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Anxiety herxes inevitable? Does anything short of narcotics help?

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Posted 6/6/2017 5:13 PM (GMT 0)
Good morning friends,
3 days ago, I increased my mc-bab-2 dose by 1 drop from 2 drops bid to 3 drops bid. Now I'm having what appears to be an anxiety herx. Maybe I should celebrate that I'm hitting another layer of the babs? Woo hoo? Not.

This anxiety is approaching the edge of my comfort zone. I can deal with it at this level, but don't want it to escalate further. Extra theanine, taurine, and motherwort help somewhat. I'd prefer to keep chipping away at it and find a way to move through this anxiety.

Never had anxiety before I got sick with Lymeco but it seems like anxiety is going to be inevitable for me while knocking back these bugs. I'd sure like to find the best way to manage it without losing momentum.

Do you think it's wise to decrease dose or take a break from the mc-bab-2? I hate to do that as it feels like starting over from scratch.

Any problem taking more than 1 epsom /h202 bath per day? I always just take one b4 bedtime and they're the best.

I'm drinking >64 oz of lemon h20, taking lots of chlorella, dry skin brushing, Jernigan neuro antitox cns/pns, molybdenum, curcumin, 4g vitamin c/day, acv, wobenzyme, omega 3, blue heron detoxifying complex, ......

Llmd gave me an rx for 5mg Valium, at my request, to have on hand if I really need it. Kind of a "break glass in case of emergency" type of thing. I'm reluctant to use it however as I fear benzos and don't want to add drug addiction to my punch list.

Thanks friends.

Post Edited (BJD55) : 6/6/2017 11:17:20 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 6/6/2017 5:17 PM (GMT 0)
BJD55,

CBD oil has been a life saver!! I can't recommend it enough. I've been telling everyone about it. I was having bad panic attacks and CBD has been the best. It doesn't get you high, just makes you feel more "normal" or better able to handle the anxiety. It also doesn't make you tired, but I wouldn't recommend more than you need. I take just a few sprays almost every day. The one I take is "Plus CBD Oil" - it's a very low dose. I also have a higher dose CBD with THC for emergencies or to help me when I get anxious insomnia.
Posted 6/6/2017 5:26 PM (GMT 0)
BJD55,

First, I think it would be a good idea to cut back your dose of MC-BAB-2 until your symptoms are manageable. Also, have you tried any of the Beyond Balance detox formulas? I used to take Cognease-detox, and it was *amazing* help for my neuro symptoms. I think PeteZa has had good results with another one of the Beyond Balance detox formulas, but I don't recall which.
Posted 6/6/2017 5:30 PM (GMT 0)
I dunno, Ive tried all kinds of CBD oil, very expensive and strong strains which cost $100 for 2oz and it didn't help my anxiety at all. The only thing that worked was Ativan, which I now need every night to avoid withdraw symptoms, but its the only thing that works. I was told to switch over to Valium, which is easier to get off of, as I now have an addiction I need to deal with... Just know if you take those kinds of pills, just take them once in awhile, they are worse than Heroin to get off of if you take them every day for over a month..
Posted 6/6/2017 5:34 PM (GMT 0)
oh, btw.. increasing the Beyond Balance more than a drop every month or two is TOO MUCH! I know a drop doesn't seem like a lot, but it took me months to adjust to one more drop... my NP say's it's like that.
Posted 6/6/2017 5:51 PM (GMT 0)
Hi tickonboard -

I also had extreme neurotransmitter swings during the first month that I started treating Lyme, bart and babs - both on herbs and abx. It was most severe when starting the IV abx - both times. I felt I needed to push through it, I did, and by the end of the month the herxing had subsided for the most part. But it was not fun and even a little scary. I had a lot more than just anxiety going on - I would swing from one emotion to the next to the next, hour after hour.

Also, I increased detox - sounds like your detox protocol is very good. I saw on another thread you're investigating which binder to add and I think that will make a big impact for you - remember the gut-brain connection and that we take all our protocols orally, so there is a lot going on in our digestive process so helping with a binder in flushing every day (some people use them more than once/day - after each antimicrobial dose would be optimal but often not achievable because of the time buffers required).

Lowering dose would also work if the binders or adjusting detox, etc. doesn't work... but I would try other solutions first.

Hope this is helpful - please let us know how you're doing.

-p
Posted 6/6/2017 7:07 PM (GMT 0)
Melissa supreme from Gaia Herbs works wonders for my anxiety. Very effective!
Posted 6/6/2017 11:28 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks all,
10lyme: how do you take the cbd the oil, orally? I'd consider it. I was using edible 420 last summer and fall but hadda stop because it started making me even more anxious. 40 years of recreational use never got paranoid ever, til Lyme. Oddly enough, I quit right after California legalized recreational.

Nosilla and Pirouette, thanks. Halved my dose today, we'll see what tonight and tomorrow morning brings.

Redeyed, gonna add the Melissa to motherwort and up the dose. I need to find a way to work the edge of my comfort zone and keep momentum.

Tick on board, thanks, your experience with the benzo's confirms my fears. I tried temazepam a few years ago for sleep. Only used it 3 nights and it wanted me to increase the dose, I swear I had withdrawal after 3 nights. Valium, if at all will be very occasional. Why did you quit the beyond balance?
Posted 6/7/2017 3:14 AM (GMT 0)
Hubby and I worked through our anxiety in totally different ways. I did mental things to keep my mind active and not on how I was anxious. Hubby did physical things.

Neither of us did anything during the day for anxiety.

But at night - we both did Benadryl, children liquid, gross cherry flavored and probably not the most organic thing in the world.

I was the first to try it and I slept like a baby - took one capful as if I was an 11yr old. Hubby, who is a purest and doesn't like drugs or bad food, reluctantly tried it and he was hooked.

With the children's dosage and liquid you can regulate it so much better. And neither of us with this children's dose woke up hung over or drowsy at all. But we got that much needed good sleep to heal.

Just my opinion. And what works for me might make you sick. That's my fine print.
Posted 6/7/2017 7:49 AM (GMT 0)
You might try the tincture called Avena Sativa, which is made from the milky new oat tops.
It calms me down. I take varying amounts; sort of a dropper full for maintenance, an extra half dropper if things are stressing me and I'm starting to break down or panic, and 1 1/2 to 2 droppers in hot water.

It's quite safe, but I still started low dose.

It had been a Godsend the past 2 months while I went through some heart rending stress. If I was able to get to sleep at all otherwise, I would wake up in a panic attack, among other symptoms.

Post Edited (julymorning) : 6/7/2017 1:52:56 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 6/7/2017 2:21 PM (GMT 0)
BJD55, your symptoms seem extremely similar to what I'm going through as well right now. I just started taking BAB-1 and BB-2 with an artemesia+ caspsule and my current abx + plaquenil. Like you I was a pot smoker but now it gives me anxiety attacks. I feel like my body is always on edge and feel tired when trying to exercise, but when i lay down I start twitching somewhat and feel like i have to move around. It sucks. I do have clonipin on hand i can use if it really gets bad but i prefer to stay away. Its worse for me in the mornings, anxiety and nausea. Could anxiety be a main side effect of herxing from Babs? seems like it....
Posted 6/7/2017 2:26 PM (GMT 0)
I too have found the avena sativa to be very helpful for me. And with Pirouette's comment about the other thread, I now remember that and think it would also be a good thing for you to add into your detoxing routines as well.
Posted 6/7/2017 5:46 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks all,
July and Traveler, it turns out that the Melissa supreme that redeyed suggested has aveena sativa in it as one of the ingredients. I've heard good things about aveena sativa b4 so hopefully it will help.

PeteZa, will keep the benadryl option open. Isn't that the same ingredient as in Tylenol pm? If so, Tylenol pm will work like a charm if I use it maybe once a month. Otherwise, it has the opposite effect. I think I'm a freak when it comes to many meds as I've had paradoxical reactions to ambien and temazepam as well.

Golden, does the plaquenil cause a herx? I've been reading a book about Rife machines for Bb and it states that the herxes from Rife tend to be nasty anxiety as well.

My new llmd Rx'd me a homeopathic remedy from pekana called "psy-stabil" that is working remarkably well when I wake up in the night. I get right back to sleep about 90% of the time. I do want to have some other tools in my kit however as nothing so far has worked 100% of the time.

I only took 2 drops of the bab-2 yesterday. Woke up 2x last night but the psy stabil got me right back to sleep and I slept 8 hours! A rarity for me. Feel pretty good today, kinda sorta maybe.

Pirouette, I appreciate your advice about pushing through, but gently. In the past, I've discontinued the drops for several days after a herx and had a more difficult time getting back up to previous dose. Not stopping this time but proceeding with caution.

Post Edited (BJD55) : 6/7/2017 11:52:45 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 6/7/2017 7:06 PM (GMT 0)
Plaquenil, which I've been taking once a day since 4/23/17 (200mg) is an anti-malarial drug that is prescribed to target both BAB and BB in its cyst form (It breaks down the cyst or as we sometimes say, is a cyst-buster) I find that since on it my anxiety has gone up, but especially when I add something else new (beyond balance) to the mix. So in that way I suppose it has a "multiplier" effect. It builds up in your system over the first couple weeks so that is a rough time as it has a long half-life.

Do you notice that the symptoms, including the herx effect, goes in cycles with babs? My doc is almost 100% I have it because I will be pretty much fine for like 8-10 days and then fall into a horrible 4-6 day period in between. The more I take note of this, the more it becomes apparent this is the case. I find that I only have say, drenching night sweats in the two or three days in the middle of the "bad periods." I tend to wait to increase dosages/tinctures only when in my "good periods" because if I do that when I'm feeling weak it just compounds the whole situation.
Posted 6/7/2017 8:47 PM (GMT 0)

goldengoose said...
Do you notice that the symptoms, including the herx effect, goes in cycles with babs? My doc is almost 100% I have it because I will be pretty much fine for like 8-10 days and then fall into a horrible 4-6 day period in between.


Yes, I seem to have cycles of a several good days punctuated by a bad stretch. For a while, I seemed to herx ~ every 12 days.

I get stretches where the brain fog clears, then comes back. The subjective quality of the brain fog also shifts around. Hard to describe the difference though I can feel it. Can't spot any discernible pattern to sleep other than a good nite usually follows a bad nite. Fatigue waxes and wanes also. I'll study my journal entries and look more closely for patterns.

I've heard others talk about the weekly bab cycles.
Posted 6/7/2017 9:02 PM (GMT 0)
BJD55 -
May the force of HW.com be with you.

-p
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