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Can babesia symptoms hide and then show up down the line?

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Posted 2/23/2020 12:38 AM (GMT 0)
Seeking some wisdom from those who might know. Can someone have babesia but not know it?
Back story (this is my son)

positive test for borrelia following EM rash in Nov 2018
treated in acute stage but treatment failed
found LLMD Apirl 2019 - further testing (with lab in Germany) indicated bartonella. Not tested for babesia at that time as no clinical symptoms/signs of babesia
treated on combination abx (various at different times: azithro or clarith + rifampicin + mino or doxy) and herbals for 8 months. made progress but plateaued.
introduced disulfiram Nov 2019. made more progress - up to the point where almost a full week in Jan 2020 was at 90-95% function which was just fantastic to see.

LLMD decided to run further tests which showed T cell activity for borrelia, bartonella ....... and babesia (first time checking for babesia and I never know for sure how reliable these tests are)

End of January 2020 - many gut symptoms started (nausea, diarrhoea - put down to having been on combined abx for some time, added in further gut support and reduced abx by removing mino and reducing rifampicin, maintaining on 200mg disulfiram per day rather than increasing further)
Following weeks: increased symptoms of breathlessness, headaches, tight chest, with occasional days of dizziness/disorientation - all new symptoms not experienced before. Back to feeling exhausted. Palor extremely pale.

Could this be babesia rearing it's ugly head?

I realise that folks here cannot say for sure as no-one really knows what each individual's body is doing, but I wondered if it is unusual for someone to have babesia but show no symptoms and then for these to come on months after treating borrelia and bartonella - and if so, does anyone have any suggestions as to why this might happen?

Thanks for your thoughts folks.
Posted 2/23/2020 1:13 AM (GMT 0)
I had no symptoms of Babesia until I treated it. One rife treatment targeting Babesia was enough to give me air hunger and chest tightness for the first time, which I did not appreciate! I have tested positive for Babesia bacilliformis via DNA ConneXions, but didn't have symptoms of it, unless you count borderline-low ferritin tissue iron levels.
Posted 2/23/2020 1:14 AM (GMT 0)
With those symptoms you describe, I also would consider mold exposure and MCAS.
Posted 2/23/2020 1:14 AM (GMT 0)
Thanks for this - I wonder then if the symptoms might have been triggered from treating with the disulfiram?
Posted 2/23/2020 4:45 AM (GMT 0)
Yes, it is possible for Babesia to rear it’s head during or after treating other infections.
Maybe the Disulfuram has provoked it?
Posted 2/23/2020 5:03 AM (GMT 0)
Disulfiram seems to have brought out babesia symptoms for me.. especially night sweats. Before DSF I would get night sweats every once in a while, and for maybe 3 or 4 nights in a row. Now I seem to get them every night.

Is your son's blood work normal?
Posted 2/23/2020 8:42 AM (GMT 0)
potsnpans bloods due to be checked on Tuesday. WBC has fluctuated while on abx. Last check these were slightly low. ALT slightly high - but has just moved to 250 DSF hence reduced back to 200. We’ll see what this week shows
Posted 2/23/2020 9:20 AM (GMT 0)

Girlie said...
Yes, it is possible for Babesia to rear it’s head during or after treating other infections.
Maybe the Disulfuram has provoked it?

Girlie - I may be clutching at straws somewhat, but what are your thoughts on this happening when the other infections start to get under control a bit - as in the babesia rises up when the opportunity is then presented? or do you think this is just totally random?
Posted 2/23/2020 12:23 PM (GMT 0)
Disulfiram alone is reported to be effective against babesia, so it would be unusual for it to relapse while taking 200 mg per day disulfriam.

However, continuing disulfiram and stopping minocycline is a very bad idea if you have bartonella. Disulfiram will not kill bartonella, and it can relapse under these circumstances. Rifampicin might not kill bartonella either, as bartonella can be resistant to it.
Posted 2/23/2020 1:12 PM (GMT 0)

Quin said...
Disulfiram alone is reported to be effective against babesia, so it would be unusual for it to relapse while taking 200 mg per day disulfriam.

However, continuing disulfiram and stopping minocycline is a very bad idea if you have bartonella. Disulfiram will not kill bartonella, and it can relapse under these circumstances. Rifampicin might not kill bartonella either, as bartonella can be resistant to it.

Thanks for this Quin. He hasn't exactly relapsed - he has never shown any signs of babesia before this - his LLMD didn't think at the start that was necessarily an issue but she did suggest it might show up later on as the borrelia and bartonella (bartonella especially) were more dominant, and that's what I am wondering - have others come across babesia months down the line when they didn't have any of the symptoms at the start. We had kind of hoped that babesia wasn't going to show up ever (2/3 is bad enough but if it is all 3 then that's what we have to work with)
Posted 2/23/2020 5:41 PM (GMT 0)
I don't know if babesia can show up months later. What I do know is that many people report that disulfiram can make bartonella flare. Taking disulfiram without minocycline is a really bad idea if you have bartonella.
Posted 2/23/2020 6:02 PM (GMT 0)

L4m3M0M said...

Girlie said...
Yes, it is possible for Babesia to rear it’s head during or after treating other infections.
Maybe the Disulfuram has provoked it?

Girlie - I may be clutching at straws somewhat, but what are your thoughts on this happening when the other infections start to get under control a bit - as in the babesia rises up when the opportunity is then presented? or do you think this is just totally random?

//////////////////////////////////

Yes and no I don’t think it’s random.
Posted 2/23/2020 6:04 PM (GMT 0)
Dr J treats Babesia early on - and I believe he treats all patients for it.
It’s a major player.
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