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Need help with interpreting IGENEX results

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Posted 9/8/2011 9:29 PM (GMT 0)

First post for me so hopefully I get things set out as clear and straightforward as possible. I am posting on behalf of my wife and two boys (6 and 9). All three have been tested through IGENEX and the results are slightly different but similar in other ways. We are all seeing a LLMD (I have tested positive through BioMeridian testing as I am the one who does remember being bitten by a tick when I was 6 years old in Holland.....that'll be another post rolleyes ). Anyway, here are my wife's results (and she has the most clear clinical presentation with over 30 mild to major symptoms):

IFA 40 Equivocal

IGENEX IGM result  POSITIVE

CDC/NYS result NEGATIVE

         18 kDa. -

**23-25 kDa. IND

         28 kDa. -

         30 kDa. -

     **31 kDa. +

     **34 kDa. IND

     **39 kDa. IND

     **41 kDa. +

         45 kDa. -

         58 kDa. -

         66 kDa. -

**83-93 kDa. IND

IGENEX IGG result  NEGATIVE

CDC/NYS result NEGATIVE

         18 kDa. -

**23-25 kDa. -

         28 kDa. -

         30 kDa. +

     **31 kDa. -

     **34 kDa. -

     **39 kDa. -

     **41 kDa. IND

         45 kDa. -

         58 kDa. +

         66 kDa. -

**83-93 kDa. -

Multiplex PCR B. Burgorferi

Serum

GENOMIC-NEGATIVE

PLASMID-NEGATIVE

Multiplex PCR B. Burgorferi

Whole Blood

GENOMIC-NEGATIVE

PLASMID-POSITIVE  <--- CONFIRMED BY SOUTHERN DOT BLOT

Basically I'm looking for someone to help explain a little bit more so that I can explain to others who do not believe anything from any lab other than a Government lab. I'll post my two son's results later (short on time). Thanks in advance.

Posted 9/9/2011 12:19 AM (GMT 0)
You're positive by PCR - there is no doubt you have Lyme.
Posted 9/9/2011 12:31 AM (GMT 0)
Wow, Razzle. Is there any way in the world you could tell me what mine mean?


LYME IgM Western Blot:


IGENEX IGM result POSITIVE

CDC/NYS result NEGATIVE



18 kDa. +

**23-25 kDa. -

28 kDa. -

30 kDa. -

**31 kDa. +

**34 kDa. IND

**39 kDa. IND

**41 kDa. ++

45 kDa. -

58 kDa. -

66 kDa. -

**83-93 kDa. IND



LYME IgG Western Blot:


IGENEX IGG result POSITIVE

CDC/NYS result NEGATIVE



18 kDa. -

**23-25 kDa. -

28 kDa. -

30 kDa. -

**31 kDa. IND

**34 kDa. +

**39 kDa. IND

**41 kDa. +++

45 kDa. -

58 kDa. +

66 kDa. -

**83-93 kDa. -



I did not get any results, and may have not been tested for whatever the 3rd part he posted is:

Multiplex PCR B. Burgorferi

Serum

----

Thank you so much, in advance. I hope it's not too much trouble... or where one might go to translate this thing.

Thank you, again & again.


-KT
Posted 9/9/2011 12:32 AM (GMT 0)
Oh, I'm sorry... I thought the signature was your detailed result. I realize this means I'm positive, but I - like BPC - would also like to know (if anyone knows) what the details of this result means.

Hope someone can help!
Posted 9/9/2011 4:22 PM (GMT 0)

Thanks a lot for responding Razzle. Since this looked like a positive to us we then went ahead and had both our boys tested (firmly believing in the possibility of in utero transmission). Here are the results for our 9 year old son:

IFA <40


IGENEX IGM RESULT  NEGATIVE
CDC/NYS RESULT  NEGATIVE

    18 kDa.  -
**23-25 kDa. -
    28 kDa. -
    30 kDa. -
**31 kDa. -
**34 kDa. -
**39 kDa. IND
**41 kDa. ++
    45 kDa. -
    58 kDa. -
    66 kDa. -
**83-93 kDa. IND


IGENEX IGG RESULT  NEGATIVE
CDC/NYS RESULT  NEGATIVE

    18 kDa.  -
**23-25 kDa. IND
    28 kDa. -
    30 kDa. +
**31 kDa. IND
**34 kDa. -
**39 kDa. -
**41 kDa. ++
    45 kDa. -
    58 kDa. -
    66 kDa. -
**83-93 kDa. -

Multiplex PCR B. Burgdorferi
Serum

Genomic B. Burgdorferi - Negative
Plasmid B. Burgdorferi - Negative

Multiplex PCR B. Burgdorferi
Whole Blood

Genomic B. Burgdorferi - Negative
Plasmid B. Burgdorferi - Negative

Here are the results for our 6 year old son:

IFA <40


IGENEX IGM RESULT  NEGATIVE
CDC/NYS RESULT  NEGATIVE

    18 kDa.  -
**23-25 kDa. -
    28 kDa. -
    30 kDa. -
**31 kDa. ++
**34 kDa. IND
**39 kDa. -
**41 kDa. IND
    45 kDa. -
    58 kDa. -
    66 kDa. -
**83-93 kDa. IND


IGENEX IGG RESULT  POSITIVE
CDC/NYS RESULT  NEGATIVE

    18 kDa.  -
**23-25 kDa. -
    28 kDa. -
    30 kDa. -
**31 kDa. +++
**34 kDa. -
**39 kDa. IND
**41 kDa. +++
    45 kDa. -
    58 kDa. -
    66 kDa. -
**83-93 kDa. -

Multiplex PCR B. Burgdorferi
Serum

Genomic B. Burgdorferi - Negative
Plasmid B. Burgdorferi - Negative

Multiplex PCR B. Burgdorferi
Whole Blood

Genomic B. Burgdorferi - Negative
Plasmid B. Burgdorferi - Negative

Both exhibit symptoms in their own way, with our 9 year old predominantly suffering from emotional and behavioral issues and our 6 year old having constant skin issues and central sleep apnea. Thanks again for taking the time to look at this. It means a lot.

Posted 9/9/2011 5:10 PM (GMT 0)
If a seasoned LLMD didn't say that those were positive results, I would be quite surprised!!!

The IND means that it was indeterminate - reactive, but not quite enough to actually say it's positive if I understand correctly.
Posted 9/9/2011 7:32 PM (GMT 0)
[Breaking up my post for you] smilewinkgrin

Thanks so much. I didn't know what IND meant. I know the results are positive.

I might be completely brain foggy, but I thought what the original poster was asking

about were details of what the test means. Then, the responder said "positive" but their

signature threw me off (I'm new) and I thought THOSE were the details of the test result, so I posted mine.

I'd still like to know what it all means.

By the way, this is the best, most loving & helpful Lyme community forum I've found anywhere on the web.

Thanks so much for letting me be a part of it!

~KT
Posted 9/9/2011 9:31 PM (GMT 0)
BPC

I took a small segment from a lot of reading for you. If you want more info let me know I can PM you some link(s) or files. Don't know if I can post links here?

The following is a brief explanation of the test results. Again, each band is an antigen complexed (bound together) with an antibody made by the immune system, specifically for that antigen (part) of Borrelia burgdorferi.

18: An outer surface protein.

22: Possibly a variant of outer surface protein C.

23-25: Outer surface protein C (osp C).

28: An outer surface protein.

30: Possibly a variant of outer surface protein A.

31: Outer surface protein A (osp A). 34: Outer surface protein B (osp .

37: Unknown, but it is in the medical literature that it is a borrelia-associated antibody. Other labs consider it significant.

39: Unknown what this antigen is, but based on research at the National Institute of Health (NIH), other Borrelia (such as Borrelia recurrentis that causes relapsing fever), do not even have the genetics to code for the 39 kDa antigen, much less produce it. It is the most specific antibody for borreliosis of all.

41: Flagella or tail. This is how Borrelia burgdorferi moves around, by moving the flagella. Many bacteria have flagella. This is the most common borreliosis antibody.

45: Heat shock protein. This helps the bacteria survive fever. The only bacteria in the world that does not have heat shock proteins is Treponema pallidum, the cause of syphilis.

58: Heat shock protein.

66: Heat shock protein. This is the second most common borrelia antibody.

73: Heat shock protein.

83: This is the DNA or genetic material of Borrelia burgdorferi. It is the same thing as the 93, based upon the medical literature. But laboratories vary in assigning significance to the 83 versus the 93.

93: The DNA or genetic material of Borrelia burgdorferi.

Hope this helps it's a start!

B
Posted 9/9/2011 9:36 PM (GMT 0)
Wow. This does help a TON!! Feel free to PM me any links you found.

Thank you SO much!!

I know a lot of other people who have Lyme have probably wondered this,

but.. with the CDC being negative, I always get these weird ideas that it's not Lyme,

but something very similar. Scary feeling...

Thanks again SOOOO much!!

~ KT
Posted 9/9/2011 10:06 PM (GMT 0)
You r welcome

I see Cajungrl has them posted on the lyme main page with much more info (I'm new here) half way down page 1.


Hopefully gaining knowledge about this disease will help take some of the scary feeling out of it. I just came out of remission a

couple weeks ago after 2 years and back on antibiotics again. So will be here to answer any questions you (or others) might have.


I was finally diagnosed in mid 2009 and had it from childhood around 1970.


All the best

B
Posted 9/9/2011 11:39 PM (GMT 0)
longtimelyme

Thanks so much for the details. I'm really up on absorbing any information as fortunately my brain can handle it (unlike anxiety, anger, pain, etc). Knowing that my wife tested positive was the first step and we immediately decided to test the boys. Their results aren't identical to Mom's but I quickly realized that this disease is not straightforward or easy. With the belief that they both acquired Lyme in utero, does anyone really know what Lyme looks like in someone that was born with it? No one has done studies on that obviously, so we just take one day at a time and be thankful we have each other. Thanks again for the info and I am so glad to have found this community.
Posted 9/9/2011 11:45 PM (GMT 0)
Hi, BPC - I'd also like to know whether or not it's been proven one way or the other if babies contract Lyme in utero, or if it in fact happens during breast feeding. I've read a lot of conflicting information on this. Just curious to know what sources you've found on this.

I have been growing a creeping suspicion that I contracted it in utero and that my parents have it, as well as my mom's father. That's a huge leap to guess such a thing. There's no way in the world I'll ever know. My family would never get tested. Just ain't gonna happen! They hardly believe in much of what's happening to me right now. So... :\

Take care! Good luck figuring all this out! You're such a good dad to try & get it resolved sooner than later with your kids. Their quality of life will be vastly improved by this research you're doing.

~ KT
Posted 9/10/2011 12:26 AM (GMT 0)
On my way out the door to go milk, so this is really quick -
YOu should check out Dr. Charles Jones site. He treats pregnant women and young children. Here is his site: www.drjoneskids.com/
Posted 6/9/2014 8:38 PM (GMT 0)
Can someone please interpret this for me? Thank you!

Igenex IGM Result Negative
CDC/NYS Negative

**23-25 IND
28 +
**39 IND
**41 ++
83-93 IND
Posted 6/10/2014 1:57 AM (GMT 0)
Hi Michelle--you should start a new post so that someone will
see it easier. This is an older thread from 2011 and it might not be noticed as quickly!
Posted 6/10/2014 2:01 AM (GMT 0)
The ** proteins are the ones that are specific to Lyme. You need 2 of those to have Lyme but even if you have one it is possible. IND is a weakly positive result. It means that it is there but with very low sensitivity. The good advantage of the igenex test is it's really good sensitivity. Or it could be a speck of dirt which is unlikely.

Do you have Lyme like symptoms?
Posted 6/10/2014 4:00 PM (GMT 0)
I have about 50 symptoms all are lyme like. Intense pain from head to toe, fatigue, timnitus, crawling sensation on left side of head, point point red dots all over, heart palpitations, 'fibromyalgia' never feel rested, low BP, dizziness, constipation, depression. I've been sick since I was 19, I'm now 37. Exhausted and dead man walking.
Posted 6/10/2014 4:51 PM (GMT 0)
Sounds like Lyme to me and I had many of the same symptoms. You can maybe do an antibiotic challenge test?

I tested negative the first time, but I am going to retest again. Hopefully I will have antibodies made for it.
Posted 6/10/2014 6:09 PM (GMT 0)
Thank you for your response, I appreciate any help I can get. I seemed to have manage whatever I have very well for 18 years, even though it sucked I was halfway functional, now I can't work, I can barely do daily functions of survival, luckily I have a great husband that will stop at nothing to figure out what is wrong, he keeps me from giving up. That's crazy that yours was transmitted through a tear- if I have it, I wonder how many people in my family now have it?
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