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Seeking advice for dealing with depressed wife

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Posted 6/7/2007 7:25 PM (GMT 0)
My wife has always had low self-esteem (since high school). Not so much about her physical appearance (she's beautiful, although she rolls her eyes when I tell her that...and I tell her often), but more about her self-worth as a person. She was adopted and always felt a missing part of herself. She found her birth mother six or seven years ago and we have since learned that the depression is genetic with at least her birth mother. Her birth mother will not tell her who her birth father is (another sore issue that hasn't helped her state of mind).

She has been on anti-depressants for around a year and a half and they seemed to be working so-so until about two months ago. She told her doctor that she didn't feel that Prozac was working for her anymore. Apparently that's pretty common, so her doctor switched her to a 2 week sample of Lexipro and did not ween her off of Prozac - something that I have since learned can cause problems. Boy did it. Within two days of taking Lexipro, she changed into a different woman. She talked of leaving me and our family (we have five kids, one is 2 1/2). She stopped telling me that she loved me and began questioning why she married me in the first place. All the while, she was telling me that I was perfect for her and that she couldn't have designed a better husband and father, but something was telling her in her head that it was wrong. She couldn't describe it any better than that to me.

I called and told her doctor about the change and she switched her (again, cold turkey) to Zoloft. That changed her "hardness", but didn't stop her from wanting to leave.

It's been hell for me - I love my wife very much - and the kids obviously feel it as well. I've been on a daily emotional roller coaster for over two months and it doesn't look like there's an end in sight at the moment. I took her to our therapist and she suggested that we find a psychiatrist who can "design" a drug program especially for her. I think it's a great idea (so does my wife's doctor) and I'm in the process of finding one (not easy) where we live.

In the meantime however, I'm dealing with a wife who's moods go from her wanting to leave (it's an empty threat - if you start to ask her questions about what she's going to do, she doesn't know) to planning our future together with the kids. She still doesn't respond if I tell her that I love her. Things are very strained.

Looking back at her life, my wife has always been able to just pick up and leave any situation that got tough. This time, she's got someone who isn't just letting her run. We have children together and I love her and care about her well being. Unfortunately, I'm the only one telling her that she needs to get some help and get better for herself and our kids, so I'm the face of the opposition for her. It's difficult to hear some of the things she says (like that the life we have is "wrong") because I have to take everything and realize that it isn't her true self talking (at least I hope not!). I am the first person who has ever called her on what she is doing and it's driving her mad. In my opinion (with research and talking to experts in our area), her brain is simply avoiding the tough stuff. It doesn't want to deal with reality and the problems she has with her self-esteem and depression. She doesn't want to have to deal with getting "happy" because she hasn't the foggiest idea how to do that. She simply believes that if she runs that the grass will be greener and she can avoid (her words) taking me and the kids down with her.

Any advice on how to deal with this situation will be very welcome. I love my wife and will stick by her side and help her however I can - even if she fights me. I am convinced that I'm in a situation that may last a long time.

Thanks.
Posted 6/7/2007 7:58 PM (GMT 0)
Singer69,

I'm sorry I really can't offer any advice, I'm newly diagnosed with depression myself although I'm not new to this site as I co-moderate on the Ulcerative Colitis site, clearly your wife is having a really rough time and by the sound of it so are you and your children, but I know before too long someone here will offer you excellent advice, please hang in there.

You are obviously an amazing caring guy, I wonder if you have spoken in depth with a counsellor yourself, because just maybe they can relieve some of the stress you are clearly going through yourself and may be able to offer coping strategies.

And before I forget welcome to HealingWell, it's a great place for advice and support, maybe you could have your wife take a look at the forum, I know for me that writing things down really helps me considerably.

Take care.

Dave
Posted 6/9/2007 2:28 AM (GMT 0)
Hi Dave,

Thanks for your kind words. I'm not looking for any miracle answers. I just want to make sure that I'm not doing or saying anything that may make things worse. That's why I posted this question here.

Rick...
Posted 6/9/2007 11:30 AM (GMT 0)
Singer
First of all I want to welcome you to the forum I am very glad that you found us.
Wow,you must have the patience of a God that is for sure.

For some reason,us as the depressed people seem to take our depression out on the ones that we love.
We destroy relationships because we are so unhappy with ourselves.
We stop loving the things that we used to love,not because of any other reason than we feel that we do not deserve to be happy.
One of the major signs of depression is not doing things that you used to love to do.
And your wife might be confused. She knows she loves her family,but can't figure out why she feels so bad inside.
So,she thinks that she does not deserve you,and she feels very guilty that she is feeling that way. In her mind she might think that you would be better off without her.

Getting her into counseling needs to happen asap. She needs to figure out what triggered the depression in the first place. There might be a million reasons,but dealing with each reason one day at a time.

It is going to be a slow process,but one day she will wake up and be happy. It is not something that happens overnight. Also,keep in mind that the meds usually take 4-6 weeks to take full effect.
I am not sure why the doctor is cutting her off of meds before that and cold turkey?

Also,I do suggest you getting into counseling yourself. You are going to need help on how to deal with her. Plus take care of your own feelings too.

The kids also,they are going to be affected by this..no matter how hard you both try to keep it away from them.

Stay strong Rick,and keep us posted.


Shy
Posted 6/11/2007 1:44 AM (GMT 0)

my heart goes out to you as you try to deal with your wife's depression and keep your family together.

first, i think it's important that you realize you can only do so much for her.  although the depression is dictating a lot of the decisions that she makes, they are her decisions and at some point you may need to detach yourself from the situation - especially for the well-being of your children, who are no doubt suffering greatly from the effects of this disease on your wife.

her doctor definitely did not do her any favors by switching her meds around without tapering.  also, in my experience, some SSRI's can cause agitation.  hopefully you have found a new doctor - i see a psychiatric nurse and she has a much better "bedside" manner in terms of actually listening to me and not just shoving drugs down my throat.

in addition to dealing with my own depression - which was one of the many reasons my marriage failed (my ex-husband was also depressed, so it wasn't just me!) - i also deal with my mother's depression, which she refuses to get treatment for.  at the very least, your wife is trying to get help.  the first thing she needs to do is find a good counselor who can help her deal with the issues surrounding being adopted.  the chemical stuff - her depression - is where the meds come in and unfortunately she may have to try a few different meds and combinations of meds until she finds something that works for her.  it takes time and patience.

i would suggest that you find someplace where you can have family counseling.  you and your children need to be healthy too and although you're trying to help your wife, you also need to take care of yourself and your children.  there may be support groups for family's of people with mental illness - that could be something to help you and your children deal with this.  above all it's important that your children (and you!) understand that this is not your fault, that there's really not anything you can do to stop it, and that it's the disease that causing the problems, not your wife.  of course this doesn't mean she isn't responsible for taking care of herself, but you already seem to understand that the disease is causing her to behave in ways that are "not her". 

i guess my advice about getting counseling for your family is the best advice i can offer.  i know from dealing with my mother that i was basically eclipsed by her depression and your children may feel that they have become invisible because of your wife's ordeal. 

and now i feel that i'm just babbling.... so i'll shut up!  but i wish you the best as you try to help your wife and family - but just don't think that you have to take it all on yourself! get help!!!

Posted 6/11/2007 3:20 PM (GMT 0)
Hi miagolano,

Thanks for the response. The thing that I've been noticing with my wife is that she puts on a great face when talking to others. Her doctor (it's just her general family doctor, so I've set up an appt. with a psychiatrist) says she sounds fine when she talks to her, our therapist even says that my wife sounds clear and seems to know what she wants. Her friends also say she sounds fine.

The problem is that they don't see her on a daily basis and the ups and downs that go along with each one. She uses those comments as an arguing point sometimes as if everyone else thinks she's fine and i'm the only one who doesn't think so. I ask her, "So, last week you told me that you had stopped taking your medication without talking to anyone about it for four days. The next day, you got angry and told me that you were not going to take any more medication - ever - and that I could spend any amount of money on a psychiatrist and I can even drag you there but you won't talk. The very next day, you were calm and collected and told me that you had started taking your medication again...does that sound like someone in total control and someone who is not even the slightest bit depressed?"

She just looks down when I point things like that out. Yesterday morning, she slept until 11am before I came into the bedroom and asked her if she was planning on sleeping all day. She replied, "What's there to get up for?" Again, no one else sees this side of her but me. So sometimes I have to stop and question myself, but I know that I'm doing the right thing by her by seeking out professional help.

The kids aren't in bad shape right now. Her depression doesn't really happen with them directly. Her depressive behaviors are fairly normal as far as they are concerned (i.e., sitting on the couch watching TV instead of doing things around the house, not leaving the house, etc.), so they are okay at the moment. I check in with them daily to make sure they are in good shape. They are all talkative, laughing, doing things, so I'm watching.

The unfortunate thing is that - of course - our insurance doesn't cover psychiatrists, so I have to pay cash. My wife doesn't work and has let a lot of bills go the past few months which I just became aware of a couple of weeks ago. So, I'm having to bust my ass to get more money in and it's tough financially. I may have to sell some things to be able to afford this treatment, but obviously it's worth it.

The toughest thing for me is that my wife sometimes (okay, a lot of the time) turns this into a her vs. me situation. She says things like, "My mom doesn't want to be in the middle of this, so don't call her." I called her mom to let her know what I'm dealing with here (we have a good relationship) and to let her know what I was doing to help my wife out. I keep explaining to my wife that there isn't a middle ground because we are on the same side - I just want her to get to a better place within herself. Then there is the self-sabotage thing that she does. Most of it is pretty simple, but she does things that deliberately disrespect me, and can't explain why she did them. She apologizes...eventually...and then goes right back and tries to justify her behavior. It really feels as if she is just pushing buttons to get me to react negatively. I have to keep myself in check so that I don't say or do something that I will regret.

Oy. Again, thanks for the advice. I appreciate it.

Take care, Rick...
Posted 6/13/2007 12:06 PM (GMT 0)
Rick

When I was going through my major depression and an abusive marriage,no one knew until I finally walked out.

Depressant people are very good at hiding it from others. She does not feel that she has to hide it from you because she knows that you love her and will stand by her.

I really hope she starts to get better. Have you thought about showing her this website for support?


Shy
Posted 6/14/2007 5:42 AM (GMT 0)
Hi Singer69,

I am new to this forum and just read your post. I am in a similar situation and dont' know what to do so I decided to post to get some advice. (see post: Trying to "stand by my man" - advice?).

I am glad to hear that your wife is on medication and has a counselor. I am trying to get my husband to go and have been trying for years. Did your wife go on her own or did you have to urge her to go? If you urged her, what finally seemed to work?

We also have "kids" - one now and two on the way. I have concerns about them sensing his depression and how it will affect them growing up. Do you think your kids sense your wife's depression?

Tell me what keeps you strong through all of this? It is hard for me because the tables are turned. I sway between letting him be the "man of the house" and "strong supporter" because I fear that any insinuation that he is weak only adds to his depression... and then me being the strong on and trying to make him "face the music" about his depression and to finally address it.

I know that you are here to get help for your situation, but appreciate any help you have to offer someone who is in the initial stages of dealing with a depressed spouse.

Thanks, Mia
Posted 6/14/2007 4:50 PM (GMT 0)
Hey Shy,

Yes, I've told her about this site and a few others I've found, but she isn't motivated to talk about things yet. I think that she already feels as if she is crazy and doesn't want to admit it to others or hear others talk to her about it. I hope that changes, because sites like this one have helped me out quite a bit - if for nothing else, I at least get some understanding from people who have gone through this or are still going through this.

As you probably can understand, after hours and days of talking to my wife, I sometimes need a sanity check and these types of sites give me that.

Hopefully she'll come around and see the benefits as i have.

Thanks,

Rick...
Posted 6/14/2007 5:11 PM (GMT 0)
Hi Mia,

"I am glad to hear that your wife is on medication and has a counselor. I am trying to get my husband to go and have been trying for years. Did your wife go on her own or did you have to urge her to go? If you urged her, what finally seemed to work?"

She did not go on her own in the sense that it was her idea. I asked her to go and she agreed. At first, the idea seemed to backfire on me because (as you may have read in some of the messages in this thread) she is good at hiding things from others. The therapist (who has known us for 5 years) actually thought that my wife sounded fine and started counseling ME, as if I was seeing things. When it finally came down to my wife saying that she was leaving (it was an empty threat), we set an appt. with the therapist to plan my wife's exit from the marriage and family (not a fun day for me as you could imagine). Thankfully, I called the therapist earlier that day and simply asked her to scratch below the surface of my wife's facade (my word).

Sure enough, when the therapist started asking questions like "why are you leaving", etc. she started to see that my wife was running. The answers she gave were things like "I'm no good in relationships" and "I'm a dead weight in our family". The therapist was genuinely surprised (I'm not re-thinking her as our therapist if she couldn't get to this place without me having to urger her!) and turned the appt. around to getting my wife to agree to stay for the summer and get some help from a psychiatrist. My wife has been telling everyone that she's just fine on the medication she has been taking - I was the ONLY one who disagreed because she seemed "fine". The therapist asked her the percentage of her life that she's happy and what makes her happy. My wife just shrugged - basically saying that she isn't happy at all. The therapist told her that if she's not happy at least 50% of the time that she's on the wrong medication...period. That helped my case in getting my wife to agree to see a specialist (i.e., a psychiatrist) who could customize a medication plan for her unique chemical makeup.

"We also have "kids" - one now and two on the way. I have concerns about them sensing his depression and how it will affect them growing up. Do you think your kids sense your wife's depression?"

I'm going to say yes, but we try our best to keep things as "normal" as possible around the house. The kids are resilient and have seen her depression up close for so long that they are just riding the wave, I think. My wife has been in the type of depression that she can dispense advice to the kids, play around with them, interact, etc. but when it comes to her own happiness, she sits on the couch and basically checks out of the world of the living. She only does the bare minimum that she has to do each day. She doesn't grab life and enjoy it...does that sound like your husband?

"Tell me what keeps you strong through all of this? It is hard for me because the tables are turned. I sway between letting him be the "man of the house" and "strong supporter" because I fear that any insinuation that he is weak only adds to his depression... and then me being the strong on and trying to make him "face the music" about his depression and to finally address it."

I really don't know how I stay strong other than I do love my wife very much and want our family and marriage to become stronger and for her to feel a lot better about herself and life. Funny enough, she asked me a similar question two days ago. She said, "if I don't treat you well and if I'm so messed up, why do you want to be married to someone like that?" Fair enough. I simply told her that I've seen her potential. I have seen her with bright eyes and a zest for life. They have been brief moments overall, but I told her that I know that she has it in her and that I believe in her. That's all I have.

I should say that I did give her somewhat of an ultimatum that same day. Lately she's gone to that accusatory, resentment, disrespectful phase where it seems as if she's sabotaging this marriage so that she could have an easy out. So I told her that - as I had been saying - I would stick by her for as long as it took and do whatever I needed to do to get through this with her, but if she was going to treat me like dirt, disrespect me, not care about my feelings, etc. that I didn't know how long I could last. She's been much better, but it's only been two days. We'll see.

"I know that you are here to get help for your situation, but appreciate any help you have to offer someone who is in the initial stages of dealing with a depressed spouse."

Mia, trust me I'm more than happy to be there for you as support and a friend who is going through the same thing. I can tell by your post that you feel the same way as me sometimes where you feel as if you are all alone and no one understands where you are coming from. I totally know where you are coming from and I think it'd be good for me as well to try and help however much I can.

Tell me, does your husband refuse to get help because he's embarrassed or does he deny he has any problems at all? The answer to that makes a big difference in the way you approach him to get help.

The other thing that keeps me going is that I keep thinking that someday in the future (hopefully the NEAR future!), my wife and I can look back at this time and that she can be appreciative that I didn't let her just run away from her problems. I really want her to look back at this and be happy that she's not there anymore and that she's finally enjoying life and our family/marriage.

Rick...
Posted 6/14/2007 7:51 PM (GMT 0)
Rick(singer69)

It is amazing to read what support you give your wife.

I want to say what others have said as well, you may should get some help too. Hopefully there is a support group of some kind you could attend that won't stress you further financially. I'm glad you've come here for support as well.

Quote: She simply believes that if she runs that the grass will be greener and she can avoid (her words) taking me and the kids down with her

Rick I am not your wife obviously but that sounds like the way I used to be. I thought I could just drop everything and "start anew" and everything would be happyhappyhappy. Of course, this was not the case, they don't call it baggage for nothing! I'd just have the same problem in a new place. As you said, it seems that she just doesn't want to face anything bad especially in herself. At the same time I recognize other similarities in behavior, for instance the fact that she says she is leaving, but she ALSO asks why you would want to be married to her/stay with her. This reminds me of the way I was with my husband when we were first together. I swear I tried to think of every single bad thing I had ever done (or was bad in my mind) and tell him about it. I was TRYING to push him away, but he wouldn't fall into the behavior I wanted him to, which was PROVING I am unworthy of his love by leaving. He wouldn't fall for it, he would usually say "okay" and have little reaction when I tried to make it sound like I was the world's worst tramp/daughter/fill in the blank. After a while, with therapy of course, I stopped doing it because he wasn't going anywhere and wouldn't play my game of tell me much of a **it I am.

Please hang in there. And try to do something for yourself!
Posted 6/15/2007 1:52 AM (GMT 0)
Hi Goddess,

Thanks for your feedback. I tell you, I'm so amazed (and surprised) at the response I've had from women who have gone through similar situations as my wife is now going through. It's really nice to hear that we're not alone and that the behaviors I've noticed with my wife are what I thought they were. It was hard hearing things from her like she felt that we weren't compatible and that she was questioning why she ever married me and that I'm a wonderful husband and a wonderful father, but that there was a voice in her head saying that it was "wrong", etc. It made me question things myself for a while there.

She has actually been in pretty good spirits the past two days. I'm not sure why, but we've been doing okay lately - no blow ups or arguing. I hope that it's a turning point, but I'm not hoping too hard this early. It's just nice being around her and her not accusing me of something or glaring at me as if I just killed her favorite puppy!

As far as me doing things for myself, I am not in therapy by myself at this time ($$), but I do have a good support system of friends and sites like this one. I do my regular "check and see if I'm still sane" routines every day and that helps quite a bit. It's interesting when I repeat something my wife has said to a friend and they burst out laughing. I have felt so alone in thinking that she's in a bad state of mind that when others have a reaction like that (and this is no offense to my wife, of course) it actually makes me feel good that I'm on the right track in seeking help for her and it gives me strength to keep by her side whether or not she wants me to at the time.

Rick...
Posted 6/15/2007 11:17 AM (GMT 0)
Rick
She is very lucky to have you...alot of people do not have the support system as your wife does.


good luck and stay strong

Shy
Posted 6/15/2007 2:34 PM (GMT 0)
Singer (Rick) You are very welcome!

It is actually helping ME to think that for once my depression has/had a purpose, at least I can share my experiences and hopefully help you feel less alone/bewildered :-)

I'm glad you are having a few better days....hope they last or at least increase in the future

And I am so glad to hear you get feedback from friends..it helps so much to be able to say "is this weird/crazy/etc" and have a friend say yes! and laugh. Not to imply your wife is crazy but I think you get what I mean.

Take of yourself
Posted 6/16/2007 7:35 PM (GMT 0)
Hi Goddess,

Yes, it does help me out tremendously. I seriously think that I'd lose my mind if it weren't for these forums and my close friends.

I totally get what you mean about my wife. Depression does cause those afflicted with it to say and do things that just don't make sense to anyone outside of their head. It doesn't mean they are crazy, per se, but some statements by themselves do sound nuts.

Thanks again for the feedback.

Rick...
Posted 6/19/2007 4:50 PM (GMT 0)
A bit of an update:

My wife has been coming around lately. She started on new meds last week (Effexor and Wellbutrin combo) and coincidentally, she has been warmer and less distant. I really have no idea if it's just the meds or a combination of outside influences (friends, me, etc.) and the meds. Whatever it is, she's been a lot better and we haven't had a single argument about her attitude or any talk of her leaving. In fact, she's come right out and said that she's staying, which is huge.

This weekend, we stayed at a cabin at a lake for Father's Day and she was very sweet and even a bit loving (she's been standoffish for two months). She got me a card and hand wrote that she felt that I was still the man of her dreams and that I was a wonderful husband and father and that she DOES love me (another thing she hasn't said for two months). I'm not running to the bank with this, but it's obviously encouraging. But I've learned over the recent past that things can change on a dime with this depression thing, so I'm optimistically cautious...I suppose that makes sense, huh?

Thanks to all for the encouragement and kind words. Though you are all strangers, your thoughts and caring words have helped me get through this more than you could imagine. It's been a great comfort to begin and end each day reading these forums and even dispensing a few kind words for others in my situation.

I'll keep you posted!

Rick...
Posted 6/19/2007 5:20 PM (GMT 0)
Rick:

oh that's so good to hear! I hope things continue to improve. Yes it's true that depression can be a mercurial thing, ever changing, but hopefully the ups and downs won't be so dramatic. And I'm holding out hope that this is the beginning of a slow but steady climb for you and your wife.

When I started meds years ago, I found that they helped me immensely right off. Within 3 or 4 weeks I felt very different and started to see the light so to speak. Maybe it's not the meds yet with your wife, but perhaps she is at least starting to accept that she has a real medical condition and that may be helping as well.

Please keep us posted and take care.

(I almost typed ROCK instead of RICK. Probably because you've been as steady as one sticking by your wife!)
Posted 6/19/2007 9:12 PM (GMT 0)
That is awesome Rick.
The meds can take 4-6 weeks for full effect,and it is great that you both are seeing the difference.

Keep strong and keep us posted.


Shy
Posted 6/19/2007 11:42 PM (GMT 0)
Goddess & Shy,

Thanks, I appreciate the support. I do know that meds can take that long to start working, which is why I was surprised that there was a change coincidentally around the time she switched meds. Could be that she's just doing better off of the one she was on...?...

I'll keep you posted. Next week is her psychiatrist appt. ($410 w/ no insurance coverage - yikes), so it'll be interesting to see how that goes.

Rick...
Posted 6/20/2007 12:07 AM (GMT 0)
Oh wow...I would see if they have any type of financial program there..or check into your local hospitals,some have financial aid for those that do not have insurance.
And yes it could very well be the meds. It took my doctor 4 or 5 tries before he found the right one for me.


Keep us posted.


Shy
Posted 6/20/2007 5:28 AM (GMT 0)

This is great news Rick and I am really glad for you. Hopefully this can be the start of a new beginning. I would definately check payment plans as Shy suggested. I am not American but $410 ~ £200 and I know thats a lot!

I hope everything continues to improve

Darren

Posted 6/20/2007 5:01 PM (GMT 0)
Unfortunately, this is a private psychiatrist and he does not take insurance. I'm looking into hopefully getting reimbursed some money from our insurance company, but there's tons of red tape and paperwork to go through. We'll see.

Thanks,

Rick...
Posted 6/21/2007 11:42 AM (GMT 0)
Good luck I hope the insurance company steps up and helps you.


Shy
Posted 6/21/2007 4:07 PM (GMT 0)

Hi Rick,

I hope you won't mind me chiming in re: therapy options, but I'm hoping there may be an option available to you that you might not be aware of.  I'm a clinical psychology trainee and saw your post about how hard its been to find a therapist that is affordable.  I'm not sure where you're located but my clinical psychology training program (Albany, NY) had a clinic where people could get therapy for fairly cheap ($5-45 depending on income) and know that many other clinical training programs across the country have similar offices.  It wasn't the best advertised (read: not advertised), but might be a great resource. 

Best to both you and your wife as you struggle through this.  I'm glad to hear things are starting to turn for the better (hopefully),

/Lisa

Posted 6/21/2007 4:26 PM (GMT 0)
Hey Shy,

I called the insurance company and was told that we need to meet our deductible and then they will kick in 50%. Problem is that my wife's plan has a $5,000 deductible. The only way they will cover it is if she gets diagnosed with a list of 9 major problems. From schizophrenia to anorexia. The only one that could possibly be her diagnosis would be major depression, but I'm not sure that will happen. I'm not sure that she's that bad off, to be honest.

Hey Lisa,

I have relatives in Albany, funny enough. Spent a lot of time there in the 90's.

I'm in northern California (an hour north-east of Sacramento), so maybe UC Davis has something like that (it's an hour and a half from us). Thanks for the tip!

Rick...
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