Update After Ain Nerve Transfer

I thought I may respond here as it has been a while and that thread is old plus only 3 members reply .My latest nerve conduction studies from February reveal only very minor muscle innervation but clinically there is no noticeable improvements.
The evidence of that is primarily from the AIN nerve so it has Taken 9 month's to reach my hand which is incredible slow as there has been patient's that had 3 and6 months but mine was very slow. Question
is are my motor end plates still alive? This all began last Feb and 10 weeks later I was operated on.
So basically my hand would have been deinnervated for a year I just don't know if the motor end plates are alive so that when my native nerve reaches the hand I have some chance of recovering.

Could my native ulnar nerve not recover? My original compression was bad but not severe. I talk to a female my age on Instagram and her nerve was almost severed due to her severity of her compresion.18 months since her Surgery or Just a Decompression and Transposition she is starting to recover. No nerve Transfer for her like me. Do I still have a chance?

Hi Stray dog

Sorry i didn't think anybody would reply some of my older posts i did have some good replies from some other members from time to time or post to post.
As much as i would like to see or get Answers from all the Dr's i see i get nowhere with most of them. I have one Neurologist who says it's early another who says it not going to recover and that i still have a left good hand which is not exactly making me feel better. One Hand surgeon who says he did the right job then two other hand surgeons who say my nerve should have been transposed not just decompressed then another Dr who practices PRP and Stemcells say i need Hydro Di section for scar tissue then all the other Dr's disagreeing it never ends so i don't know who to listen to? i think all of them are full of s... in their own ways just dreamers that don't think it's a problem well if any of them had it they would not be doing the job they do. I am not saying their all bad i just can't trust them. And it seems that this operation i had is so rare there is almost nobody that has it. I spoke to a couple people on Instagram but as they recover they stop replying so i don't even bother contacting them.

I spoke to some guy on you tube who has had this and he really irritates me as he likes posting on you tube replies but every time i ask for his email he says give me your email like why be difficult.
He claims the whole thing was a total failure and that he was bribed into the AIN nerve transfer which i can't see how that is possible as the USA has the most stringent polices in the Medical field i have ever scene nothing like Australia.
Then others who i feel deeply sorry for are people i have seen commenting on this operation on video clips they are from third world countries and are begging for the Dr's who upload them for information. I have helped by giving information and i get swarmed with them.
Basically it's like saying if your in a situation there is no way out

Hi Sarge. Good to hear the nerve has grown. Slow and steady wins the race. I know, easy for me to say to be patient...I'm not in your shoes...but at least this IS progress. Not getting the result we want is so very hard to deal with. My surgery for the supra spinatus tendon didn't go very well. The surgeon had shaved the collar bone so much, my body reabsorbed the rest! This caused the tendons to be 'hanging on by a thread' literally. To make matters worse, I was hit by a pickup truck while walking my emotional support animal and tore the labrum in the same shoulder! Then, 2 months later, got knocked down at the dog park by my daughters dog, causing a grade 5 separation of the same shoulder! Each day, I'm in pain and worried that the next mishap will tear what little remains and I will lose the use of my right arm. It's overwhelming at times.

One day at a time...it's the only way to live after all.

Hi Sarge.

I was struck by the pick-up in Feb of 2015. The fall at the dogpark was in April of the same year. I went to physical therapy. They wanted to do an exploratory surgery for the torn labrum. When I asked if that would 'fix' me...they said 'no'. So, what was the point of opening me to possible infection, more scar tissue, possible loss of function?

A couple of years ago, I went for a consult with another shoulder surgeon, as my separation has been getting more problematic for me...mostly pain. He said he could use cadaver tissue to attempt to tie the collar bone down, but I would lose some range of motion as a result...and it was only a 50/50 chance that it would work at all considering how long it had been in this position of elevation. I appreciated him disclosing the possibility of failure and decided it was not worth the risks.

If I am not mindful of it's condition and over use or strain it...the result is excruciating pain the following few days...unrelenting ache...distinct rise of the collar bone...and the ever present risk of rupturing the remaining ligaments. Should that happen...I would not be able to lift my arm at all at the shoulder. A horrifying prospect.

However...I refuse to wrap myself in bubble wrap and not do the things that bring me joy and satisfaction. It is still a stumbling block for me to ask for help...but I am learning to do so with certain chores. I am blessed with a grandson living here with me, who is more than happy to help his grandma when I ask.

Time and fate will determine just how long I can continue to do most things for myself.

Things ebb and flow on message boards. I chose not to have the surgery as it was not worth the risk. I had gone back in to physical therapy to try to strengthen the joint but wound up in worse pain...all over...so any rehab afterwards would have been just too much as well.

I have my garden set up to be less work now. Drought tolerant plants, native plants, fewer potted plants, less watering...dragging the hose around. I have some ornamental grasses I want removed and will be putting my grandson to work on it next week.

It's not how I pictured my life but I've mostly adjusted to it as it has turned out. My sister is my nemesis. She comments about my situation..."Don't you feel guilty suing your boss?" "Surely there is some kind of work you can do!" Too many people don't understand Worker's Compensation and that SSD determines whether a person can do 'substantial' work, meaning 40 hrs a week at a decent wage. I was determined to be too old, not educated enough, too damaged physically as well as mentally...not employable. I don't take many of the calls from my sister anymore!

I'll keep hoping for improvement for you!

Hello Again and i hope somebody with this AIN nerve transfer responds as there have been a few with it.

My Latest T4 MRI of my right hand shows that my right hand muscles are still alive or innervated ! as the AIN nerve is keeping them alive but it is by no means replacing the Function of the Ulnar nerve. It has been 14 months since my two surgeries and to date i have not recovered just some improvement in the hand with what i could already do

I have looked into PEMF therapy as apparently it can help with peripheral nerve regeneration but i have not had my first session yet.

has anyone else heard of this Therapy? and if so please give some in light on it.
The Low level lazer therapy i have been doing for over a year has done NOTHING! as even i have seen the best practitioner in Australia for it and i know it hasn't helped as i would have seen more by now.

I still have conflicting points of view as my Nerve Trauma Dr says i won't heal and Two very Experienced Hand Micro Surgeons say i will,so at this point of course my doubts are towards me healing as it has been 14 months but there is still some hope i have.

I know that if my nerve is touched around the elbow i have unpleasant feeling but it does not radiate towards the hand as it use to. My nerve has gone down in the swelling and the fact i feel that it must be alive but i still am yet to get nerve pain and even that i am told that nerve pain is not always present in nerve healing.

I am just left still confused and uncertain as i feel still i have gone nowhere and do not know what i should stick to. These Dr's i see all say different things so evidently i am vulnerable to anything that is said


Sadly i have been drinking more alcohol to relieve my stress and i have asked a Sports Dr who is very educated that does alcohol effect peripheral nerve regeneration? and he says no while the online Dr's say yes??? so again confused at which is right. I am no alcoholic but it does relieve some of my stress. If somebody could shed some light i would be most grateful

Hi Susie thank you for responding

In regards who to choose if only the three all talked i know both hand Surgeons do as they are friends but not the Nerve Trauma Neurologist.

Really? so this PEMF therapy is basically just to waste money as there is nothing behind it? and i was so hoping it would help after talking to person on Instagram about it.
i do not drink to heavy just a little more then usual though i am quite active as i run my sisters dog 4 times a week each time for nearly 5 miles of course with walking and jogging combined.he makes me happy as he is an Australian Breed Border Collie.

I have heard they are good and bad so i can't know if i even am taking to a real Dr as the Dr's online flood the JustAnswer Page

Would be so nice if the old members could post just to see how they are doing,has the older ones posted anything?

Hi Susie

Yep i i totally get where your coming from as an Online Dr can just be really good at sourcing information then wording it right. Me too out of all the Specialist Dr's i have seen in Australia i have not seen ONE on the Internet even though there are some online Dr's in Australia they actually require referrals to speak to so they are the only Authentic only Dr's.

Thank you for taking the Time to check if there was anything regarding PEMF as i suspected there wouldn't be anything and there isn't a point for me to go down the path of wasting money on one even though there is a Clinic literally 2 Miles from my House it just would be useless and they will tell me whatever they wan't me to hear.

I am actually looking into EXSOMES as there are a couple places in the world that do it and one is in Florida but again it's only experimental but doesn't carry the price of Stemcells and seems to be more advanced so it is leading me that way.

I did see a Post from a Member AJ he seemed to have a similar problem but never returned and he hasn't. No it is not common on this Forum Instagram see to have a few more that post about it but they are mainly pictures not forum discussion which is what i want. I think i am the only active member that posts regarding this Ulnar nerve issue.

PitMom

That is ok i understand and that is the Annoying part as members who post their problems at first seem to not post again for unknown reasons as this way we can never know their Prognoses and even after trying to make contact there is no response,'

The Closest i had was a member called VD and he had exactly what i had and has come to his conclusion that what has happened to me is not real and that i have been sent to extract information of him where actually i have actually had the very problem of Proximal Ulnar Nerve Injuries and even after sending my Clerical facts through he still thinks i am a Fake?? well no body would fake this as it is just too awful to fake.

Hi Pitmom and once again i am sorry i don't seem to get an email Notification every time somebody responds

Chronic pain illness can absolutely debilitate some people.Yes i can imagine as it is your summer over there in Which state are you in? Sydney Australia always has bad weather all year it changes.. Not really peaceful day's
I will Update which i think StrayDog will get her attention firstly my right hand no longer has an ulnar Claw so that is ever so slowly improving and as the Hand surgeon who did that hand said very impressive as the time that has lapsed has shown the AIN nerve transfer worked and in time the hand will move again and some muscle will be built again.

On Monday Australian time i just had my left elbow the Nerve was Transposed so it was buried under the Muscle and it;s terrible painful right now 3 days out of surgery but the nerve had to be done as i could not let it get to the point of where the right arm got. Just the right arm was only a decompression and i nerve transfer the left arm being a transposition buried under the right Forearm muscle is so painful right now that is why i was prescribed Morphine Sulphate tablets as the pain is Tremendously high as ii also had much Forearm muscle to cut. But whats good is i did not let this get to the stage my right did and now 16 months on my right hand is improving..

Sarge, it's good to read that you are seeing some improvement, never give up hoping. I know it's been a really long slog for you, but this is encouraging.

As for the person that you tried to connect with, I hope you have moved on from that experience. Don't let it drag you down in any way. That's a problem with online friendships, we never really know the person. We don't know a thing about them except what they tell us. Some are truthful about their situation & some are not. There are others even here at HW that were active in other forums & had an online friendship that became toxic. When the online friendship became toxic, it sounds exactly like what you described with the other person. I do not get involved in other public forums, nor am I a social media person, lol.

I do hope things continue to improve for you. It's great that you are updating your journey here.

Hi to Everyone again and my Apologies to Straydog and Pitmom i didn't not reply deliberately i just wanted to reply each time something changes or i feel i would be repeating myself .
To Straydog it's ok Social Media is garbage it causes more issues then it does good so you haven't missed out a thing and Pit mom thank you for your support.
Well i just had my Leateset T4 MRI of the Right Elbow all the way to the Hand and Right Hand,No Abnormalities could be seen the Ulnar nerve is no longer swollen and lies in the Cubital Tunnel,very minimal Scar Tissue and the one we've been waiting to hear My intrinsic Hand Muscles are alive as they Appear normal yes there is wasting but after 3 months of Hand Therapy a very small Amount of my Hypothenar has started to come back and is my grip strength and Somefine Finger Movements.
The only negative thing seen was the Pronator Quadratus showed a high signal as that Has Atrophied as i have had that Nerve grafted to the Motor component of the Ulnar Nerve.
Sadly it will still take Many months but i had many months of being down and thinking of not being here but my ambition is to recover what i can. Yes there still is some numbness but two of my Hand Surgeons say that may take year but as long as some sensation is there it doesn't matter.

Thank the stars i had the nerve transfer other wise being over 2 years when i become symptomatic that was the beginning of the old nerve dying so my intrinsic hand muscles would be dead now had i not had the AIN Transfer. To any other people reading this,it is a very very long recovery and long Road i estimate 3 years and more but it will eventually work.

I still think of the Member VD as his did not work as he had his nerve Cut at the elbow so he needed a Nerve Graft that Failed but his nerve Transfer Worked and he didn't like the feeling so he took it off,i wish he didn't as that would have kept his hand Alive and he could of had an Artificial Nerve Put in place of the Nerve Graft and being a Young man he would have recovered now. I do feel for Him and haven't seen him on other Social Media so i fear the Worst but my news is different. It would be great to see others who have had what i had posting on here so they can share how long it took.

Hi i am back again,Only one month of hand therapy i have been doing and i don't feel much different. My total denervation time would have been a Year without nerve supply to my ulnar hand muscles, now reinnervation has been since Feb 2019 but my Intrinsic hand movements started in December last year. Does anyone know the time limit muscles can go without nerve Stimulation?