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Posted 3/21/2008 12:55 PM (GMT 0)

Ingrid_Norway said...
Hi,
used to post here earlier, but I've been without a computer for a while, have changed my nick from Skjura to Ingrid_Norway.

Skurja!!! I was beginning to wonder where you were!!! So glad you're back! :-)
Posted 3/22/2008 3:59 AM (GMT 0)
HEY ISUGAL AND CRAZY HARRY,YOU GUYS SEEM TO BE THE EXPERTS ON THE MAKER'S DIET. I JUST ORDERED A COPY OF "Restoring Your Digestive Health : Joseph Brasco M.D., Nmd Jordan S. Rubin" . FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, IT IS LIKE THE MAKER'S DIET, BUT TAILORED MORE TO CROHN'S SUFFERERS. SO IM GETTING READY TO START THIS DIET AND IM KIND OF NERVOUS. ANY SUGGESTIONS YOU GUYS HAVE FOR ME? LIKE FOR EXAMPLE I NEVER REALLY TOLERATED RAW VEGETABLES WELL AT ALL, SO HOW DO I EAT THEM NOW? ANY POINTERS AND ADVICE WOULD BE SO GREATLY APPRECIATED!!! THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!
Posted 3/22/2008 10:19 AM (GMT 0)

Angievirsep93 said...
HEY ISUGAL AND CRAZY HARRY,YOU GUYS SEEM TO BE THE EXPERTS ON THE MAKER'S DIET. I JUST ORDERED A COPY OF "Restoring Your Digestive Health : Joseph Brasco M.D., Nmd Jordan S. Rubin" . FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, IT IS LIKE THE MAKER'S DIET, BUT TAILORED MORE TO CROHN'S SUFFERERS. SO IM GETTING READY TO START THIS DIET AND IM KIND OF NERVOUS. ANY SUGGESTIONS YOU GUYS HAVE FOR ME? LIKE FOR EXAMPLE I NEVER REALLY TOLERATED RAW VEGETABLES WELL AT ALL, SO HOW DO I EAT THEM NOW? ANY POINTERS AND ADVICE WOULD BE SO GREATLY APPRECIATED!!! THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!

To eat raw vegetables and not irritate the gut from the fiber, get a vegetable juicer (sold at some health food stores and other variety stores like Target or Walmart) and drink your veggies (yes, this really does work, and actually can taste pretty good).  Also, be careful of what this book says, because it really is info that this guy found helpful for him so it may or may not be helpful for you too.  If I were you, I'd keep a journal while you try this diet - note anything that changes about your symptoms, pain level, etc. and then you will have a timeline and perhaps patterns to look for if you need to (such as if you think you might be flaring, etc.).

Good luck,

 

Posted 3/22/2008 5:00 PM (GMT 0)
ingrid_norway -

that is pretty much how i make my yogurt, except the cheese cloth procedure in the fridge. i was under the impression that by incubating for 24 hours the beasties digest all the lactose so it should pretty much be lactose free. any liquid on top that separates out is whey. perhaps i am mistaken....



angievrsep93 -

restoring your digestive health is geared to a lot of ailments, just like the makers diet. but restoring your digestive health has a few specific twists in regards to what you are suffering from. i've got all his books (i think) and they are all basically the same. to me it is like a new edition but with a different title. imho, the maker's diet is better. anyhoo, when i started the makers diet i was super intimidated, especially with all the vegetables which at the time were my danger foods, so i wimped out and started on phase 3. i did notice improvements within a few days. but is when i had the chance to meet jordan rubin that i realized i needed to do it from the beginning. upon doing so i got even better. i also realized i was still eating too much grains and sugars, even on phase 3. it is still easy to cheat - evap cane juice/sugar, sprouted bread, etc etc. for me, i've found that keeping all my grains and sugars to a bare minimum is best. as for vegetables, cooking them helps cos it breaks down the fiber matrix. a juicer can be a good idea. dr. mercola and jack lalane really champion the juicer. i have yet to get into juicing as you need the right one, which can be a few hundred bucks, cos they can be a super pain to clean and you need to drink fresh juice, so you cant make a large batch and store it. so when i started the makers diet i had to suck it up and try it, just like it said, even though i couldnt tolerate lettuce and a lot of vegetables. but i did it anyway, in small portions at first. i found i was able to eat them no problem. now my danger foods are opposite: good = fruits and veggies ; bad = bread, grains, sugars. but we are all different so you may encounter problems i did not. eat what you can tolerate, but do try it. and start out small. it may be a good idea to use digestive enzymes too. i take 1-3 with each meal. the garden of life brand is good. i suggest starting with that. keeping a food journal is a fantastic idea. i did one too. it is tedious, but it helps. right down what eat when you eat so you dont forget. then if something bothers you in an hour or so later, you can start to figure out what it was and then figure out new danger foods and which foods you can now tolerate. stuff like that. eating gluten free is a good idea. and dairy free may be something to consider as well as i've heard from a lot of people about relief from eating gluten and dairy free. bottom line, this diet worked for me. hopefully it can work for you.
Posted 3/23/2008 8:33 PM (GMT 0)

HI GUYS :)

FOR THOSE OF YOU ON THE MAKER'S DIET, AND IT HAS WORKED FOR THEM, I HAVE A QUESTION... ARE WE REALLY NOT ALLOWED PLAIN WHITE RICE?????? ITS JUST SO ODD BECAUSE RICE HAS HELPED ME BEFORE WITH THE DIARRHEA, EVERYBODY ALWAYS SAYS THAT RICE BINDS STOOLS... SO HOW IS IT POSSIBLE TO COMPLETELY CUT IT OUT OF OUR DIETS? SO CONFUSED........(STILL WAITING FOR A COPY OF MAKERS' DIET BOOK TO GET HERE, AND ALSO ORDERED SOME FLORASTOR, ANYONE HAVE ANY EXPERIENCES WITH IT? ANY SPECIAL WAY TO TAKE IT SINCE I AM NOW IN VANCOMYCIN FOR A FEW DAYS...)

Posted 3/23/2008 9:11 PM (GMT 0)
technically, yes - no white rice. it is high glycemic. the maker's diet gets you eating low glycemic. i do break this rule though whenever i eat sushi rolls, but that is rare. i'll take the sashimi though off the bed of rice and skip it. perhaps go to brown rice instead of white rice? or try quinoa as a rice substitute.
Posted 3/24/2008 12:02 PM (GMT 0)

Angievirsep93 said...
HI GUYS :)

FOR THOSE OF YOU ON THE MAKER'S DIET, AND IT HAS WORKED FOR THEM, I HAVE A QUESTION... ARE WE REALLY NOT ALLOWED PLAIN WHITE RICE?????? ITS JUST SO ODD BECAUSE RICE HAS HELPED ME BEFORE WITH THE DIARRHEA, EVERYBODY ALWAYS SAYS THAT RICE BINDS STOOLS... SO HOW IS IT POSSIBLE TO COMPLETELY CUT IT OUT OF OUR DIETS? SO CONFUSED........(STILL WAITING FOR A COPY OF MAKERS' DIET BOOK TO GET HERE, AND ALSO ORDERED SOME FLORASTOR, ANYONE HAVE ANY EXPERIENCES WITH IT? ANY SPECIAL WAY TO TAKE IT SINCE I AM NOW IN VANCOMYCIN FOR A FEW DAYS...)

Angie....please read my post in this link discussing Florastor. According to everything I've read, it's the one probiotic I would NOT take. Its one and only strain of probiotics is a yeast strain (Saccharomyces boulardii).

https://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?m=1051403&f=17&p=1

I know what you mean about rice binding stools, but the Maker's Diet isn't the only book stating rice isn't good for IBD. Elaine Gottschall's book "Breaking the Vicious Cycle" also excludes rice. As Crazy Harry said, it has to do with the type of carb it is.
Posted 3/24/2008 8:37 PM (GMT 0)
I've been doing a modified version of the Maker's diet for about 6 months, and have had awesome results. I feel 95% better than I did. Right now I'm to the point where I basically don't do any gluten (other than some sprouted wheat), and very very little processed food. I don't do organic (although I did for the first month or so) since it's just so darn expensive. I did a couple of the supplements at the begginig as well, but now have switched to a vitamin supplement called VitaCell, and also I take Manna Cleanse, which is made by a company called ManaTech. With these things I have pretty much elliminated any negative symptoms of my crohns. I haven't had a colonoscopy in 3 years, so I'm not sure of what is going on internally, but I feel less inflamed, and also haven't had any joint pain like I was having before. It really is worth the extra work involved and you do get used to it!
Posted 3/25/2008 3:57 AM (GMT 0)

HI CLICKCHICK:)

YOU MENTIONED THAT YOU'VE BEEN DOING A MODIFIED VERSION OF MAKER'S DIET...COULD YOU A LITTLE MORE SPECIFIC...IM JUST SO DESPERATE, TAKING PREDNISONE AND ON HUMIRA SHOTS, AND STILL HAVING HORRIBLE DIARRHEA...I M WILLING TO TRY ANYTHING AT THIS POINT? WHAT KIND OF FOODS DID YOU START OUT WITH, FOR HOW LONG? WHAT SHOULD I AVOID? ANY ADVICE WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED!!!:)

Posted 3/26/2008 2:24 AM (GMT 0)
Hi Angie,

I've been on the maker's Diet for a couple of months now and have noticed good results. I think the biggest change in my diet from before is more fresh vegetables, more water, less sugar, no more soda, no milk, lots of yogurt and kefir, no high fructose corn syrup, and plainer, less "saucy" foods. Also, I have lots of spinach salads...you can put anything on a bed of spinach and make it a salad!

Also, just so you know, while I certainly don't think this is your intent, most people interpret things written in all CAPS as being yelled by the person who is typing. :) (see Forum Rules #14)
Posted 3/26/2008 5:46 AM (GMT 0)
Hi upt0106,
sorry I didnt realize about the CAPS:) LOL
When you started the maker's diet, were you going through a flare up? Which foods did you start out with? What kinds of yogurts? How did you eat your vegetables? See, I am still waiting for my copy of the book, but meanwhile am getting so desperate...
Posted 3/26/2008 12:24 PM (GMT 0)
C. Harry, Ingrid and Razzle are right when it comes to the juicer. It is the best way to get all your enzymes, vitamins, etc. from veggies, without all the fiber. It is really wonderful tasting, too! And I take exception with C. Harry when it comes to his statement that they are a pain to clean, though (sorry CH! ;-) ). I've used inexpensive juicers ($100-$150) and mid-priced ones ($225-$300). My experience is the inexpensive juicers *are* a pain to clean, but the mid-priced are not. (The inexpensive juicers also *feel* flimsy and don't have the power of the step-up brands) The two brands recommended in the maker's diet (Omega and Champion) are essentially identical. They are very, very easy to clean and should last for decades. They even have replaceable parts available. I purchased an Omega online for about $225 and couldn't be happier. An important point about these juicers is that they are "masticating" rather than "centrifugal". Masticating is thought to preserve more enzymes because there is no heat exposure to the juice.

Okay, probably more than you wanted to know about juicers! lol.... I just want to save everyone from making the mistake I did. I initially purchased a Jack La Lanne. It was wimpy and flimsy and didn't do a good job. I promptly boxed it up and returned it, researched a little more and ended up being very happy with my final purchase.

I also borrowed a friend's Braun (centrifugal-style) juicer prior to my purchase and it also does not compare.

And yes, you can drink this juice when you are flaring--at least my son did last fall. Good luck!!! :-)
Posted 3/26/2008 8:19 PM (GMT 0)
Angie,

Yes, I was just recovering from a bad flareup...worst in 5 years...I was worried about the veggies, especially in the form of raw verggies and leafy greens in salads...both of which used to run right through me, and cause whatever else I had in my system to get flushed out too...literally.

I stuck quite strictly to the phase one foods you'll see in the book...I think someone posted them here recently..this included a lot of veggies. I steamed a lot of veggies, but ate a lot raw as well. Yogurt wise I eat Stony Farm Organic whole milk plain ...no flavors...then for kefir, I drink the lifeway brand of that, different flavors are available, and they also make an organic version...I get whatever is available at the store...I prefer this as a way to get my probiotics as opposed to a capsule.

Also, I find myself eating a lot of salmon. A great dinner is a piece of baked salmon with a pile of steamed brocoli and carrots with some crumbled goat cheese sprinkled on top. Simple, easy and completely acceptable for Phase 1 of the makers diet.

I don't use a juicer at all...but I do eat lots of fruits and veggies...organic when possible. I also take a chewable multi-vitamin

Posted 3/27/2008 3:25 AM (GMT 0)
Emom - perhaps i misspoke. juicers are notorious for being a pain to clean and taking a long time. the trick is doing your research and finding the right one cos there are some out there which are just as to clean as a blender where all you need to do is rinse it with hot running water.
Posted 3/27/2008 4:08 AM (GMT 0)
Hey upt0106,

thanks so much for your input. I'm still waiting for my maker's diet book to get in the mail. I'm going to try and incorporate eating gluten free with it too. Thanks so much for your suggestions.

I'm going to go to Whole Foods Market, since Crazy Harry mentioned that they have a whole gluten free foods section:) (Thanks so much for all your input.) 

Any suggestions, which breads and/or crackers are better for maker's diet and gluten free? And better tolerated when going through a flare up?

Posted 3/27/2008 8:49 PM (GMT 0)

in phase one you can't have any bread :(

Now in Phase 3, I do have bread made form spelt flour every once in a while...you can get it at Whole foods, but it is expensive...$4.50 a loaf. One great tihng you can eat in phase three is spelt french toast with maple syrup! very yummy and completly makers diet approved! Over all, I have found that my intake of starches has decreased significantly on the Makers diet.

Posted 3/29/2008 12:31 AM (GMT 0)

Hi guys,

Well, I just finally received the book "Restoring your digestive  health" (modified maker's diet.) by rubin jordan. He mentions several supplements to start off with during phase 1. (Fungal Defense, Anti inflammatory supplement, and clay detoxificant.) Did anybody take all these, and if you have, how did you tolerate it? Would I have to take these all at the same time, or have some time interval in between? 

p.s. (about to make the Brasco Broth for Phase 1!!!!!) Wish me luck:)

Posted 3/29/2008 12:39 AM (GMT 0)
when i did an extreme version of the maker's diet, jordan told me to take 3 digestive enzymes with every meal, probiotic, and cod liver oil. no other supplements until phase 3. but that is what he told me specifically for my case...
Posted 3/29/2008 6:32 PM (GMT 0)

Hey guys,

I'm reading the "Guts and Glory" book by jordan rubin, and it mentions something called "30 hour cultured goat's milk yogurt."  What is that? Do we make it ourselves, how is that accomplished? Does it have a specific recipe? What ingredients do we need? I'm a bit confused.... PLEASE HELP!!!

Posted 3/31/2008 8:25 PM (GMT 0)
i can only assume that this is like the scd which encourages you to make your own yogurt. i am guessing he is talking about getting goat milk and turning into yogurt, where you'd incubate it for 30 hours. the problem though is finding goat milk that is NOT ultra-pasteurized as you do not want to use that kind for yogurt. i cant find it, hence all my home made yogurt is organic whole milk as i cant get raw milk to maintain any structure (it comes out all liquidy). so if you want goat milk yogurt, you can try to make it on your own or just buy it in the store.
Posted 4/7/2008 4:37 PM (GMT 0)

Hey guys,

As far as MAKER'S DIET goes, I was wondering whether or not we are allowed to have all those gluten free pancake mixes, gluten free pasta, and gluten free cookies/ gluten free sweets/desserts? Whole foods market offers many of these gluten free alternatives, do any of you ever try these, which taste better, and which are best tolerated? (Also, Jordan Rubin recommends drinking  yogurt by the brand of CONTINENTAL. However, I cannot seem to find it anywhere, anyone know anything about this? Also, Kefir by lifeway gave me terrible gas, anyone else had that problem, any better alternatives?

Posted 4/7/2008 11:31 PM (GMT 0)
i find i do best eating grains sparingly. the way i view grains on the makers diet is as follows:

1) sprouted
2) gluten free
3) whole wheat

white flour is a no no to be reserved in small quantities for blue moon occasions, like a wedding cake. as for those pancake mixes, i would put those in a category between whole wheat and white flour. some are better than others, but they are prepared mixes so be wary as there are a lot of ingredients in there. i found nature's path brand pancake mix to be pretty solid and also taste good. i've tried making my own pancakes with buckwheat and spelt flour, but they dont taste as good as the prepared mix. i admit, i'll cheat with this, but then i only have pancakes about once a month and then i limit them to about 3 palm sized cakes. so the moral of the story is, be careful with grains but overall listen to your body. a little bit wont kill you, but once you start cheating, you break the good habit you made and start rationalizing every cheat and next thing you know you're off the diet. so pay attention when you cheat. and doing so should make you feel guilty, not physically ill if you cheat correctly (ie dont go overboard and eat too much of the forbidden food)

dessert is sugar no matter how want to dress it up, so be careful when eating dessert. i recommend small portions and only a few times a week at best. remember, starches and grains are sugars. i truly believe eating low glycemic is a big key to not just improving your crohn's health, but also your natural bowel health and your overall health too.

unless i am mistaken, the makers diet does not address alternative grains like almond flour or other nut flours. i like to use them cos i am not getting the gluten contained in wheat and they are low glycemic, have all the good stuff nuts have in them, and i dont have to worry about the negative effects of grains on my system when i eat a cookie or a bread made with them.

i agree with ingrid, sticking to the maker's diet is the best way to go. but it is hard, so i feel a random cheat here and again wont kill you, but pay attention to how often you do it and how big of a cheat it is (ie quantity of the bad food you eat). the more you stray, the less the benefits of the diet you'll see. so there is fine line we must all find for ourselves as eating is a pleasurable and social activity to be enjoyed, otherwise food wouldnt taste so gosh darn good.

i too have heard about people going into remission eating gluten free. in fact i met one such person at my local ccfa chapter. so there is something to gluten free. both makers and scd touch on this and is why if i cant get sprouted grain, i go gluten free.

as for yogurt, lifeway kefir is better than helios, the other brand jordan recommends. i say this cos lifeway doesnt have FOS which is illegal on the scd. if you cant tolerate kefir try goat or sheeps milk yogurt. redwood farms (?) brand are available at the health food stores i go to. granted is like twice as much though, but it is a better quality product. sheeps milk yogurt is much harder to find. i forget the name but it is in a green container. jordan championed this yogurt when i met him in january of 2007 and had it shipped to him special in florida. it is the best yogurt i ever had, but then again it is even more expensive. i now make my own yogurt from organic whole milk. raw milk doest seem to set so i am stuck using homogenized milk. as for cow milk yogurt, i recommend brown cow. it doesnt say organic like horizon or stoneyfield, but it is just as good, if not better imho. check out the brown cow website to learn more about them. but if memory serves, they are sustainable, meaning they are a small operation that follows as closely as possible organic guidelines but dont pay for the organic seal as it is expensive. they are owned by stonefield. they also make non-homogenzied whole milk yogurt. horizon does not. whole milk yogurt by them is hard to find and all their stuff is homogenized (non homogenzied yogurt will state it has a cream layer on top). stoneyfield does make organic, but the non-homogenized whole milk is hard to find. the brown cow is cheaper cos it doesnt have to pay for the USDA organic seal and i also find that it tastes better.
Posted 4/8/2008 6:03 AM (GMT 0)

Crazy Harry:)

Thanks so much for all your advice. As far as yogurt, did you take it with digestive enzymes or just by itself? You're saying non homogenized is the best? Since I am still having diarrhea, how much goat's milk yogurt should I really be eating? When you first started on the diet, were you going through a flare up? Diarrhea?

I'm just so afraid, because in the past all these things (such as vegetables and yogurt) on the maker's diet would literally "run" right through me, and I am in the middle of a bad flare up right now, so I am going to start out slow...Maybe cook my vegetables really well at first...Are we allowed to have cod liver oil in phase 1 ? And if we should take it, how much is adequate? (will that make my runs worse?) Did you ever try the clay dilluted with water that jordan mentions in his books?

I really really appreciate all the advice, it is literally my lifeline it feels like more often than not. Gives me the strength, when I feel like there is none. Thank you from the bottom of my heart. 

Posted 4/8/2008 12:38 PM (GMT 0)

Angievirsep93 said...
As far as MAKER'S DIET goes, I was wondering whether or not we are allowed to have all those gluten free pancake mixes, gluten free pasta, and gluten free cookies/ gluten free sweets/desserts? Whole foods market offers many of these gluten free alternatives, do any of you ever try these, which taste better, and which are best tolerated? (Also, Jordan Rubin recommends drinking yogurt by the brand of CONTINENTAL. However, I cannot seem to find it anywhere, anyone know anything about this? Also, Kefir by lifeway gave me terrible gas, anyone else had that problem, any better alternatives?

Hi Angie...I sure hope and pray this diet will help you!

CrazyHarry answered this question way better than I could have, but I just want to add and reiterate a couple of things. It *could* be that the reason the kefir gave you terrible gas is that sometimes there is an adjustment period of several days while the intestines adapt to the new, "friendly" bacteria and the bad guys die off. This will often result in extra gas. Just check to make sure, as CH said, that FOS hasn't been added to the product you are eating. Also, are you currently taking a probiotic? If so, check it for FOS and S. boulardii (hope I spelled that right! it's a strain of probiotic yeast). Neither is recommended for CD, but thankfully I don't see them in too many probiotics.

We use the gluten free mixes you mention above on *very* rare occasion, but consider them a cheat. Sugar is sugar, no matter whether it's organic, cane, raw, or whatever. Those mixes and/or pastas would definitely not be advised if you are starting in phase I of the MD due to the high sugar/carb content. Once you get further along in the Maker's Diet, I recommend reading "Breaking the Vicious Cycle" by Elaine Gottschall (SCD--Specific Carbohydrate Diet). She explains why she considers even rice a problem for CD--which would exclude nearly every gluten-free mix on the market, I believe.

Again, good luck to you!:-)
Posted 4/9/2008 12:06 AM (GMT 0)
good comments emom. thanks for having my back.



angievirsep93 -

when i started the makers diet i was having a flare, and a gnarly abscess to boot. i was scared to start it cos of what it has you eating. that is why i cheated and started on phase 3. it was scary cos all those foods - the vegetables and eating them raw, are big danger foods for me. i figured if it worked for jordan rubin, why not me? so i sucked it up and gave it a try. if it hurt too much, i could always stop it and go the colostomy route. but seeing his recovery gave me so much hope. i started slow. with salads i had small ones and added the leafy greens sparingly. i ate a lot more soup and began to make some of my own. i was pleasantly surprised that i was able to tolerate these foods. and the diet got me off eating a lot of grains and starchy foods which have been my comfort foods for years. so i was eating the opposite i had been for over a decade. like i said, it was scary.

if you apprehensive about eating a certain food, introduce it slowly in small quantities to see how your body handles it. with yogurt, perhaps just the small 6 oz container or 1 cup per day max. perhaps by eating organic and thus better quality food with better quality ingredients you can eat certain things again. and if they dont agree with you when you first try them. give it a few weeks and try them again or a different brand since your body has had more time to adjust that it may be ok with you now.

when you start, i do recommend taking digestive enzymes with your meals. perhaps 2-3 with each meal until you adjust. then once you relearn your body you can decide how many to take at meal time, if any at all. a good probiotic i think is a good idea too as you'll be detoxing and this is prime time to reseed your gut.

cod liver oil is allowed in phase 1. i recommend the liquid, not the gel caps. get it flavored too. garden of life makes a good one and it doesnt taste funky or fishy. i can take it no problem, didnt have to acclimate. DO NOT get a fish oil. it must be cod liver. carlson labs also makes a good product. take 1-3 teaspoons per day. i take 3 teaspoons in winter as where i live (san diego, california) i am further from the sun and about 1 teaspoon in summer as i am closer to the sun and out at the beach a lot surfing so i get it naturally from sun exposure. too much vitamin D can be a bad thing, but that is true with every nutrient.

i've never tried the clay mineral stuff. i am sure you can find some good stuff on the internet. i was told once puratin's pride is a good place to find that stuff on-line.

glad i can help

:-)
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