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Posted 11/30/2012 2:24 PM (GMT 0)

Hi all,

I am getting the feeling that talking (posting) about Hansa Center (Dr. Jernigan) is not welcomed and I don’t understand why this is.  I respect everyone else’s posts regarding antibiotics (I don’t even read them to be honest) because I have no reason to since I personally do not believe in them.

That being said, what if mainstream medicine was Alternative Medicine instead of antibiotics?  Meaning, let’s put the shoe on the other foot.   How would you feel if I complained to the Mods about posts about antibiotics?  How would you feel?  Not good right?  Well, same goes here.

I think it’s fantastic that people share their experiences about Hansa Center and Dr. Jernigan.  They save lives.  Did you ever wonder why Dr. Jernigan wants to help others?  No, he doesn’t need the money.  He could have marked up his botanicals years ago but that never happened.  The reason why is because Dr. Jernigan was dying from chronic lyme himself.  He got his affairs in order and arranged for his funeral because he really believed that lyme got the best of him and there was no chance.   But thank goodness he made it and because of that and how he treated himself, he wants to pass on his knowledge to others.

I also want to save lives.  I have known way too many people who have died from chronic lyme and what I don’t tell you is that I cry behind my monitor.  Just recently I found out about another person I know who passed away from chronic lyme.  I used to talk to him and his wife on the telephone and I became very close with them.  But it was too late, my friend was already damaged from long term antibiotics before he switched over to alternative medicine.

Heather’s Dad could have lost his daughter but because he did his research he found out about Hansa and today his daughter is doing more than better!  That is wonderful news!  Nan777 has been ill for over 17 years and she is on her way to being 100% better.   And there are more stories like theirs.

There is no “set” cure for chronic lyme.   But I believe everyone should know their options.   No one is promoting Hansa Center.  People talk about Hansa because they are amazed at how much better they are feeling.

Heather’s Dad uses the word blog instead of post (no one is perfect)...

The bottom line is this:  I respect your views, why not respect my views and others who believe in alternative medicine?  I believe that’s only fair. 

Denise

Posted 11/30/2012 3:08 PM (GMT 0)
I probably shouldn't respond because I don't know anything bout Dr. J or Hansa. I will point out what has been pointed out to me many times in the past: Look at the average life span of communities before and after the introduction of antibiotics. Then ask yourself whether antibiotics are worthwhile. I have friends would take any remedy as long as it was discovered in a 2,000 vedic text. It didn't matter that the people using those remedies probably had average lifespans of about 25 years.

Antibiotics are demonstrated to work through rigorous scientific method. "Alternative medicine" is believed to work due to anecdote. And there is as much corruption in Alternative Medicine, with practitioners hawking worthless botanical "cures" as there is with big pharmaceuticals pushing drugs through the FDA.
Posted 11/30/2012 3:09 PM (GMT 0)
Hi Denise,

You may be categorizing all the members on this forum regarding Jernigan's protocol.  I find your posts very interesting and may be considering this in the near future.  I think, maybe, some of us want a quick fix (my opinion) and I, too, am worried about the harmful effects of antibiotics but this is the choice I have made at the moment.  I am thrilled you are healed and am thankful for all your contributions.  I don't post much but I do alot of reading.  I had been on other forums for fluoroquinolone toxicity and Xanax withdrawal for almost 5 years and had almost 9,000 posts so I am a bit posted out, if you know what I mean.  I personally know of a few friends who have gone into remission in a fairly short time using antibiotics and they were chronic so I am keeping my fingers crossed.  IMO, if antibiotics are not doing their job then it is time to move on to another protocol.  Thanks for your post.

Summer16, Patty  xo 

Posted 11/30/2012 5:23 PM (GMT 0)
Hi Denise,

I, for one respect the right of every member here to express his or her opinion on how to treat this horrid disease.
I welcome information about all forms of treatment,only then am I able to reach an informed decision .concerning my future route.

There is no right or wrong way to eradicate Lyme,it would be wonderful if there were,we would all be cured if it was so simple.

It makes me very sad to read your post,and I truly understand why you'e feeling so hurt.

I love your posts( as I hope you know) and I hope you will continue to delight us with your knowledge and your wonderful humour.

Tickled

Post Edited (TICKLEDPINK) : 11/30/2012 11:13:22 AM (GMT-7)

Posted 11/30/2012 5:37 PM (GMT 0)
Regarding Heathers Dad and the deletion of posts - I notice Heathers Dad has recently rejoined the forum under this name. It may well be the case that if you choose to inactivate your account the system removes your previous posts by default. There used to be a girl called Jessica on here not so long ago. Recently I was interested in seeing how she was getting on and searched for her but couldn't find her or any references to her previous posts. I can only assume that she cancelled her membership and all her posts were removed as a result. I find it really hard to believe someone, admin or otherwise, is choosing to discriminate against Hansa and alternative medicine - if Lyme teaches us anything it's never say never!

Hugh
Posted 11/30/2012 8:07 PM (GMT 0)
Hi, There

I don't know what most of the rules are, but if it works I want to know about it. I have been on doxy for almost three months, and I don't feel like it is working. I am trying to save up for DR J. Protocol . Here is the thing we need help, people with Lyme are dying , and something has to change.

I say we should be able to speak our minds.

Thank you.
Posted 12/5/2012 7:39 AM (GMT 0)
Dejavu (Denise)

I was not planning to be on this forum very often.... maybe once or twice a week. I want to thank you for standing up against the injustice.

Mods

The mod stated that only Admin or myself could have deleted all of my posts. If that is so, then Admin deleted all of my posts. I poured my heart out in those posts, and went into great detail in them. My only intent was to HELP the desperately ill people on this forum. Many people have thanked me for the information. If this is a support forum, then why oh why would Admin delete everything? There is something fishy going on here and it stinks!

Don
Posted 12/5/2012 10:22 AM (GMT 0)
I'm sorry, but there is just too much" finger pointing" going on here!

We are all here to help eachother, until we know for sure what exactly has caused the deletion, we should keep out of it.

As has already been pointed out, the mods are in charge and rightly so,

Tickled
Posted 12/5/2012 5:24 PM (GMT 0)
The reason why we come here is because we have nowhere else to go. I've been on here long enough to have read at least a 100 different stories of people's doctors telling them they are crazy. I don't care if you got cured by eating lady bugs! I want to know about it and I sure as heck don't want a moderator deciding what is or is not 'good' information! That's equivalent to thought control.

Obviously, we don't need people selling snake oils, and we need to protect our docs that do help us. But everything else should be fair game. Information to do with what you will .

Deeja--so many of us would be on the roller coaster of abx if it weren't for your experience and thoughtful input. Those of us taking the non-traditional route need your advice, your experience and your example. Please don't let a few people cause you to abandon us! We need you!
This is supposed to be a place of support I have no idea why people feel the need to defend their own protocol with such ferocity that you disrespect the choices of other's.
Posted 12/5/2012 6:29 PM (GMT 0)
Deeja, I am grateful for all the information you share.

I am using naturals to heel. Have been using Byron White, but since I can only get that through the Naturopath and am out of money for all those appointments, I have just ordered Jernigan's protocol for myself and my daughter.

It is imperative that we openly discuss all methods of treatment. Personally, I am avoiding abx because I want our guts to be healthy, since healthy gut microbe communities is imperative to a healthy immune system.

If we (my daughter and I) were sicker, such as unable to walk or even get out of bed, we would be using heavy artillery to jump start treatment (IV or oral antibiotics) is the way to go. But we aren't that sick, so I don't want to risk it.

I have seen improvement, but it's slow.

Bottom line is that, since lyme is a complicated illness that hasn't received appropriate attention by the medical and scientific community, we need to share and disseminate all the information about all available treatments. It's up to us to educate ourselves, pick through the information, discard data we don't trust and, in general, think for ourselves.

Lastly, it's not a question of abx or natural. It's not mutually exclusive. If you watch any of the ILADS conference or read Insights into Lyme Treatment, you'll see that the most educated Lyme doctors tend to use a combination of both herbal, supplemental and pharmaceutical therapies.
Posted 12/5/2012 6:33 PM (GMT 0)
Question: Are you saying that somebody has been blocked from posting here and there have been posts deleted?

p.s. It's a shame that doctors who practice herbal and natural therapies are accused of doing so for monetary gain, yet doctors who use antibiotics (the 'traditional' medicine) are not. Yet, there are LLMD's who charge 2000 bucks a visit! This demonstrates how brain washed we've all become with regards to pharmaceutical intervention. My allopathic doctor felt the need to warn me about Naturopathic physicians taking my money to treat me, yet he won't even acknowledge that chronic lyme exists and certainly won't treat me.

Isn't it ironic?

Post Edited (Tickle) : 12/5/2012 11:37:48 AM (GMT-7)

Posted 12/6/2012 4:47 PM (GMT 0)
Okay, so I'm about ready to lock this thread - why? because I feel that I'm the one the fingers are being pointed at, and quite frankly I don't deserve it.

Who here can say that I have not supported anyone's rights to talk about their treatment -whether it's from Hansa, or any other healing place? It doesn't matter if it's abx you choose or herbals, as long as it's safe, tell us about it! I've even encouraged those going to Hansa to keep us updated - don't agree with me? Look up those threads and find my posts.

I pour myself into this site, taking lots of time from my own family and life. So, if you have problems with me, then email me and we will see if we can work things out. If anyone thinks I am doing a very poor job, then report me to Admin. It's that simple. If Admin feels that I'm not doing a proper job, then it's within their rights to "fire" me.

Please, we all have lots of things to talk about besides moaning over my poor choice of words.
Posted 12/6/2012 5:06 PM (GMT 0)
Traveler,

Hold on!  I'm really sorry as I didn't mean to pick on you.  I just had so many things happen in my life in a short time frame. 

I really do adore you!  And you should should know that!  I will respond later as I gave to go out and do a chore.

And thanks for everyone elses input, it means alot of me!!

Denise

Posted 12/6/2012 8:27 PM (GMT 0)
Ah, its good to see the healing process!!!

Traveler and Deejavu - I adore both of you for what you are doing on this forum.

Don
Posted 12/7/2012 1:03 AM (GMT 0)
Hi all again,

When I first posted I was under much stress and was over reacting.  I had a horrible Thanksgiving, my Uncle passed away, and the list goes on.

I am calming down, taking detox baths, etc. 

Funny, just became I'm better from lyme doesn't mean life doesn't continue with all the problems that go with it.

Perhaps that's why I'm basically a loner. 

Again, I am truly sorry Traveler, you are such a caring person and I do appreciate you!

And yes Don, let the healing begin for all of us in every aspect!  By the way, anything good on TV?  LOL! 

Denise

Posted 12/7/2012 2:21 AM (GMT 0)
I have never seen Traveler delete anything that shouldn't have been deleted. I don't think she is responsible for the missing post. She has only deleted post that went against the rules of the forum.

And for the record here is my opinion. ABX's have healed a lot of people BUT not all.

Hansa has healed a lot of people BUT not all.

There are other options that have helped a lot of people BUT not all.

I was told years ago that Lyme is not a one size fits all disease. Many of us have put everything into treatments and are still not well.

There are MANY different strains and we are all individuals. IF it were that easy NOBODY would be suffering with Lyme. We should respect everyone's choices and respect that some of us have done all we can and haven't recovered.
Posted 12/7/2012 12:40 PM (GMT 0)
Praying, Traveler can not delete posts, only the Administrator can. 

My point is that I believe everyone should respect whatever protocol one chooses to use whether it's alternative medicine or abx or a combination of both.  That simple. 

Denise

Posted 12/7/2012 1:36 PM (GMT 0)
Actually I can delete posts, but only one at a time, and I have no desire to delete any posts that I don't have to as I feel that they are all teaching in some way. I would never delete all of anyone's posts - besides that would take forever!!! LOL!

All posts are deleted, however, when someone cancels their membership - I don't really understand this, but that's what I'm told.

Praying - I say the same thing - this is not a 'one-size-fits-all' disease, nor is the treatment that will work. We are all very unique individuals who will require just as unique of a treatment, as we all have different weaknesses and strengths in our bodies.

It's very unfortunate that this all played out online.

Please, from now on if someone has an issue with me, please, please contact me by email!! If you don't feel you can come to me (don't know why though), then please contact Admin. Let's not have this happen again - pretty please? :-)
Posted 12/7/2012 5:41 PM (GMT 0)
Traveler, I'm so so sorry if you misinterpreted my post as attacking you personally. But I had read a previous post of yours to Heathersdad saying that you hadn't deleted his posts so that wasn't even on my mind. I was assuming that the 'admin' people in the sky did it. To me, you are this forum! You have personally helped me a dozen times since July. I would never, ever have a bad thing to say about you!!
Please forgive me for adding to your stress.
Posted 12/7/2012 5:53 PM (GMT 0)
Shabbychic!
Don't even go there! LOL! What added the most stress to yesterday was dealing with my Father-in-law who has moderate Alzheimers and has become quite defiant and argumentative! LOL!! Five hours with him in grocery stores and I'll take this any time!!! turn

There are rules against inflaming others, however, but that doesn't prevent someone from venting - others are not supposed to jump in is all! I had spent my morning chasing down spammers, so by the time I got to this thread and read all the posts, it was just time to stop it.

Rather than just locking down the thread (devil my first impulse -LOL!) I choose to just state that this needs to stop. I try to be very approachable, but if someone feels that I'm not and they have an issue with me, then they need to go to Admin - not jump in on a thread like this.

We are still adults here! turn Or so I'm told that I am!! Giggle!
Let's just get back to helping each other!
Posted 12/7/2012 8:42 PM (GMT 0)
To be honest, I think this got blown completely out of proportion. A person should feel safe to say how they're feeling, as long as they aren't flaming anybody.

Saying that she 'gets the feeling' that certain posts 'aren't welcome' is pretty benign.

But, we're all dealing with life and lyme and I bet there isn't a single one of us who doesn't fly off the handle once in a while!
Posted 12/7/2012 9:22 PM (GMT 0)
Well said, WWJD. Sometimes when I read my posts, they sound so grim. I need to develop a better writing personality.

Everybody's so great here. Traveller, you do an outstanding job, and I read your posts with enthusiasm because you have so much to share.
Posted 12/7/2012 10:00 PM (GMT 0)
LOL! Well, I certainly fit in with the 'dysfunctional' part of the family!!! turn Giggle! I not only fly off the handle, I'll fly off with the handle too! smilewinkgrin

Thank you for your kind words again, Tickled! You're so sweet!
Posted 12/7/2012 10:33 PM (GMT 0)
Oh golly gee!  Now that I'm all calmed down, I wish I never started this thread!  Honest!  What a dope I am!

And Traveler, I didn't know you could delete, wow, good for you!

I think I'll start a more happier thread!  Whadda think?

Denise

Posted 12/7/2012 10:42 PM (GMT 0)
I like the thought of a happy thread!! turn

Yep! I can delete posts, but I save that for duplicate posts that I know members didn't intend to do, and for spammers that post multiple times in the forum! devil

And don't worry about it Denise! We all love ya!! smilewinkgrin And we all have "those" days!! I would hate for someone to be able to pull up every post I've made and for us to go over them!! LOL!! blush
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