Yet another failed relationship thread

I probably didn't mention the water vole on here then. I knew I mentioned it to someone, but my memory is bad I couldn't remember who.

I'm afraid I'm doing really, really, really badly today. My head is not in a good place.

Had a shower and feel about 10% better, so just to vary it up a bit, I'm going to talk about another guy who also has a 4-letter name: Alan.

Alan was my first and, let's face it, only friend in the area. I'd moved there just over 3 years ago and met Alan in the local cafe that we both used to attend - its main advantage was that, if you applied for a card, you could get a free hot drink once a day. Nothing fancy, only a basic tea or coffee, but that was plenty good enough for me. Free is free, after all. But apart from that, it actually also was a genuinely nice cafe in its own right, set in a nice location by the canal with a great view from the windows. So yeah, we both went there pretty much every day.

For the first few months things were cool, particularly in the summer of 2016. We went to various local places and in the evenings would often spend an hour or two standing by the railings and looking over the canal as it got dark. Alan was an unusual character. He was on the spectrum like me, but he was - outwardly at least - much more jovial and extroverted than I ever could be. He would say hi to loads of people, never stop talking, and come up with endless hair-brained schemes and ideas. He could also be a massive moaner, moaning about other people, the town itself, the lack of things to do... There was a sense in which he never seemed satisfied with anything.

As for the asperger's, that was apparent in his special interests, extreme naivety, ADHD, etc. People had often taken advantage of him in the past, and in the present his scumbag neighbours were still preying on him - the neighbour situation was another thing which got him down and irritable at times.

I don't know when exactly things began to change - I'd say late 2016, but things didn't get really bad between us until 2017. I still feel guilty, because I feel like I changed more than Alan did. The duloxetine which had appeared to work well in 2016 stopped having any positive effect and I became more and more withdrawn and morose. I wanted to be on my own and when I did sit with Alan, I longed for silence to read the newspaper instead of his chitter chatter. I didn't handle it well. At first I tried to avoid Alan, but he was there virtually every day, at the same sort of time I was. We had a bad argument over the ducks on the canal (too long and stupid to go into) and the atmosphere got even worse between us in the cafe. We had a couple of really bad rows and Alan went mental during one of them, getting the cafe managers over, calling the police (who dismissed it: Alan had form for calling the police unnecessarily), etc.

Then Alan unexpectedly got banned from the cafe. I wasn't there when the banworthy incident took place, but I gathered it had something to do with being hostile towards either a customer or staff member - can't remember which. A couple of times after that I saw him about the town, but we never stopped to say hello . A few weeks later I got the news he had died of a massive heart attack... almost one year ago. He was pretty overweight, so in that sense it wasn't an insane shock: on the other hand, he was only 64, so relatively young these days.

Anyway, I know he was a difficult sod, but I miss him too. I would dearly love to have Alan back in the cafe again, driving me up the wall. And this time, letting him know whenever I needed to sit by myself for a while instead of letting the resentment build up - I do think the initial souring of our friendship was my fault.

I feel cursed in ruining every friendship I touch now. RIP Alan - I don't believe in an afterlife but I think you did. I hope you are right and you are at peace wherever you have gone to.

Thanks Karen.

I know Alan wasn't perfect and tried to get that across in my post. But I still feel like I was even more neurotic and difficult than him. I mean, it's over now. Pointless going over it. But that's what I do: just go over and over things, again and again and again.

I'm sorry for the depressing part, but I've literally got nothing left to live for anymore. Not that I've ever exactly had loads to live for, but there were small things which could keep me going from day to day, week to week, month to month. Now virtually all of those things have gone. I not only get zero enjoyment out of anything, I'm actively in a state of mental pain nearly all the time. There is nothing to fight for - no prize at the other end or anything. I start with pain, go through pain and end in pain.

Thank you :-/

I'm not entirely sure how the appointment went. I think I said most of the things I wanted to say, but I was very irritable, especially for the first half - I kept snapping. But luckily the guy (who I'd not seen before, but that was no surprise) kept his composure and didn't take it personally. I do find it wearying having to relate my entire history every time I have a psychiatric appointment though.

He's going to look into olanzapine or quetiapine (Seroquel); he wants to discuss it with the consultant psychiatrist. I wasn't surprised by that, after I had reeled off the long list of antidepressants I've tried. Logically, antipsychotics are the only next step. I'm petrified of the side effects though; weight gain in particular. I'm already slightly overweight and really don't want to put on 3 stone - that will make me hate myself even more. The guy did stress that they would start me off on a low dose to minimise side-effects, so maybe it will be okay...

As for counselling, there's Cruse (a bereavement organisation) for the short term. Whether I can get any counselling on the NHS remains to be seen - psychological services where I'm at seem absolutely useless. At least I can occasionally get appointments with psychiatrists (or, rather, their junior doctors), but psychologists - forget it. They're rarer than unicorns on the NHS.

Afterwards I went to my gardening place. It was nearly over, I was so late, but that half an hour of being there helped.

I just feel so guilty about everything, Karen. I think the guilt has lessened a bit with my brother, partly because I've rarely seen him in the last 10 years and partly because I got to read his last few emails and final words - they were sad and heartbreaking, but made me realise that I wasn't in his thoughts. He'd lost a girlfriend, whose loss affected him so badly he actually moved country as a result - unfortunately for him he didn't like the new country and never appeared to settle into it. He'd also fallen out with his oldest and best friend of 15 years. The spat sounded ridiculous on the surface, something you'd laugh at if the ending hadn't been so tragic. Honestly, it sounded like my brother had descended into paranoia, which was upsetting to hear. It sounded like he had regular (and probably drunken) outbursts at all his friends.

I'm so scared I'm the same as my brother. I have real anger issues, which I've spent over a decade working on. When I discovered the internet nearly 20 years ago it was like it opened up a bottomless well of anger within me - I don't blame the internet for that, incidentally. I think it had been there since childhood (caused by shame, humiliation, etc.), but the anonyminity of the internet allowed it free reign to come out to play.

Well I would say I've come a long way in one respect and literally not at all in another respect.

First there was Alan, a man who in the end I could not control my feelings of anger towards. He wasn't perfect but he didn't deserve that.

Then there was him. First I had a go at his wife on Twitter - should never have done that. Then a few hours later I had an even worse go at him. I really insulted him, called him a repulsive creep and a coward, amongst other things. I can make excuses (sleep deprivation, etc.) but at the end of the day it does feel just like that: excuses. I don't know whether if I hadn't done it, he would have spoken to me again - I can't ever know that. But it can hardly have helped. I thought at the time I had nothing left to lose, but I had freaking everything left to lose.

I know where the abusive side of my personality comes from: my family. They've all been abusive towards me, at every stage of my life. When I was 19 I behaved terribly towards a friend of mine - I was the abuser in that particular friendship. I just want to cut this part out of me, this vindinctive part that is envious and revengeful. Partly because it feels morally wrong; partly because it just drives people away in the end.

Erm... that was another long post.

Thank you so much for reading and letting me ramble, Karen =/

PS: As problematic as the relationship is with my mum, I just don't think I could put her - or my dad as well to be fair - through that with a second child. But it's so so so hard. Particularly when the relationship with my mum isn't an amazingly positive one: I just don't want to punish her and my death would punish her.

Post Edited By Moderator (iPoop) : 5/15/2018 2:10:34 PM (GMT-6)

I lose friends all the time

Well, very obviously they don't mean anything to you if you can make and lose friends that easily. I, on the other hand, virtually never make new friends. And all the ones I do make mean something to me - if they don't mean anything to me, then they're acquaintances at the most.


but in reality, it had to go the way it did. It was inevitable.

No it wasn't. We were friends for five years. I changed, but if I hadn't changed, no reason why it couldn't have gone on for another five years.


If someone hurls insults at your family, it is hurtful, and it makes you question their sanity.

Did you read that back to yourself and think "yep, this will really help a suicidal sister out"?


My sister once told me, "you do not want to be the screaming person in the room"

We all need to scream sometimes, nssg. It's called being human.


but you will find someone who reciprocates in a healthy way & you will take what you learned here, and apply it to that relationship, not lose your head, and communicate better because of all of this

Well maybe. But, firstly, I have to meet that person who reciprocates in a healthy way; if I haven't met them by the age of 43 when will I meet them? I click with so, so, so few people. And trust even fewer.

PS: I'm sorry you're so down about work. The most obvious suggestion would be to try to find another job or even train for a new field of work. I get that it's not as simple as that though, and you would need energy, motivation and probably money to retrain. But if you could manage to break the rut, maybe it would cure that futile feeling of working until you drop dead feeling?

Post Edited (NiceCupOfTea) : 5/14/2018 7:16:37 PM (GMT-6)

Sorry if I was harsh. I would like to see you to snap out of it. Even if the friendship went on 5 more years, it seems like your expectations didn't match, and someone was bound to end up hurt. As for losing friends, most people are not true friends, that is true. I only have a few people who are really friends. One of them I've had multiple fall outs with. Actually when I think about it, all of them, we've had ups and downs. Maybe you guys are in a down. Most of the long time friends I've had arguments with, we've gotten over it eventually and we are friends again. My best friend, we've been friends for 10+ years and we've had a few pretty serious downs, where I didn't know if we would speak again, and now we are very close again thankfully. It can happen. Take it one day at a time.

A new job won't help. It's the tediousness of doing the same thing day after day for money that gets me. No matter what job you do, it's the same case. You can't make it about passion or interest when it comes down to money. I also can't live for years training to do something else, while spending all that money. I would definitely end up in a 100k hole that will never get paid, and it would set me back on being able to have a pot at 85.

I do apologize for using the word harp. I couldn't think of a better word at the moment.

I think we need to be careful about naming this person in this thread. It really should be kept anonymous. It's not fair to him. Hopefully he is okay.

Urgh. I woke up from a nightmare 20 minutes ago. Proper joling awake and instantly turning on the light stuff. I don't even know where it came from. It took me hours to fall asleep and then when I finally do...

@nssg - I appreciate you have good intentions, but somebody like me doesn't "snap" out of things. I don't think most people do in fact, but I am even less capable of it than most. I am autistic, which means I do not respond well to change - resistance to change is a facet of my neurobiology. Not a particularly welcome one, but one which I cannot change through willpower, medication, or any other method.

I can't think of any personal information I've shared about him other than his first name. Which is pretty common one, incidentally, far more common than Miranda. I doubt you could find me on Twitter, let alone him - hmm, I can think of one way you could find me but you'd have to chance upon the right post of mine. (Which isn't in this thread.) I'll delete the link when I find it - not sure if it's on here or the Crohn's board.

I can't tell from your second post if you still think I'm lashing out at his wife - I'm not. I haven't posted on her Twitter since this thread was made 2 weeks ago. I'm blocked, but even if I wasn't, the only thing I would say to her now would be a genuine sorry.

But you did remind me my messages to her must still be there, so I'll go and find them and delete them. *5 minutes later*. Done. They're gone. Had deleted all my DMs to him already, but now all the messages I made on the 1st May to his wife are gone too.

You sound similar to my dad, who also hated work. I ended up with the same phobia of full-time work and feared being 'trapped' in an office forever. It meant I could never become financially independent enough to leave the parental home, and it robbed me of the remaining vestiges of self-respect and initiative I still had. But even with my extremely limited work history (a series of temp office jobs), I could tell that some jobs were better than others and I found one or two that I thought I might even be able to stick at for a few years, if they had continued. Looking back, though, I can see now that I was almost hopelessly depressed and apathetic most of the time.

You sound depressed and apathetic too. Like you got stuck in a rut years ago and have lost the ability to see any way out. It's a tough one. I know, because I experience it all the time in my own life too.

Post Edited By Moderator (iPoop) : 5/15/2018 2:11:27 PM (GMT-6)

Miranda, I just wanted to let you know when a thread gets 100 posts, I lock it. But you can start another thread if you would like. You are so welcome to.

I hope you are having a good day.

Hugs, Karen...

getting by said...
Miranda, I just wanted to let you know when a thread gets 100 posts, I lock it. But you can start another thread if you would like. You are so welcome to.

I hope you are having a good day.

Hugs, Karen...

Curse that anti-spam filter: I'm impatient!

Thank you, Karen. I think I will start a new thread - maybe this time I can even find something other than him to talk about.

Hugs >.>

Post Edited By Moderator (iPoop) : 5/15/2018 2:12:25 PM (GMT-6)

Oh okay, so you've had a diagnosis and tried medication already. That's not to say it isn't worth trying medication again - particularly as you seemed to have a partial response to it before (the being less "doom and gloom"). If you were only on an SSRI before, there are stronger antidepressants which may have a stronger effect. Yes, side-effects suck, but are worth putting up with if the AD works.

There's also nothing wrong with earning less money and downsizing. Some people do chuck in their highly paid city job to go and open a cafe or rear sheep. But most people don't have an obvious vocation or 'passion' to follow. I dunno what you like or what you're good at, but there will be things which sound more interesting - or at least more tolerable - than other things. I think I wouldn't mind working in IT for example, particularly if I could get to move around and not stay stuck in the same office 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. Medicine or science would interest me even more, but I'm not gonna become a doctor or scientist at my age and with my health conditions.

You've got one massive advantage over me and that is, you've got an up-to-date employment history. I'm not saying it makes it a doddle but employers like people who haven't been off work for 10+ years.

I think your mum's advice isn't good by the way. For a start, much as you hate working right now, the polar opposite - not working at all - isn't a bundle of laughs either. It can feel just as stifling; many's the time in the past few months I wish I had had a job to go back to after coming out of hospital. Also, being financially dependent on somebody creates a power imbalance, which may or may not be misused; but even if it isn't misused you sound like you wouldn't be happy with the situation.

It sounds like your mum primed you to have a negative attitude about work as well - so did my parents. My dad by being an utter miasma of resentful, neurotic misery for doing what billions of people do every day and going to work; my mum by always telling me that work was "boring" and I shouldn't expect to enjoy it.

My gosh. If I could go back in time and move away from my parents 20 years earlier than I actually did, I would do so in a heartbeat. I didn't know at the time how bad they were for me, how manipulative.

Hi NCOT, so sorry to hear about the row with your friend and your struggle in coping. Just know that many of us appreciate the advice and contributions you give us all on the forums here! I know you've been through an incredible lot and I certainly feel for you, and wish I could wave a wand and make you realize your importance to many, tell a joke and make you smile even just for a moment. I'm happy that you are getting some support, but know there's still struggle and wish well for you. And it's good that you saw you mum again and it went well

Me and Michelle just removed the user's HW name, and first name to keep it anonymous. We believe you can tell the story and get help from us here just as well by using a him/he or even the first letter of the first name, like C (I hope you don't take it wrong that we edited a just that).

We all have many could've, should've, if I only knews, and so forths from the past. Unfortunately, it's part of learning, more by error than success for most of us, most of the time. I'm an introvert, and never been the most social butterfly by any means, and am never the most adept at it, myself. We do grow and learn by things we've done in the past. In the future it will make us stronger. Right now, it hurts as a loss and it can be dark and depressing. Try to have some hope, as there will be others that'll click too.

I know with the utmost certainty that our emotions are anything but linear and easy to understand/interpret... Understanding the motives of others is very, very hard to understand, and it is likely you and he were equally unsure of what was truly felt or what it meant. If it was clear, obvious, and mutual then it would've been said and agreed on long ago, likely from early on. But it wasn't it at all, rather it was murky and unclear. And for that reason, no matter what, it would've ended the same.

I can understand it being devastating as you keep a tight circle of close friends, and didn't want to lose one of them. That's why you lashed out in part out of fear of loosing that relationship. It is important to be able to identify those tendencies and reel them in when at all possible. It's hard, but practice can help. We cannot control others, and when we try to hard it can have the exact opposite affect from what we want to happen. I know it's frustrating, as many can relate and we've all been in similar situations, ourselves.

The love word is a difficult one to initially bring up. I remember I jumped the gun a bit and the first time I said it to my wife she snickered in return. She did return the sentiment a few months later, but she said the L word took her by surprise at that time as we'd been dating less than 6-months, and at that point she wasn't ready for it. Conversely, she was ready for the engagement ring a lot faster then I was though. She, her sister, and mom, were giving teasing me for a while until I finally did (those whole group of them lack in subtlety and tact) lol. So everyone's pace is different at different times. And the L word, a ring, are things that can certainly can be like a landmine, if you're not sure it's mutual and known by both and at the right time. Sometimes people run, and it's the terminus of a relationship. It isn't easy for any of us.

Value your other close friend, and don't be afraid to look for other friends but give it time and patience. You've made friends and learned a lot from it, and can and will make more friends.

Relationships are another whole thing to fret over, and as a guy I can say we're nothing but endless worry. It's easy to idealize somebody from afar, but less so when they're snoring on the couch and you cannot focus on your book (leave a mess in the kitchen and expect you to cleanup, or any number of things that SO's get bothered by and I've triggered many lol). Try and cheer up, and laugh a little. I'm just a dumb guy, so forgive me if I said anything insensitive above

I don't get what the problem is; first names are used on HW all the time. But whatever; I don't have the energy to argue and won't win anyway.

Nothing is sinking in. I can't take the words in.

I'm tired. I'm tired of feeling like crap every single day because of my Crohn's, I'm tired of loneliness, I'm tired of being tired.

I won't meet anyone else. I never bloody click with anyone else. I get it. It's over. You don't have to keep on telling me that over and over again, folks. It doesn't help. I know it. But it still doesn't help. I just want the OLD, pre-WhatsApp friendship back - forget the declaration of love, it was the dumbest thing ever to say. I know that now.

I just *miss* C, or whatever the hell I'm meant to call him now. I miss him. It's that simple. I really really really miss having him around, even if only in the background, as a kind of comforting presence.

Meanwhile, my life gets worse and worse. I keep on losing people. I can't remember the last time something good or nice happened to me. Only bad things happen to me. I feel actually cursed. I lose people like other people lose pennies. I miss C.... I miss Alan. I miss my brother. I miss the mother who I thought I knew, but don't anymore. I miss the loving family I never had. I miss the relationships I never had. I miss the children I never had. I miss the life I never had.

Post Edited (NiceCupOfTea) : 5/15/2018 3:45:22 PM (GMT-6)