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What’s the difference between ‘anxiety/depression’ and Lyme?

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Posted 8/1/2018 12:03 PM (GMT 0)
There are not many resources about this, but how can you distinguish an anxiety disorder or depression from Lyme?
Posted 8/1/2018 1:19 PM (GMT 0)
One is a chemical imbalance, the other is a bacterial infection. Lyme is known to impact the brain and the endo system. When this happens, you are more prone to panic attacks and anxiety. This also happens when the adrenals and thyroid are impacted.
Posted 8/1/2018 1:22 PM (GMT 0)
One is a collection of symptoms with no known cause, and the other is a bacterial infection of the CNS.
Posted 8/1/2018 1:27 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks. I meant more pertaining to symptoms though. 😅
Posted 8/1/2018 2:56 PM (GMT 0)
I thought I had an anxiety order growing up. It turns out it was lyme/coinfections (and I think especially bartonella) driving that. My anxiety has gotten a lot better as I've treated the infections.

I don't know if there is a good way to distinguish. My intuition is that a not insignificant amount of psychiatric conditions have a chronic infection(s) component.

Although one thing I can think of is this, if you do a provocation test, trialing various types of broad-spectrum antimicrobials. If you get a flare in symptoms, especially the anxiety/depression that is a strong sign that underlying infections are causing the symptoms.
Posted 8/1/2018 3:34 PM (GMT 0)
Ok. Well I’ve had anxiety for a year, and I want to rule out Lyme so I’m trying to get specific symptoms to distinguish one from the other.
Posted 8/1/2018 4:24 PM (GMT 0)

jeff8787 said...
Ok. Well I’ve had anxiety for a year, and I want to rule out Lyme so I’m trying to get specific symptoms to distinguish one from the other.

No simple answer. Since anxiety is a symptom, not a disease itself, the symptoms are the same regardless of cause.

Anxiety is a symptom of many causes. Example: it can be a symptom of thyroid imbalance too. Many are given phyc meds only to find later on they had thyroid issues. To make guessing even worse- thyroid issues are caused by something else also, sometimes infections- lyme, bart, candida ect, food/leaky gut or even genes.

Conventional medicine uses many meds to cover symptoms of un-found causes because it takes no more time to figure out/diagnose. Many meds are a quick fix that has no end, so its not a fix at all. But many people just want to feel better and are not interested in cause, so we're in the minority here.
Posted 8/1/2018 4:29 PM (GMT 0)
Do you not have lyme or google ? I hope your not too sad to realize when the lyme hits that its not a autoimmune disease ..is this for you or someone else?.
Posted 8/1/2018 4:32 PM (GMT 0)
Ok thank you.

astroman said...

jeff8787 said...
Ok. Well I’ve had anxiety for a year, and I want to rule out Lyme so I’m trying to get specific symptoms to distinguish one from the other.

No simple answer. Since anxiety is a symptom, not a disease itself, the symptoms are the same regardless of cause.

Anxiety is a symptom of many causes. Example: it can be a symptom of thyroid imbalance too. Many are given phyc meds only to find later on they had thyroid issues. To make guessing even worse- thyroid issues are caused by something else also, sometimes infections- lyme, bart, candida ect, food/leaky gut or even genes.

Conventional medicine uses many meds to cover symptoms of un-found causes because it takes no more time to figure out/diagnose. Many meds are a quick fix that has no end, so its not a fix at all. But many people just want to feel better and are not interested in cause, so we're in the minority here.

Posted 8/1/2018 4:33 PM (GMT 0)
?

bluelyme said...
Do you not have lyme or google ? I hope your not too sad to realize when the lyme hits that its not a autoimmune disease ..is this for you or someone else?.

Posted 8/1/2018 4:35 PM (GMT 0)

jeff8787 said...
Thanks. I meant more pertaining to symptoms though. 😅

Have you been diagnosed with Lyme disease?

How long have you had the anxiety?

What other symptoms do you have?
Posted 8/1/2018 4:40 PM (GMT 0)
No, I have only been diagnosed with anxiety. It’s been just over a year. I have almost constant out of it/derealization feeling and a type of dizziness that makes it feel like I’m moving all the time. These are the main things I’d like to get rid of. Also head pressure, tiredness. Worse in public places or places with bright lights. Was on an antidepressant for 9 months, didn’t help, at this point I’m going to try another one st my next appointment...

Girlie said...

jeff8787 said...
Thanks. I meant more pertaining to symptoms though. 😅

Have you been diagnosed with Lyme disease?

How long have you had the anxiety?

What other symptoms do you have?

Posted 8/1/2018 4:42 PM (GMT 0)
Igenex Test results ?

Seen a LLMD for evaluation?

Edit- I read one of your previous posts and you said your parents won’t have you tested.

Hopefully you are almost old enough to get tested on your own -
Posted 8/1/2018 4:46 PM (GMT 0)
No. I think we’ve spoken before on here. I’ve been to a number of different doctors and everything comes back fine. My parents pay for all of this. They don’t think I have Lyme, and I myself don’t know if I do obviously, I just worry because I don’t feel right and want to feel normal. But I need to have some solid ground to test because it’s costly. That’s why I was asking about key indicators that would distinguish anxiety from Lyme.

Girlie said...
Igenex Test results ?

Seen a LLMD for evaluation?

Posted 8/1/2018 4:48 PM (GMT 0)
My bartonella anxiety was like that ...have you ever had cats?
Posted 8/1/2018 4:48 PM (GMT 0)
No, but I’ve had an mri of brain.

bluelyme said...
My bartonella anxiety was like that ...have you ever had cats?

Posted 8/1/2018 4:54 PM (GMT 0)
Lol thought you meant cat scan. No I am actually allergic to cats.
Posted 8/1/2018 7:35 PM (GMT 0)
Hi jeff

That is actually a question i asked myself and on here as well. I think looking at symptoms there are no real good distinguishing factors. Your symptoms, including anxiety can certainly be explained by Lyme and Co's. Conversely severe anxiety can create a myriad of symptoms that look a lot like lyme.

On top of this, Lyme testing is horrible and inaccurate.

What helped me decide to pursue Lyme further was a couple of factors. My anxiety seemed excessive for the situation i was in, you sound younger so you might not have that historical knowledge about yourself. I had an MRI and it came back with some stuff that shouldn't be there at my age, so that was a factor, but you said your results were normal.

Lastly my CD57 results were really really low, and even though it is not proof that i have lyme, lot's of people believe it is an indicator.

I actually made a document and wrote down all symptoms and results and whether they could be explained by anxiety and whether they could be explained by lyme. For me lyme won out and so i investigated further and finally started treatment, but there really isn't an easy way to distinguish between lyme and somatic symptom disorder caused by anxiety

You could check out anxietycentre.com if you want to investigate anxiety more and learn some skills you can use that should help with symptoms if that is in fact the cause of all your problems. You could also try igenix testing(more precise but still not great) and do other bloodwork if you believe it's lyme.

I tried inducing herxes or flares or whatever, didn't work(what i mean by that, is i couldn't never tell if i was herxing or just experiencing fluctuations in symptoms). And apparently there are lots of people that do not herx.

I hope you find answers, and that your family supports you now and when you find answers. And i pray when you find the cause that you will have an easy recovery.
Posted 8/1/2018 7:53 PM (GMT 0)
Jeff have you looked at the symptom list on this site?

www.lyme-symptoms.com/LymeCoinfectionChart.html
The chart wraps so you need to scroll down for the second part of the symptoms for each infection. Look at the symptoms for Lyme, Babesia, and Bartonella. They are the most common and all three have an anxiety component.

I also like this article for symptoms /www.prohealth.com/library/a-deep-look-at-the-symptoms-of-six-major-lyme-related-infections-41139?utm_content=buffere0f74&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

You mentioned you tested negative for lyme. Maybe your body needs some prompting since Lyme is so good at hiding from our immune system. Many people have had success using olive leaf extract. You take a few drops twice a day for at least two weeks and then test again. Someone else may remember how many drops or we can do a site search.
Posted 8/1/2018 7:58 PM (GMT 0)

jeff8787 said...
Lol thought you meant cat scan. No I am actually allergic to cats.

a lot of cats if not all are carriers for a gram negative proteobacteria called bartonellla. all a cat has to do is scratch u enough to break skin .it could have happen when you were small? it causes a myriad of symptoms but when blood flow was impeded by its biofilms, i felt a sense of constant panic fight or flight , it would even kick off my adrenals in the middle if the nite with spasms ...then came the horrible symptoms ...when u feel amiss its usually pointing to something deeper ..best of luck btw most labs n docs check for 1 or 2 types often inaccurate

Post Edited (bluelyme) : 8/1/2018 2:01:11 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 8/1/2018 7:59 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks for your reply. Anxiety Centre is a great website, I have visited it multiple times. All of my symptoms can definitely be caused by anxiety. And when I consider the odds, that's the much more likely diagnosis. However, I just get aggravated and scared because so far nothing I have tried has helped. On top of this, I am not anxious all the time and do not have panic attacks, yet still have these symptoms persistently. I guess I will try a few more things concerning anxiety treatment and look into Lyme again if there is no improvement.

Garion said...
Hi jeff

That is actually a question i asked myself and on here as well. I think looking at symptoms there are no real good distinguishing factors. Your symptoms, including anxiety can certainly be explained by Lyme and Co's. Conversely severe anxiety can create a myriad of symptoms that look a lot like lyme.

On top of this, Lyme testing is horrible and inaccurate.

What helped me decide to pursue Lyme further was a couple of factors. My anxiety seemed excessive for the situation i was in, you sound younger so you might not have that historical knowledge about yourself. I had an MRI and it came back with some stuff that shouldn't be there at my age, so that was a factor, but you said your results were normal.

Lastly my CD57 results were really really low, and even though it is not proof that i have lyme, lot's of people believe it is an indicator.

I actually made a document and wrote down all symptoms and results and whether they could be explained by anxiety and whether they could be explained by lyme. For me lyme won out and so i investigated further and finally started treatment, but there really isn't an easy way to distinguish between lyme and somatic symptom disorder caused by anxiety

You could check out anxietycentre.com if you want to investigate anxiety more and learn some skills you can use that should help with symptoms if that is in fact the cause of all your problems. You could also try igenix testing(more precise but still not great) and do other bloodwork if you believe it's lyme.

I tried inducing herxes or flares or whatever, didn't work(what i mean by that, is i couldn't never tell if i was herxing or just experiencing fluctuations in symptoms). And apparently there are lots of people that do not herx.

I hope you find answers, and that your family supports you now and when you find answers. And i pray when you find the cause that you will have an easy recovery.

Posted 8/1/2018 8:07 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks for the references. I actually have never done a test for Lyme. Looking at those links, however, makes me feel confident in thinking that I do not have it.

jrpsf said...
Jeff have you looked at the symptom list on this site?

www.lyme-symptoms.com/LymeCoinfectionChart.html
The chart wraps so you need to scroll down for the second part of the symptoms for each infection. Look at the symptoms for Lyme, Babesia, and Bartonella. They are the most common and all three have an anxiety component.

I also like this article for symptoms /www.prohealth.com/library/a-deep-look-at-the-symptoms-of-six-major-lyme-related-infections-41139?utm_content=buffere0f74&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

You mentioned you tested negative for lyme. Maybe your body needs some prompting since Lyme is so good at hiding from our immune system. Many people have had success using olive leaf extract. You take a few drops twice a day for at least two weeks and then test again. Someone else may remember how many drops or we can do a site search.

Posted 8/1/2018 8:09 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks for your suggestions. I appreciate it. smile

bluelyme said...

jeff8787 said...
Lol thought you meant cat scan. No I am actually allergic to cats.

a lot of cats if not all are carriers for a gram negative proteobacteria called bartonellla. all a cat has to do is scratch u enough to break skin .it could have happen when you were small? it causes a myriad of symptoms but when blood flow was impeded by its biofilms, i felt a sense of constant panic fight or flight , it would even kick off my adrenals in the middle if the nite with spasms ...then came the horrible symptoms ...when u feel amiss its usually pointing to something deeper ..best of luck btw most labs n docs check for 1 or 2 types often inaccurate

Posted 8/1/2018 9:28 PM (GMT 0)
If you have already looked at anxiety in depth, and are still experiencing everything it might be worth the time and cost to do the igenix testing, and maybe with what others have said it would be good to try tease out the bacteria with Olive leaf.

I definitely did not mean to discourage you from that course of action. I just wanted to help you as much as i can.
Posted 8/2/2018 12:17 AM (GMT 0)

Garion said...
Hi jeff

.................Lastly my CD57 results were really really low, and even though it is not proof that i have lyme, lot's of people believe it is an indicator.

May or may not be lyme, but it does show your lymphocyte B and T cells are low , which obviously is not normal or healthy.

Is your white blood cell count on the low end? B and T's are part of that.
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