would expect no less of him.

It is not a right that we have to be treated for pain, it is a gift that we have doctors who are willing to put their licenses, and livelihoods on the line to treat us. It is up to us, each of us to respect that willingness and to work with our doctors to reach a manageable amount of pain relief and to follow the directions given to us on the bottles and by our doctors if we expect to keep recieving the treatment that we are currently recieving.

just my opinion.

Sandi

Posted 1/6/2013 1:31 AM (GMT 0)
Actually, treatment of pain is a right and not a gift that doctors can give or withhold. As patients, we have the right to Appropriate assessment and management of pain. This is covered under the Patient Bill of Rights. In fact, this is posted in each patient room at our local hospitals. It is unfortunate that some abuse this right and make it much more difficult for legitimate patients to receive appropriate care. The problem with internet forums is that we don't really 'know' the people who post. If I were to relate my entire history in pain management, there would be several 'red flags' to someone who doesn't know me. I had a daughter-in-law steal my pain meds (safe and all) - filed a police report, but nothing could be proven. I had my purse stolen out of my car, in my driveway (report filed - found my purse, meds gone of course). When I was married years ago, I discovered my husband had been taking some of my pain medication - only happened once, but it made me a week short. At one time, I kept my meds in a weekly container and kept it under my bathroom sink (dumb, but I was new at pain management). The pipe under the sink broke and lets just say that those containers are not waterproof. These things honest-to-God happened, but talk about red flags! It's not like these things all happened in a short period of time - I've been dealing with chronic pain for close to 25 years. Now, crushing/breaking pills is one thing, and of course a huge red flag - but sometimes red flags are just that and nothing more. My point is that if someone has a drug problem, believe me they already know it. They may not be ready to admit it, but they know. The chances of someone on a forum making someone else 'see the light' and get help are pretty slim. Believe me, no one gets angrier than I do when I hear of someone abusing their pain medications - I have been through hell trying to receive appropriate care. I just don't think an internet forum is the place to 'call someone out'. Just MHO.
Posted 1/6/2013 2:00 AM (GMT 0)
I said earlier I was done in this thread and it looks as if the original poster is not returning anyway.

I kept reading and have to post once more since others may read here and like sb and mrsm stated folks just plain need to know their pm is in jeopardy if they don't follow the rules an so are every other cper.

U have to look at it from the Drs point as well. They have spent ungodly amounts of time in education and an unholy amount of money an their entire life and the lives of their children depend on their maintaining their license. These days an Times that means they have to have patients they can count on to obey the contract,follow medical advice and they will continue to step up to the plate an take on ppl with pain issues.

They do not have to ever prescribe opiates. They can change specialties at anytime. Where then would we be.

This is no joke an here in Florida it's happening everyday,another Clinic closes another doctor retires early to keep from having to be told by a govt agency how and when to treat patients. It crazy here but it's real and all due to those who abuse the meds.

Yes we get upset and yes we get frustrated when someone comes Here posts time and again about running out early,letting them get stolen,crushing meds,getting extra meds an not telling the Dr.

This is behaviors that give all of us a bad name.

So he got called to the carpet? I imagine the road ahead of him without pain managements going to be harder then the words here. And if one person reads here an saves himself this kind of mess then I say we stayed true to what these forums are about.

Vickie
Posted 1/6/2013 2:03 AM (GMT 0)
Sandi can speak for herself but I am pretty sure since I've read many of her posts she was referring to the fact that there isn't anything written that says a Dr. "must use opiates to treat pain".

Obviously you and some others disagree and that is perfectly ok. We all don't have to feel the same way about things.

But this is a place where we do become a "family" of sorts and many people have developed friendships outside the board. We don't know Luie in real life and if I did, I would have said these things to him over a cup of coffee. But we only know him on here so that is why I felt the need to say something based on the totality of his posts...not just one or two. I took great time to go read every single one of them and even prayed about whether I would say something.

So, I don't take this lightly and as I said, we are here for people no matter what. To just let something go and pretend it doesn't exist is not the way that I handle things when there is a pattern that is recognized by quite a few people. As long as we all abide by the forum rules that is what matters.

Because I have also been in PM for quite a long time...it is foolish to think that every single person is taking their medication as prescribed and that there aren't a few people that start going down the wrong path with them. I would rather speak up now, while he is young at 22 (or to anyone) to try and ask him to see if he thinks this may be happening. I disagree that people "always" know and can see this themselves.

This is the first time I have ever done something like this in all my years and posts so that is why I said it wasn't on some "whim" to call someone out. Luie does not have an email listed so that is why I chose here. And as you said...it may be a slim chance that it will help but I would rather take that chance than just do nothing.

This will be my last post on this particular subject as going back/forth is pointless. We all aren't going to agree on this subject.

This isn't about judgment, it's not about belittling someone, it's not about telling them they don't belong here. It's done with care to hope it may be a wake up call to them to reach out for support.
Posted 1/6/2013 2:36 AM (GMT 0)
And this is the last I will be writing on this topic. I was responding to the sentence: It is not a right that we have to be treated for pain, it is a gift that we have doctors who are willing to put their licenses, and livelihoods on the line to treat us. Nothing said about opiates in particular. I responded with: Actually, treatment of pain is a right and not a gift that doctors can give or withhold. As patients, we have the right to "appropriate assessment and management of pain". I did not say nor imply that physicians are required to treat patients with narcotic medications. Just wanted to clear that up. And I do stand by my belief that most people who have a drug addiction know that they do; it just takes some of them longer to face/admit it than others.

Post Edited (Splashdancer) : 1/5/2013 7:40:14 PM (GMT-7)

Posted 1/6/2013 4:32 AM (GMT 0)
I would try to get into a detox. They will help you with some meds while you are detoxing. We can do that in Canada, but I don't know if you can in the USA.

Good luck, I feel for you.
Posted 1/6/2013 5:08 AM (GMT 0)
Thanks SB, you are correct in stating that I meant pain treatment using opiods. " Treatments are still determined by a physicians and there is no law or ruling that says that a doctor must use opiods to treat pain. The "standards of care" ,are just that....standards but nothing says any physician must follow them in all cases.
The fact most of us have doctors who are willing to take a chance to prescribe opiods as part of our particular treatment plan is a gift. A gift of trust and belief in what we are telling them is true.
I also have many many years experience in being treated, and at times undertreated for pain and I know that most all of us will have something in our histories somewhere that might set off one of those dreaded red flags at least once so like SB, I take the time to go back and read a poster's previous posts to be as certain as I can be before I say something but as I said in my other post, I would rather caution someone about behaviours that may get them dismissed from pm care than to turn a blind eye to it.
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