warning about the DEA

I'm in VA and haven't had a problem, yet. My pain dr is affiliated with a hospital.

Before anyone starts panicking, let's take a look at the situation

That's gotta be bogus somehow. If true, that would be a bigger stink than gun control. Maybe your pharmacist got a letter for something, but taking away a large part of any doctor's care, like temporary pain control for a broken leg, or a busted tooth, is taking away half of the doctor's toolbox, and a good part of his training.

Now if it means long term pain meds (pain that exceeds the usual healing of an injury), Louisiana already has that law in effect. I think Florida does as well. It's not a bad law, it's an inconvenient law, because someone who specializes in pain would be better suited to handle that.

But if they are saying you have to schedule an appointment with a pain management guy to get something for a few days after getting hurt with a minor injury requiring getting stitches, that is pushing it way too far. I doubt that is the case.

In fact I did a bit of research. Virginia seems to be within reasonable bounds, as any doctor with current qualifications is allowed to prescribe. That's less hassle than many go through.

The DEA rules specifically say "While some states and many insurance carriers limit the quantity of controlled substance dispensed to a 30-day supply, there are no specific federal limits to quantities of drugs dispensed via a prescription. For Schedule II controlled substances, an oral order is only permitted in an emergency situation." This does not mean that someone in the DEA will not take a close look at higher dosages/quantities if it comes across someone's desk. They will monitor the doctor and the patient, but they are looking for illegal activities.

The DEA are cops, not doctors. They just have the capability to cross state lines if need be. The individual states do their own regulation.

In other words, I've found no news stories anywhere about this happening, in Virginia or elsewhere. States have the right to clamp down on whatever they want, under DEA regulations. For example, in Mississippi, you need a prescription for Theraflu or Sudafed, because they have pseudoephedrine in it. Requiring that doctors who are prescribing long term pain management be specialists actually does make sense, if it is a pain in the you-know-where.

LC, as far as I know there is no law in FL that stipulates only PM clinics can prescribe LA pain meds. The doctors that both me and my fiance go to are reputable IM doctors and prescribe both short and LA meds. However, here in FL, if a physician prescribes over a certain amount of narcotics per month, they will be considered a pain management physician and must adhere to certain regulations and submit to inspections by the Health Dept.

Some pharmacists (and physicians) like to 'pull the DEA card' when they decide to implement changes that may be unpopular with some of their customers/patients. They probably think that by shifting the blame to the DEA, it takes the pressure off of them and they are less likely to lose the business. jmho. C:

I live in Virginia, and have had no problems getting my scripts filled.

Splash, OK so in Florida a doctor can turn himself into a pain management specialist? I must have read FL's statues wrong at an earlier time. In fact, what I found through Medscape on FL's opioid prescription requirements, there's very little in the way of restrictions, besides what I would think is common sense. Frankly, I'm a little surprised. What I've heard of in Florida may just be increased investigation and compliance.

But I know in Louisiana, a Pain Management doctor is a specialist, just like oncology or gynecology, and has to have extra training, plus what it required for licensing. And their practice has to be more than 51% pain management cases. But that has to happen up front. You basically have to go through the training before you can get the license. And you have to stay within your specialty. The rest can be internal medicine, neurology, orthopedics, etc.

I know I am new here and don't really know any of you but this subject interested me mainly because of the mistreatment I recently had to be subjected to by a local university hospital for uninsured people. You see I had good insurance and a great group of specialists caring for me until my husband lost his job unexpectedly. All of a sudden I had no insurance lost all of my drs and all of my meds. I had no choice but to seek treatment through free clinics and university hospital. I had a great pain management Dr along with a fantastic urologist as well. Well the university Dr. Had no clue what to do for me and even suggested that I go to another university hospital for research and treatment 100 miles from my home. This u Dr. Referred me to the pain clinic twice but the Dr refused to treat me because he treated mainly trauma patients and knew nothing of my particular disease. So I got passes back and fourth with no one to help me or give me any relief . Finally the university Dr said to me I'm new here and where I'm from we don't have the problems that you all have here. I'm sorry but I'm just afraid there's nothing I can do. I don't want to lose my license. I never went back. I called my old PCP and saw them one time for a very hefty office fee. They refilled my anxiety meds but were too afraid to prescribe anything for pain. For four months I've been trying to deal on my own. Otcs don't help though and I finally got my insurance back effective April. I myself don't know what will happen. I have no clue to what if anything will be done for me. Like I said some people would be amazed possibly that this is happening to people everyday who are Ill but DEA or not it is. I know I am not the only person who has been mistreated like this. I honestly think it. May have more to do with insurance issues than anything else. I can't say for certain but I know when I had good insurance I had no problems with drs or obtaining medication.

LC

I live in FL,

I think what Splash meant is that once a Dr scripts a certain amount of pain meds, then he/she has to then get the extra PM training and follow those rules and regulations, instead of just being able to be a regular "primary care" doc.

I've seen a few instances of docs doing that extra training and certification to be safer.

SE, I just read the article you linked to - and it definitely ticked me off a bit! For one thing, it gives misleading information. This statement, for instance: "A Los Angeles Times analysis last year of 3,733 prescription drug-related fatalities in Southern California found that nearly half involved at least one drug that had been prescribed to the decedent by a physician." Ok, so nearly half of the deaths involved 'at least one drug' prescribed by a physician - how many involved a combination of 2 or more drugs? how many involved more than one physician prescribing the drugs to the decedent? how many deaths involved combining narcotics and alcohol? I cannot stand when people use 'scare tactics' to make their point. In order to educate someone, ALL aspects of the issue need to be presented, not just the parts that fit their agenda.

And then the part of the petition that asks the FDA to restrict the use of pain killers for non-cancerous pain to 90 DAYS! You have GOT to be kidding me! Have these 'doctors' read ANY of the research/literature dealing with non-cancer related chronic pain?? Limiting the daily doses of pain medication? To what? Who decides how much medication 'should' be enough for every single person? Slippery slope, to say the least.....

I sure don't make it a habit to wish bad on anyone, but I'm sorry, I can only hope that one of these 'doctors' comes down with a particularly painful, long-term condition - not fatal of course, just painful. I'd like to see how it would affect his opinions on this subject.

Oh geez, I better stop now - the BP is going up fast!

Post Edited (Splashdancer) : 3/28/2013 5:59:25 PM (GMT-6)

I agree with Splash. I got the same anger over the same BS that they are writing if I had actually been reading the hard copy I would have thrown it to the floor and stomped it. it Its full of nothing but half truths at best.

I don't know which statues or laws are in effect in Florida but I can tell you that in the past 4 years it's some new crap every month. Ma be the pharmacies running scared or shoveling blame,is that important really? The main issue is folks are Not getting their meds or being put thru he** to get them.

I do know one thing for sure and those of you sitting out there somewhere in pain tonight because the very essence of medicine,the Drs won't treat you out of fear? If it was me and it could be one day since I am a non-cancer patient, I would be awaiting in line for the methadone clinic to open tomorrow morning for those doctors are not afraid to treat addiction aggressively and it is cheaper than trying to pay out of pocket for a pain dr whose afraid to give you enough to help.

So what I have to admit a problem, I would have a double edged one after 10yrs of being treated with opiates by a system that now wants to turn their back on me? I've done pretty much everything else imaginable to get relief,a lie by omission would be nothing.

The addicts used my system of healthcare and abused it and brought me to this sad state of affairs and they get better treatment in the end then we will have.

Sorry if this offends anyone but it is what it is and I'm not afraid to say it.

Vickie

Now, here in Virginia, I did have a primary care doc refuse to write me a prescription for painkillers, tramadol. I had been taking it for 6 plus years, and was kind of astounded she didn't want to be connected to that.

Luckily, my hospital-related rheumie has no such qualms.

Then someone needs to tell the media about this, because I have not been able to find a single story in Virginia or any other state regarding this. If this is happening, the DEA is clearly overstepping their bounds, as this is a state matter. As in the State of Virginia, not the Federal Drug Enforcement Agency.

Now your pharmacist may have the ability to refuse to fill a prescription, and not have the guts to tell you to your face, and say "Blame the DEA"

Please post a link to a story where this matter is addressed. I can't find it.

I live in Virginia, I get long term pain management from my PCP-although admittedly low numbers of tramadol not oxy.

My dog is also getting long term pain management-I don't think I will have to take him to a pain management center and I pick his meds up at Costco tomorrow.

Sometimes things just get taken out of context or misunderstood.