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Anyone familiar with Sonia R? (Lyme-Literate MD in Chapel Hill, NC)

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Posted 5/12/2021 7:57 PM (GMT 0)
I wondered if anyone has used Sonia R. for Lyme (or other) treatments. She used to call her clinic Haven Medical (in Chapel Hill), but apparently is now treating patients with Lyme, Mold, Chronic Inflammatory illness--and doing so, with a fairly short (2 month) intensive treatment. I had a good initial Zoom consult with her earlier this week, since I've been disappointed with results (which have been spotty, at best) with a Lyme practitioner who has worked, for years, with Dr. J. and his treatment protocols.

One major issue that I had last year was with vascular problems in my legs & feet. Since Dr. J. doesn't seem to believe that Bartonella can be a problematic co-infection, my Lyme practitioner also didn't, though she never explained her thoughts on why I was having major vascular problems in my lower body, including Deep Vein Thrombosis. In speaking with this new MD, Sonia R., she felt right away that the vascular stuff could be either Bart or Babesia (and possibly caused by Herxing too quickly/intensely). She seems very knowledgeable about Bart (and Lyme Borrelia, of course), which would be valuable to me, and also believes very much in testing. My recent Lyme Practitioner, being of the Dr. J school of thought, seemed to be quite dismissive of testing, though in fact several good labs now are doing state-of-the-art testing which has so much improved in the last few years. Yet I DO believe that the CDC testing is crap, and only appropriate for newly-infected Lyme cases (I may have had Lyme since the 1980s).

One problem, in my mind, is that her (essentially 2-month treatment) is highly expensive, and I would think that a 2 month limit on treatment might not be enough! If a patient has to get another month of evaluation/treatment, there's another substantial charge for that. What do y'all think--and if anyone's had experience with Sonia's practice, I'd love to hear about it!

Post Edited (BlueRidgeDave) : 5/12/2021 9:49:26 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/12/2021 10:54 PM (GMT 0)
“ Since Dr. J. doesn't seem to believe that Bartonella can be a problematic co-infection,“

That’s not true. Maybe in your case she (not DrJ) thought in your particular case that bart wasn’t your main issue?

For me under the care of DrJ, , Bartonella has been more of a focus.

I initially did 4-5 months of Babesia treatment.
That was followed by Bartonella/Persisters for approx 6 months and then transitioned to a maintenance protocol that has me taking Bartonella abx... no Babesia.

He does, however, thinks Babesia needs to fall first and wants it treated before bart.

A friend of mine who also sees Dr J has been on Bartonella treatment over for six months now and isn’t finished yet - still not transitioned to maintenance -
Posted 5/13/2021 11:47 AM (GMT 0)
I am in GA and met someone locally who was seeing SR. She liked her but was looking to find another practitioner, as traveling to NC was becoming too much.

I don’t know anything about her 2 month treatment. What does it involve?

Will you be seeing her in person? Seems like most states have laws that a doctor has to see you in person and do a physical exam at least once a year in order to “treat” you and prescribe anything. Those who did long distance consulting in the past were limited to “consulting” and could not treat you as a patient. COVID changed a lot of things, so I am not sure what the laws are anymore.

Post Edited (WalkingbyFaith) : 5/13/2021 5:50:47 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/13/2021 5:42 PM (GMT 0)
Hey, WalkingByFaith, here's a copy & paste section of the contract that they want you to sign before Sonia is able to move forward in beginning testing and a treatment plan. I'm having a hard time coping with the price (basically $4,000 plus, per month???). A bit less, and I would take it seriously, if a lot is accomplished. In the initial ($275.) Zoom consult, Sonia spent more than 45 minutes talking with me about my combination of health conditions, and seems to be a very caring MD, and expert with Lyme.

"Complex Condition Evaluation 3: $7,920
The program includes:
• Two-month complex condition evaluation, testing, diagnosis,
and implementation.
• Three appointments with Dr. Rapaport.
• Full access to patient portal, clinical staff, and coaching support.
Evaluation - Diagnosis timeline:
• Records review < 90-minutes (before initial appointment.)
• One initial extended appointment for 120-minutes on Zoom
covering personal and medical history and discussing
possible treatment recommendations.
• One physical exam < 60-minutes – in person.
• One comprehensive concluding appointment 90-minutes via Zoom.
• Two months clinical access, patient portal, management, and coaching.
Payment Summary
Program cost: $8,987
Minus consult fee: - $275
Minus new patient discount: - $792
Net cost: $7,920
Initial non-refundable down payment
with e-signed agreement: $2,640
First payment before first appointment: $2,640
Final payment before last appointment: $2,640
*Lab work, test costs estimated between $2,200 and $3,700. (If IGL is added total
top is $7,150.)"

One of the reviews I read (on a medical care website) was from a family in Georgia who finally decided that Sonia's treatments (along with travel costs) was just too expensive for them. They mentioned a Lyme practitioner in the Atlanta are who was quite good and a whole lot less expensive. Any idea about who they might have been referring to, WalkingByFaith?
Posted 5/13/2021 6:25 PM (GMT 0)
I don’t know who they may be referring to. Perhaps the person you left.

I don’t know how this compares to other LLMD’s as far as cost. The 2 practitioners I have seen didn’t operate like this. They had a cost for the initial 2 hour appointment and followups are charged according to their quarter hour rate for the time used. Testing was not included in a prepaid package.

I, personally, would be very nervous and reluctant to sign any kind of contract and pre-pay costs like that. I know there are other providers who do this, but it doesn’t sit well with me.
Posted 5/13/2021 6:30 PM (GMT 0)
Ugghh.. we're powerless and they know it.

I would ask for some kind of guarantee after the 2 months (even if unrealistic).. like maybe 4k back if no improvement- just to see how they respond.

Sorry to hear your still struggling. How was the deep vein thrombosis diagnosed?
Posted 5/13/2021 7:45 PM (GMT 0)
Dave,

Something odd just struck me. You said she has a 2-month “intensive” treatment. Then you said she thought the deep vein thrombosis could be from “ either Bart or Babesia (and possibly caused by Herxing too quickly/intensely)”. Did she say that about herxing, or was that your thinking? If she said that, then what happens to patients who can’t tolerate “intensive” treatment?

What exactly is the treatment? From what I can understand, it looks like the costs is for a certain number of appointments and testing. Treatment is not included in the cost from what I can see.
Posted 5/14/2021 12:58 AM (GMT 0)
Holy smokes!

I would never agree to that plan. First, to be fair, at least they are laying it out there. The cost and what is entailed in the cost, but wow, everything there looks pretty typical to me. The cost is outrageous.
Posted 5/14/2021 1:14 AM (GMT 0)
“ I, personally, would be very nervous and reluctant to sign any kind of contract and pre-pay costs like that. I know there are other providers who do this, but it doesn’t sit well with me.“

It doesn’t sit well with me either, WbF
Posted 5/14/2021 11:06 AM (GMT 0)
Dave,
I looked up reviews online and saw the one I think you were referring to. Said they left when asked to pay more money and had not been helped. The patient was a child. They said they went to a naturopath in Atlanta who got her GI issues resolved in 5 weeks. I’m not sure who that was. Running Wild might have an idea. He’s in the Atlanta area.

I also looked at her website and what she had to say. Her education is quite broad. Sounds like she’s definitely not your average doctor. She does mention she is integrative - uses a lot of non- pharma treatments but also Rx when necessary. She’s also a reiki master, which I didn’t know. I do not do New Age, so that was a detractor for me.

I think the person I know who sees her also mentioned she was expensive in addition to the pain and expense of traveling. I think she had been seeing her for a couple of years. This person has severe fatigue issues and was still pretty home bound at the time I talked to her. She had mold illness but had also tested positive for Lyme and did a short treatment for Lyme early on with a different doctor.

Frankly, I was surprised this person was not better off. I think she had a hard time getting in a clean enough environment, similar to me.

There are far too many patients who don’t improve or only minimally improve even after going to more notable providers. It should not be that way. Of course there are many who do get better. I guess the ones who don’t are more likely to end up here and tell about it.

Since you are concerned about vascular problems and was not treated for bartonella, have you considered treating yourself herbally for bartonella for a trial period to see what happens?
Posted 5/17/2021 4:50 PM (GMT 0)
Sorry, folks, for going AWOL for a few days (after posting my question). I thought I was only getting a couple of responses. And, Girlie, sorry if I offended about Dr. J and his protocols: "That’s not true. Maybe in your case she (not DrJ) thought in your particular case that bart wasn’t your main issue?
For me under the care of DrJ, , Bartonella has been more of a focus."

AW, who I've been using, in the Asheville, NC area, has worked alongside Dr. J for years (and essentially uses his protocols), but frankly I don't think that she's as intuitive or knowledgeable in trying to help us Lyme folks. In fact, she did have me on a "Lyme Bart" protocol, which I was actually on for 5 months (though there was a 2-week break period after each "Round" of abx). So because of the 2-week breaks, I actually was only on abx for Lyme Borrelia & Bart for half of that 5 month period. I was surprised, once, actually, when I asked AW if my vascular problems in 2020 could be due to Bart--and she said she didn't think so. W*F? From what little I've read about Bart (and the Lyme rash photo page you sent me as a link)--it could easily be Bart causing lower-body vascular problems.

From some articles I've read about Dr. M's treatment for Bart patients (in Wash. DC), he sometimes treats for like 2 years on abx for serious Bart infections. And with enzymes/biofilm-breakers. Anyway, sorry if I offended, about Dr. J--I've never spoken with him as a patient, and I shouldn't be making pronouncements about his methods.

Post Edited (BlueRidgeDave) : 5/17/2021 11:07:17 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/17/2021 6:31 PM (GMT 0)
“ From some articles I've read about Dr. M's treatment for Bart patients (in Wash. DC), he sometimes treats for like 2 years on abx for serious Bart infections. And with enzymes/biofilm-breakers“

Are you talking about Dr M from Galaxy Labs?

Dr J also addresses biofilms - in fact I’m still taking biofilm busters on my maintenance protocol.
Posted 5/18/2021 5:59 PM (GMT 0)
Girlie: B.Rob.M (MD), at the Translational Medicine Group, N. Bethesda, MD. My neighbor went to him for several years, thought he was brilliant. I believe he did have something to do with starting Galaxy Labs, along with a Veterinary Researcher at NC State Univ.
Posted 5/18/2021 6:07 PM (GMT 0)
Did your neighbor have bartonella? Did your neighbor get to remission with Dr. M?
Posted 5/18/2021 6:10 PM (GMT 0)
WalkingByFaith said: "I, personally, would be very nervous and reluctant to sign any kind of contract and pre-pay costs like that. I know there are other providers who do this, but it doesn’t sit well with me."

Doesn't sit well with me either. And the $8,000. contract is essentially just for the 2-month "Complex Condition Evaluation." (Lab testing extra, of course.) This practice seems to let you know of the costs piecemeal. I wasn't clear on this till I emailed the Office Manager there. Treatment (after the Evaluation) would more than likely involve ANOTHER contract, and high cost.

WalkingbyFaith said: "Did your neighbor have bartonella? Did your neighbor get to remission with Dr. M?"

My neighbor was clinically diagnosed with Bart (along with Lyme), and had severe joint pain issues (could barely walk). She told me recently that Dr. M. wasn't getting positive test results for Bart, though he did make the clinical diagnosis--he feels that there are many subspecies of Bart, and the testing just wasn't showing positive for the one she's got. She would prob. say that she's gotten to 95% remission, though there was dramatic improvement in just the first few weeks of abx treatment for Lyme. I believe that my neighbor hasn't been to Dr. M in a couple of years, but is just maintaining with good diet, anti-inflammatories like turmeric, etc.

Post Edited (BlueRidgeDave) : 5/18/2021 12:22:13 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/18/2021 6:41 PM (GMT 0)
potsnpans said, "Sorry to hear your still struggling. How was the deep vein thrombosis diagnosed?"

My primary care physician referred me to a vascular specialist, after I'd had swollen feet and purplish toes for about 2 months (following a major Herx I had in Dec. of 2019). The vascular specialist could tell almost immediately (doing simple ultrasound of veins & arteries in my feet), that I had a pretty serious problem. They put me on a blood-thinner (Eliquis) right then & there. A week later, a more intensive ultrasound of my lower body (arteries AND veins), showed right away that I had partly occlusive blood clots in both legs--in the Great Saphenous veins. Pretty serious stuff, and can even be fatal . . . but those clots disappeared after a couple months on the blood-thinner.

BTW- In my initial (Zoom meeting) consult with Sonia R, MD, she mentioned how even busting up biofilms too quickly can cause blood clots. She DOES seem to know her stuff--I'll give her that--though the costly contract she uses seems outrageous!
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