Armour medication to cause increase of antibodies?

Previuos thread: https://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=3723685&g=3725366#m3725366

Hi all,

I have been on Armour for only a couple of months, and so far it has done nothing for me. Joint pains, tinnitus and other neurological pains/pressure has just gotten worse after starting it. Also throatpain is really bad. Not sure if it's the medication itself that's causing this, or if it's just not working.

From the start of Levothyroxine i have had a decrease in antibodies from over 1300 down to 293 (reference says under 100). Also decrease in anti thyroglobulin levels from 1501 to 119 (reference under 40). My diet have been gluten and grain free for a long time. NOT dairy free. But only some cheese and milk from time to time.

As soon as i started Armour i had new tests taken after 2 months. Levels of Anti-TPO had increased up to 359. Not that much, but still..

I went dairy free 2 weeks ago as my doc told me that was the reason my antibodies had increased. Not sure I believe that..

Current levels:

S-TSH: 1,8 (0,20 - 4,0)
S-FT4: 13,2 (11 - 23,0)
S-FT3: 4,2 (3,5 - 6,5)
S-Anti-TPO: 359 (<100)

All above tests from 17th of October 2016

S-PTH: 2,2 (1,5 - 7,0)
P-Calsium, Free: 1,27 (1,15 - 1,33)

Above tests from 14th of October 2016

Previous test of RT3: 0,55 (0,14 - 0,54)
Cortisol levels in spit and urine are now at least within normal range.

Ultrasound from last week shows no signs of nodules or lumps, just small white fields sort of, that indicates hypothyroidism, the doc told me.

TO MY QUESTION: As I read somewhere that 30% of patients who use Armour will have an increase in their antibodies. Anybody else experience this on NDT?

I am therefore not sure if this is the right medication for me afterall. Any thoughts?

Heard good things about Cytomel. Could this be a good alternative if i switch back to Levo again?

Also want to try out LDN - Anyone with success on this?

Thanks,
Tommy

Being hypothyroid can cause an increase in antibodies and the difference between your last two checks isn't really all that much of a difference when Hashi's patients often have levels in the thousands.

Everyone is different in regards to which thyroid meds work best for them.

I had a really hard time finding a thyroid-savvy doctor when I took myself off the anti-thyroid drugs my former endos were overmedicating me with even though I was in remission from Graves'.

I readily accepted the levothyroxine Rx my new doctor offered when I presented with symptoms of hypothyroidism.

I did well on it, eventually needed T3 and did well with Cytomel.

I've considered desiccated thyroid many, many times. However, with Lyme causing me to need dose adjustments every month, I think it would be more challenging than ever with desiccated since it contains both T4 and T3.

I rarely need improvements in both my Free T4 and Free T3 levels - it's one or the other and either a T4 or T3 dose adjustment usually takes care of things. Admittedly, since Lyme hit, I've needed monthly dose adjusments of *some*thing.

I also anticipate needing additional T4 if I took desiccated thyroid (I feel best with my Free T4 level slightly over-range which is a common need for Graves' patients...you may know that desiccated thyroid provides proportionately more T3 than T4 compared to human thyroid)

I remain with the status quo lol

And this can take a while, as these infections mess with the smooth operation of many of our organs.

There are many things that affect thyroid antibody levels and they are called "triggers".

Copy and pasted from the site of thyroid guru, Elaine Moore:

"Known triggers include cigarette smoke, stress, low selenium levels, seasonal and food allergies, sex steroids particularly estrogens, excess dietary iodine, and trauma.
Thyroid cells may also be injured by oxidative stress related to the immune system's response to low antioxidant levels.
Suspected environmental triggers include retroviruses, Yersinia and other enteric bacteria, and aspartame in artificial sweeteners.
The immune mechanisms that contribute to disease from environmental agents include: increased cell destruction or apoptosis, thyroid autoantibody production, inflammation as white blood cells invade thyroid tissue, and the production of cytotoxic (destructive to cells) immune system chemicals known as cytokines."

To read more of the above and get info about thyroid antibodies, read here:

elaine-moore.com/Articles/Graves%E2%80%99DiseaseArticles/ThyroidDiseaseTriggers/tabid/183/Default.aspx

These:

S-FT4: 13,2 (11 - 23,0)
S-FT3: 4,2 (3,5 - 6,5)

you are in the bottom third of the ranges on both. Need to be in the middle or even try upper third. BUT -You cant adjust individualy with Armour, so one will be lower. Add slowly, watch symptoms and retest. These are what your cells use, not tsh.


LDN Rx med- I dont know about it other than its trial and error.

Armour is pig thyroid. It has t3 and t4 together. They go up and down together per your adjusting dose.

Synthetic thyroid med is available in each individually as t4 (synthroid) and t3 (cytomel). So each can be changed individually.

But some feel better on Armour.

If you start with a regular dr- they usually put you on synthetic.

If you started thyroid med with a llmd or naturalpath - they like pig thyroid.

Armour got its name 115 years ago from the Armour meat company back when they used every part of butchered animals for something - including the first thyroid replacment hormone.

It is said that synthetic thyroid med was first designed for the US military forces in the event of atomic war after WWII - as pigs would die and there would be no thyroid med from them. Radiation effects the thyroid gland more than other organs. Sad but interesting.

Ok Guys, what am I missing? Isn't it good when our bodies produce their own antibodies? Or are you saying Armour enhances the effects of antibiotics and causes herxes?

Thanks!
Joanie

Thanks Astroman!

I guess it's a matter of what my Endo thinks, but do you think maybe it would be better for me to switch back to Levothyroxine again? And also get him to prescribe Cytomel...

Only because I don't feel any progress at all with my Armour meds..

Tommy

Would you pass on a good car offer without driving it in Over Drive (or whatever top gear it has) and think its to slow?

With the thyroid levels you currently have, your still in Drive and and have not shifted into Over drive yet.

So you cant feel well yet.

Dont decide to change untill you know what better levels feel like.

The same low levels on synthetics will like creat the same symptom results.


Your Dr needs to understand thyroid hormone and stop looking at TSH. This is why so many people remain thyroid "ill".