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manganese vs magnesium

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Posted 8/7/2015 11:49 AM (GMT 0)
Thanks Traveler!

I read the "new to lyme" section last night and will need to read through it many times and follow more links. A lot of great information and I need to print out the symptom tracker.

Did you heal with herbs alone? How did you find which ones to take?

I have a more technical question. I do well with a construct of a problem, but don't have one for Lyme. Specifically, I've learned that the body reduces the absorption of iron as a strategy to kill bacteria. But Bb does not use iron. I've learned that the body "throws" large charges particles at invaders, but something called "super" something in Bb makes this attack ineffective too.

What are the specific mechanisms our bodies use successfully that I need to support? Do we know any? Are there any? I don't have a background in biology so can't go deep, but am a scientist. I'd love to learn what our bodies can do on their own successfully against Bb? Is there a place I can find that information?

Thank you for your help.
Posted 8/9/2015 12:18 AM (GMT 0)
Yes, there IS a lot of information in that thread!! I still go back to it from time to time looking for information to share! LOL!

Well, for me, it was hit and miss, and fortunately we (my doc and I) guess right on Lyme and Bart treatments, but Babesia was a lot harder to find what worked for me. I did this before it was known really that herbs would work for these infections, just 5 years ago. So there was very little support and I had to find my own protocol for Lyme online.

I would suggest that you get Buhner's Lyme book - he's great at explaining things, and while I haven't read it, many have said it's really great book, explains lots in an easy to understand manner!

I have been gifted Buhner's books on Herbal Abx and Herbal antivirals, and I can confirm that he writes in an easy to understand, easy to follow format! He's also got a website that you might find helpful too: buhnerhealinglyme.com/

You will need to support your body's detoxing pathways by helping it to detox- and if you have certain gene mutations (MTHFR and others I think) you will need to take some specific supplements to allow your body to detox better.

You will need to support your immune function. Raising it will help your body fight these infections. Lyme is know to inhibit the immune system, which is why we have such issues with testing - those tests look for antibodies that the immune system can't produce.

Anything that Lyme "uses up" in our bodies has to be replace for our body to function well enough to do battle with this incredibly complex bacteria.
Posted 8/9/2015 6:36 PM (GMT 0)
Traveler,

Darned if I don't already have Buhners book. His web site may not work on iPads as I could not bring it up last night. When I went only and was buying books, his was one of them. I just hadn't made it past the first book. In ordered some Siberian ginseng recommended for the acute cases as a start.

I discovered you should not have iron, calcium or magnesium with the abx. And, I've been taking it with or near every healthy thing I have. Now on an empty stomach it's making me ill.
Posted 8/9/2015 6:45 PM (GMT 0)
Do I understand correctly that you are taking your abx on an empty stomach? That's not good! We take high doses, so it's best to have some food along with it. Just try to make sure that what you eat doesn't have high levels of those nutrients - so no cheese sandwiches! LOL!

The Siberian ginseng (Eleuthero) will boost the immune function, so be sure to ease into it carefully so that you don't have your immune function ramping up so fast that it causes a large herx. And detox, detox, detox! :-)

While Buhner's site works a bit differently on a tablet, I can get it to work on my android tablet. You might want to try again when you think of it.
Posted 8/10/2015 3:56 AM (GMT 0)
The Buhner site worked today for me. Seems that the acute protocol has changed, still including the ginseng but there are three other herbs.

I don't know when one goes from acute protocol to chronic protocol? I'm at ten weeks bitten plus or minus and four weeks on abx. Still acute? Or is chronic a term reserved for post abx treatment (or is that the PTLS)?
Posted 8/10/2015 4:45 PM (GMT 0)
"Chronic Lyme" is a term that is used when the bacteria is no longer contained within a specific area of the body, and this happens at different rates for each person depending on what else may be going on inside. Anywhere from 3 weeks to years later.

So, basically, if you have body wide symptoms, you need to be on the chronic protocol.
Posted 8/16/2015 3:20 PM (GMT 0)
Traveler,

I am on doxy and tinidazole. I had a couple of days where I at least recognized myself, but am again so exhausted I can do nothing. I've searched some, trying to find out how I improve my energy (vit C, ..) or whether the tinidazole impacts energy.... I don't know if it's a herx again because exhaustion is the primary symptom (lfewer stabbing pains then last one). Is there anything at all that can give me a boost just long enough to accomplish a few necessary things? Any strategies that worked for others?
Posted 8/16/2015 4:24 PM (GMT 0)
I'm sorry, have we discussed detoxing? It's vital for healing with these infections, and something that will help alleviate some of the herxing which could easily make your fatigue more profound.

We have a great list of detoxing suggestions in the "New to Lyme?" thread.

Gene mutations, mold exposure and multiple tick-borne infections can all prevent us from detoxing well, but we must be able to get those toxins out of our bodies. I have not had any of the gene mutation testing done, although I do seem to have the same kind of issues as those that do - so I figured it was best for me to assume that I did and work to get my body to detox much better.

It took a lot of diet changes as things with my body changed, I used a foot soak daily, dry skin brushing, making sure my bowels moved at least once a day (sorry if it's TMI!) pushing myself to drink at least 64 ounces of lemon water each and every day, liver/gall bladder flushes (all natural), oil pulling, taking activated charcoal and keeping the amount of stress in my life at a bare minimum.
Posted 8/19/2015 4:24 PM (GMT 0)
ok, old thread, and I haven't read through it all yet- but here's some facts about lyme and manganese-

Bacteria scour the body looking for trace minerals because they need these trace minerals to survive- mainly manganese- without manganese- the bacteria starve to death- Lyme has some mechanism by which it binds the manganese in order to be able to take the manganese in through the 'skin' of the bacteria cell- without this binding mechanism, manganese can not enter the bacteria cell

A new study shows that Claritin and Clarinex (the over the counter allergy meds), prevent lyme from being able to bind to the manganese- thus starving the bacteria-

in a study done with rodents, they were given clarinex in their food, and it reduced tick bourne lyme 76%!

Lyme is difficult to treaT With antibiotics because apparently what happens is that some bacteria cells lie dormant, and only the active cells get killed by the antibiotics- so after the course of antibiotics is done, the dormant cells can reactivate at anytime and re-affect the victim

Not sure if Claritin can kill dormant cells or not-

But according to studies, it's kinda tough to get enough of the ingredient in Claritin into the system in order to kill lyme- it might be that it needs to be done through a doctor's office under supervision-

Some folks are allergic to Claritin, and so must go on Clarinex which in the US is only available via prescription-

My feeling is that lyme probably should be treated via BOTH antibiotics and Claritin- Being that Lyme is so dang hard to treat-

I suppose IF someone has lyme, they can try Claritin- but not sure how much is needed to fight the lyme-
Posted 8/19/2015 6:44 PM (GMT 0)
The problem with the Claritin study is that a normal dosage of it for allergies is only 10 mgs and for the study on Lyme they were using 400 mgs. So until they can find a way to negate the hyper drying effects that large of a dose would cause, that's not a viable option for treating Lyme.
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