What happened after I stopped antibiotics

Tickbite - what have you used for biofilms?

mpost said...
mild immune suppressing effect

Believe me this is not a "mild" reaction to the presence or absence of antibacterials. I'm very well aware that they have immunosuppressive qualities but the role of that vs infection suppression is not clear since we are only now beginning to accept that there is any lingering infection in the first place. In such a case, I find it again appropriate to invoke occams razor. The simplest explanation here is that OP's infection relapsed after stopping antibiotics. These infections may be "slow growing" by comparison to E. coli. But we're still only talking on the matter of hours. Further more, relapse doesn't necessarily imply rapid growth of the bacteria. It could also imply resumed activity from a dormant state and that would not necessarily take so long.

On the contrary I've had this same issue with herbs and my CBC has always been fine. As well the amount of novel symptoms that comes from this doesn't correlate with my known pattern of autoimmunity (Ie burning firey pee). I just think it's an unnecessary leap to go there. Obviously inflammation/autoimmunity will be a consequence in either case, but if there's one thing that will drive an autoimmune reaction out of control it is the activity of the offending agent as it grows, dies, and exposes itself to APC's. This really suggests OP needs to get the infection under control again, not resume immunosuppressive therapy

Post Edited (Psilociraptor) : 5/15/2018 11:10:58 AM (GMT-6)

tickbite666 said...
Charlie55,

What ABX is recommend for Biofilm?

NAC
/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25339490


Serrapeptase
/www.journalofhospitalinfection.com/article/S0195-6701(17)30102-0/fulltext

abx... all of them ... but used with biofilm dispersal agents as the ones pointed above.

Healing98 said...
Hi, I am sharing my experience because I think we learn here from other people's experiences.

Last week I read some posts from people who were going to get off of antibiotics (abx). I decided that I should join in since it has been in my mind for a while. You see, I got infected 2 1/2 years ago and have been on antibiotics for 15 months now. I never thought that I would be on them for so long. I am currently taking Amoxicillin and Rifampin. I am symptomatic for Lyme, bartonella and bloodwork shows high readings for EBV. I also suspect mycoplasma and Candida.

I take (and did not stop taking) Super B vitamin complex, Turmeric, a multivitamin, vitamin D3, Glutathione, and Green tea.

So last Thursday was my last day on antibiotics.

Day 1 (Friday) I felt the same as before except that by the end of the day my dizziness was dissipating to where it was barely noticeable. Went about my normal routine.

Day 2 (Saturday) I felt good most of the day which is how I feel recently while on abx. My basal temperature was 98.6 in the morning and stayed there throughout the day. It usually is 97.2 - 97.6 in the morning and 98.3 during the day. I noticed that I wasn't very hungry that day so I ate very little. I also began to experience some anxiety. By the end of the day I had two mild episodes (1 minute) of numbness in my left cheek and side of my face. My left upper lid also began to flutter constantly and so did the right muscle below my mouth. I began to feel neck pain in the back but also around the front of my throat and started to get these sharp nerve pains around my head and around my eyes. At night while sleeping I was awaken by sharp pains in my back and lower torso. Like what I was feeling in my head.

Day 3 (Sunday) I woke up and my temperature was 97.3 and stayed there all day. I stayed in bed late because I felt depressed with no want to get up. My head was hurting, my right eye was at times getting this veil that I had to blink multiple times to get rid of it. My joints, back and hips hurt. I decided to get up and walked around the house doing stuff. I was very fatigued and noticed that I had a lot of anger inside me. I wanted to throw stuff around. At the same time I felt emotional. I sat down in the sofa and tears just started to drip from my eyes. I wasn't crying, I just felt depressed and angry at the same time. sometime during the day I started to get these sharp pains in my lower torso and also behind my eyes. By now my neck pain was killing me. I also noticed that my privates hurted when I urinated and the stream was very weak. I had to go multiple times to empty out. I went to bed early and watched TV. My could not concentrate on the TV and noticed that I had to lower the volume very low because the noise from the TV bothered me so much. I turned it off and began to read. I gave up because by the time I finished a paragraph I had forgotten what I had read. So I just curled up in bed and went to sleep. That night I had a few vivid dreams and a few nightmares as well so I didn't sleep well.

Day 4 (Monday) I went to work. I felt miserable. My head hurt, my stomach hurt, I could barely walk from the pain at the bottom of my feet, my legs felt so heavy. They felt like my muscles could not hold me up. I didn't even take my temperature that day. I noticed that lights were super bright and bothered me. At work I could not focus, I felt down and depressed. The morning noises from my co-workers bothered me and I felt so much anger that I wanted to scream at them to shut up! I put on some foam ear plugs that I always carry with me and I felt better. I hated those nerve pains stabbing me in the head in my stomach and I had to get up from my chair now and then because my back was hurting. But then when I got up my legs felt like they were going to drop me. I also felt very cold. I had to turn on a heater that I keep under my desk and wore a light sweater. I ate my lunch late because I wasn't hungry and even then, I didn't finish it which is very unusual.

By the time I got home I had made a decision that I was going back on abx. At night I took some amoxicillin and went to bed.

Today (Tuesday) I feel a bit better. My eyes are not giving me issues. I have a headache but the depression is not as bad and the anger/rage has dissipated. I already took my Amoxicillin dose.

From what I went through, I know that I am still infected. What i can't believe is how quickly the symptoms came back. This probably means that the abx is not killing the bacteria but rather it is just making it hide.

I am going to start taking some herbs along with my abx to see if this way I can make an impact on the bacterial load. I am so disappointed that after almost a year and a half of abx I continue to be so infected.

The worse thing is that I am feeling the side effects of the abx in my gut and feel like my body is poisoned. This is why I wanted to get off the abx, they just don't feel right anymore.

please start looking into one or any of cryptolepis, side acuta, alchornea, bidens pilosa and artemisinin for your infection. They're natural antibacterials and antiparasitics. It's clear your current antibiotic regime is not working. Artemisinin at the very least will complement your current regime through its cyst-busting action. You should not be in such bad shape after 15 months of treatment.

this happened to me but it turned out to be candid/mold. My doctor put me on anti-fungal and I was better. after stopping antibiotics my symptoms would return in 1-3 days, I told him, he suggested it was mold, the next time I started/stopped it, it did not happen. my LLND is smart.

This question of whether it’s the immune system coming back online after being suppressed vs. an active infection still present is the major one that I need an answer for myself.

I’ve experienced both of these theories being true.

When I crashed off Rifampin/Mino last July after 7-8 weeks, I switched to weekly Bicillin shots plus herbs, felt terrible for a while, and the symptoms resolved after 4-5 weeks leaving me in remission until earlier this year.

When I first began treatment after being diagnosed in October 2017 I was symptom free after 6 weeks of Doxy, Zith, and pulsed Tindamax, but within 24-48hrs Of stopping my symptoms came roaring back (severe anxiety, fatigue, weakness etc) which led me to testing for co-infections and eventually treating babesia then Bart.

Does anyone else have any experiences to share? After crashing on Rifampin and going to the ER yesterday, i’m now starting my second day without any abx (last dose of Rif was Sunday night, Doxy was Sunday morning), I already have significant tachycardia/POTS, fatigue, anxiety, some parasthesias, and impaired sleep. I’m hoping it’s something Immune/inflammatory related that will resolve but I am so, so tempted to reach for the antibiotics again - but if it is the immune system, leaky gut, or abx that were making me ill then I’ll only be continuing the misery.

For me it’s the most frightening position to be in, especially if it means going from being able to function, have a social life, and work to now playing the waiting game.