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Liver and abx

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Posted 8/10/2021 3:04 AM (GMT 0)
Hello, I was just wondering what are some things I should look out for concerning the the liver while on these abx. Currently have been on ceftin and Biaxin for a little more than a year. Clindymycin for 6 months and minocycline for 6 weeks. I seemed to tolerate everything till minocycline was added. Feeling more nauseous and not as hungry. I also been having cold sweats and heat intolerance. My llmd does not check these labs often and idk why? I am going to demand another liver and kidney function lab to be ran. Last one was early spring. They always look good but being on 4 abx, plus malarone and nystain. It can't be the greatest long term. Anyone else been on ot of abx at once?
Posted 8/10/2021 4:38 AM (GMT 0)
“ My llmd does not check these labs often and idk why? I am going to demand another liver and kidney function lab to be ran. Last one was early spring. They always look good but being on 4 abx, plus malarone and nystain. It can't be the greatest long term. Anyone else been on ot of abx at once?“


If you’re on long term abx - your llmd should have you doing liver and kidney function plus more every 4 weeks .
I was on several for 6 months:
Rifabutin, Ceftin, minocycline, Dapsone, Daraprim, Clindamycin, Alinia and Tinidazole,

They weren’t all taken together.
One week was dapsone, Daraprim, ceftin, mino, Rifabutin, Tinidazole
Second week was clindamycin, minocycline and Rifabutin
Week 3 or 4 was Alinia.

I may have forgotten a thing or two - it was 2018.

That was one cycle.

I did 6 cycles. It was killer!
Posted 8/10/2021 10:26 AM (GMT 0)
as above - liver function should be checked at regular intervals if on combination abx - esp if those are abx known to cause raised liver enzymes -

usually complete blood counts are taken at the same time - as many abx can cause derangement of platelets or white blood cell counts

there are private testing companies now that have liver function test available for a small fee

the other signs of liver damage are jaundice and the following
-Skin and eyes that appear yellowish (jaundice)
-Abdominal pain and swelling.
-Swelling in the legs and ankles.
-Itchy skin.
-Dark urine color.
-Pale stool color.
-Chronic fatigue.
-Nausea or vomiting.

but you don't want to rely on these signs as the signs are not consistent in everyone and damage is already done by this stage.

you may also wish to speak to your doctor about taking things to help protect the liver from damage / control raised liver enzymes while on these heavy combinations

some well known LLMD's use the following in patients with raised liver enzymes who wish to continue treating with abx
-alpha lipoic acid
-glutathione
-NAC
-milk thistle extract
Posted 8/10/2021 10:47 AM (GMT 0)
I second what Garzie said, especially the part about the damage being done when you notice those symptoms.

Blood work is super important,.. my liver enzymes were 300% above the normal limit on disulfiram and I had no symptoms... I had no idea it was raised.

Also, I'd like to add TUDCA to the list of supplements, it's super effective (and fast) in bringing liver enzymes down.
Posted 8/10/2021 3:55 PM (GMT 0)
Ok thanks waiting on hearing a response from my Dr. In the meantime I am problem going to suspend treatment till I get those labe values back.
Posted 8/12/2021 6:38 PM (GMT 0)
Getting labs right now and hoping the best so I can continue to treat. I cut my dosage down to 1 a day of abx instead of 2x a day. Wanted to keep something in my system. Does cholestyramine effect the liver? Or is that a safe binder?
Posted 8/12/2021 6:46 PM (GMT 0)
Just an FYI - I had raised liver enzymes when I was treating with my first lyme doc (2014 to 2016) for several months. He wasn’t too concerned.
I was concerned my regular Dr who was giving me lab reqs for the testing would say I should stop treatment.
But - She said mine weren’t high enough to be concerned - she had seen non Lyme patients on medications with way higher liver enzymes and they resolved after the meds were removed.

And mine are good now.
Posted 8/12/2021 6:57 PM (GMT 0)
The doctor I have seen at home for several years orders a comp panel and CBC every month. She understands the impact treatment may have on liver and kidneys. It really makes no sense not to.
Posted 8/12/2021 9:01 PM (GMT 0)
to try and give some perspective on raised liver enzymes and how raised is a problem

obviously raised above normal lab limits is a concern - but i have read several LLMDs saying they are not too concerned if a patients liver enzymes are 2x or even 3x normal high limit while on abx combo's
as long as they are not continuing to climb - they can continue treatment

its at this stage they would use the various ALA, Glutathione, NAC etc to help lower or stabilise the liver enzymes

this's what i found when i was looking into my own case of raised liver function tests
if you have complications with liver already or some other special case you may need to be more cautions
Posted 8/12/2021 9:10 PM (GMT 0)
If you live in the states you can order lab panels yourself CBC and CMP usually are about $40 total. Your doctor should be ordering them and it would suck you have to order them yourself but you have to do what you have to do. www.ultalabtests.com is the one I usually use but there are several.
Posted 8/12/2021 9:50 PM (GMT 0)
Liver and kidneys according to the labwork seem ok. I did have slightly over the normal range of lymphocytes. Is that normal?
Posted 8/13/2021 10:55 AM (GMT 0)
obviously not "normal" as such - as they set the lab ranges by working out what limits cover 90% of people - and call that "normal"

but slightly over is nothing to be concerned about - slightly high or low on one type or another on a CBC is common in the lyme community - can be a different one each time you are tested - or settle into a pattern
Posted 8/13/2021 12:52 PM (GMT 0)
Could the Mino be causing a herx? I've heard it can hit some Babs.
Posted 8/13/2021 1:09 PM (GMT 0)
I figured that granocytes were a little on the high side as well as lymphocytes a smidgen over. I'm thinking herxing or the recent laceration on the bottom of .you foot from. A kayak topple in a river.
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