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My LLPA (who's worked with Dr. J for years) Is Now Suggesting Triphala Guggulu--Anyone Familiar?

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Posted 1/2/2021 9:09 AM (GMT 0)
I've had a lot of joint damage, and continue to, I believe--after being on Dr. J's abx & herb protocols for over a year. Lyme protocol, Lyme & Babesia protocol, and now Lyme/Bart protocol. I've most probably had Lyme long-term, have awful shoulder pain and weakness there, degenerated spinal discs, hip pain, neck pain & weakness, and weird blood clots in the deep veins of my legs (that one possibly due to Bart or Babesia). I've wanted to start on Echinacea or other Hyaluronidase Inhibitors (like Ashwagandha and Ch. Skullcap), to help slow destruction and maybe even start rebuilding joints/cartilage. But my LLPA is now strongly convinced of the benefits of Triphala guggulu (Ayurvedic herb combo based on Myrrh), for Hyaluronidase and Collagenase Inhibition.. She (Anne W.) also wants me to take EGCG, Quercitin, and Curcumin for the same purpose.

Is anyone familiar with Triphala guggulu? I haven't seen much mention of it at all, in the forum. Help?

Post Edited (BlueRidgeDave) : 1/2/2021 2:13:19 AM (GMT-7)

Posted 1/2/2021 4:46 PM (GMT 0)
Rawls talks about triphala primarily for colon health. He says, "Triphala [is] an age-old herbal combination from India that has been used for thousands of years to restore normal colon function. Triphala contains three dried fruits, amalaki, bibhitaki, and haritaki, in powder form. Triphala provides a mild safe laxative action, but also helps restore normal muscular tone in the colon. Triphala is safe to use on a regular basis." He contrasts it with many other intestinal toners and laxatives that are not safe for ongoing use. This doesn't sound like your issue, but I thought I'd share, as it's the only familiarity I have with triphala.
Posted 1/2/2021 5:27 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks, saraeli, but I don't seem to have that issue, thankfully. So you hadn't heard of it being an immune modulator, except for the G.I. ? According to some research papers that Anne W. sent me, Triphala guggulu was used historically in India for wound healing and ear-nose-throat diseases, also.

Post Edited (BlueRidgeDave) : 1/2/2021 10:33:04 AM (GMT-7)

Posted 1/2/2021 9:16 PM (GMT 0)
I had seen some studies in the past that indicated Triphala had beneficial effects on the microbiome - in terms of diversity and shifts towards what was thought to be a healthy pattern.
I hadn't come across the colon toning effects before - that's interesting as i had a prolapsed colon due to Lyme and co-infections( later found there are lots of case studies of this happening to lyme patients even in 40's and 50's) and this is still not right so maybe that would be of use for me.

this paper summarises its therapeutic uses with some scientific references:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5567597/

the abstract reads
"In addition to laxative action, Triphala research has found the formula to be potentially effective for several clinical uses such as appetite stimulation, reduction of hyperacidity, antioxidant, anti-inflammatory, immunomodulating, antibacterial, antimutagenic, adaptogenic, hypoglycemic, antineoplastic, chemoprotective, and radioprotective effects, and prevention of dental caries. Polyphenols in Triphala modulate the human gut microbiome and thereby promote the growth of beneficial Bifidobacteria and Lactobacillus while inhibiting the growth of undesirable gut microbes. "
Posted 1/3/2021 3:25 AM (GMT 0)
Thanks, Garzie, for the link. Sounds like a very interesting herb combo--almost too good to be true in its wide-ranging beneficial effects. Possibly better at helping with certain health issues over others.

Post Edited (BlueRidgeDave) : 1/2/2021 8:28:46 PM (GMT-7)

Posted 1/3/2021 6:49 AM (GMT 0)
BTW- Garzie, and saraeli, and anyone else that's interested: Here's some more good info (a pdf file) about Triphala guggulu, that my LLPA sent me.

God, this forum is difficult!--I couldn't just copy & paste the .pdf, but had to find the original URL where my LLPA found this article. Hope that maybe it's of some help to someone!

https://www.ias.ac.in/article/fulltext/jbsc/032/04/0755-0761

Post Edited (BlueRidgeDave) : 1/2/2021 11:56:24 PM (GMT-7)

Posted 1/3/2021 1:35 PM (GMT 0)
Ive not tried it but when I consulted when my parents consulted an Ayurvedic practitioner for me for Lyme triphala was on the list of herbs to take.

I ended up taking buhners so never tried it would be interested to know how you get on if you do end up taking it
Posted 1/3/2021 3:17 PM (GMT 0)

BlueRidgeDave said...
BTW- Garzie, and saraeli, and anyone else that's interested: Here's some more good info (a pdf file) about Triphala guggulu, that my LLPA sent me.

God, this forum is difficult!--I couldn't just copy & paste the .pdf, but had to find the original URL where my LLPA found this article. Hope that maybe it's of some help to someone!

https://www.ias.ac.in/article/fulltext/jbsc/032/04/0755-0761

I have had a quick read of that article and noticed a couple of things

1, what the authors are writing about is not what is normally referred to as Triphala. instead, its a further combination of herbs and processes that makes something distinct called Triphala guggulu. ( the herb mix normally referred to as Triphala is one of the base ingredients along with long peppers) I guess you know this as you are careful to list the full name of the remedy in your first post. I am guessing very few people will have tried this particular remedy though - vs Triphala itself which is pretty common in ayurvedic medicine

2, there are some rather odd conversions of units on the first page. I find this frustrating in scientific papers that have typically been reviewed by several authors and contributors prior to publication and yet basic errors remain...
Posted 1/3/2021 4:21 PM (GMT 0)
Hi!

I am making an appointment with AW next week. How has she been for you?
Posted 1/4/2021 1:34 AM (GMT 0)
Hello, Mommyc!

Mommyc said...
I am making an appointment with AW next week. How has she been for you?

I've found Anne to be quite kind and thoughtful, though sometimes overworked, I think. You can basically be doing the Dr. J protocols (at a much lower cost), by working with her. She worked for Dr. J when he was in NC--and now continues to work with him by making monthly trips up to his practice in Wash DC. At times I've felt that perhaps she's not intuitive enough to be a really good Lyme Doc--though she's willing to look into alternative methods at times (like the way she's recommending Triphala guggulu, lately). But perhaps Dr. J is using that now, also, and she's just following his lead. I still don't know, from Anne, about which organism is causing the majority of my problems. Although she does think that I've got deeply-embedded, and dormant-form Lyme Borrelia. My Herxes, that I get ever time on the current protocol that I'm doing (designed for Lyme & Bartonella--though we made a couple of modifications) seem, in her opinion, to be deep and dormant-form Borrelia.
Good luck with your healing!!
Posted 1/4/2021 5:10 AM (GMT 0)
“ You can basically be doing the Dr. J protocols (at a much lower cost),“

Are you talking about her appt costs?
Posted 1/4/2021 8:48 AM (GMT 0)
Thank you for your input. Can you tell me how long you’ve had Lyme? Also, has Anne got you better some?
Posted 1/4/2021 9:09 PM (GMT 0)
Hey Dave, Would you email me, I’d like to chat about things. [email protected] I’m newly diagnosed and pretty terrified.
Posted 1/4/2021 9:10 PM (GMT 0)
Yes, Girlie, I was only referring to AW's appointment costs. Certainly her 1st appointment is not cheap--as I'm sure is most often the case with Lyme Docs--but once established, appointment costs are reasonable. Abx, and supplements . . . that's a whole other ball of wax (or should I say "wad of bills." lol
Posted 1/4/2021 9:32 PM (GMT 0)

Mommyc said...
"Can you tell me how long you've had Lyme? Also, has Anne got you better some?

It's very possible that I've had Lyme for decades, Mommyc. I lived in Connecticut in the 1980's, where Lyme was first becoming widespread. And I was careful. I was somewhat living outdoors at that time. Having probably been infected for years doesn't mean I've got the immune system of Superman--not at all. The organisms (or organism--Borrelia) just does its nasty work stealthily, modifying the host's immune system for its own benefit. But it's only been the last few years where my joint pain & damage has been impossible to ignore. Anne's help (and more than a year on antibiotics & herbs) hasn't been miraculous at all. But I'm afraid I can't expect it to be. Long-term Lyme, I'm afraid, means you'll never be completely rid of it. After my next round of antibiotics, with Anne, I'll most likely talk to her about being on an herbal protocol, from then on. And I actually expect that wiil show more positive improvement--but the idea is, we wanted to knock back as much of the organisms as we could, first.
Posted 1/4/2021 9:36 PM (GMT 0)
And I'll be more than happy to email you. I've got a few chores to do before dark, but I'll email you this evening.
Posted 1/4/2021 10:24 PM (GMT 0)
Mommyc, I also see AW and second BlueRidgeDave's opinion of her.

I really like her and think she is quite knowledgeable but do also think that outside of Dr. J's protocol, she could be a bit limited in treatment protocol knowledge. Dr. J's protocol is a good one, but it seemed like the Lyme/Babesia protocol was too much for me and made me worse. I mentioned some other treatment options (ABX) to her which she was willing to let me try. I've improved some on that and may go back to a modified Dr. J Lyme/Babesia protocol soon.

Self-study (like on this forum) is very valuable. So many ideas from others who are dealing with similar illness.
Posted 1/4/2021 11:09 PM (GMT 0)

BlueRidgeDave said...
Yes, Girlie, I was only referring to AW's appointment costs. Certainly her 1st appointment is not cheap--as I'm sure is most often the case with Lyme Docs--but once established, appointment costs are reasonable. Abx, and supplements . . . that's a whole other ball of wax (or should I say "wad of bills." lol

I kept reading that dr J’s appts are a lot - but they’re not too bad.
I’ve seen a lot higher.

After the initial one - which was over two hours long - they’re not so bad.
I believe all mine are under $500.

What I like - is after the initial two appts - the appts are every 3-4 months... and then 6 months apart.

Are AW’s appts also not every month?
Posted 1/5/2021 12:51 AM (GMT 0)
Right now, I'm doing an appointment every 2 months. I think she would stretch my appointments out longer if I were doing the standard Dr. J protocols.

I'm paying about $165 for a 45 min. appointment now.
Posted 1/5/2021 1:12 AM (GMT 0)
“ I'm paying about $165 for a 45 min. appointment now.“

That’s a good price - trying to remember - my last one was $399 I think - and I believe it was just under an hour.
Posted 1/6/2021 4:08 AM (GMT 0)
Yes, Girlie,, pretty much as ChristianWithLyme said, "Right now, I'm doing an appointment every 2 months. I think she would stretch my appointments out longer if I were doing the standard Dr. J protocols." AW isn't rigorous about the number, or how frequently, our visits are, esp. if you're doing the Dr. J standard protocols. (I have been, though with some modifications, esp. to the Lyme/Bart treatment.). She's raised her charges a little (and most of us have been just doing phone consults in 2020)--her "New Patient-moderately complex" office visit is $355, and for a complex case $455. I think I've also been paying $165 for an "extensive" phone consult--usually 45 minutes.

Post Edited (BlueRidgeDave) : 1/5/2021 9:12:02 PM (GMT-7)

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