Could this be a useful way of reducing inflammation in Lyme disease?

a study a few years ago in the journal of immunology found that baking soda taken orally between meals did 2 things
- caused a rebound in stomach acid ready for the next meal - aiding digestion
- cause changes in the immune cells in the spleen from an inflammatory state to a regulatory state in via a mechanism akin to vagal nerve stimulation

it has been found helpful in various auto-immune conditions that all have common factors of hyper permeable gut membrane and dysregulated immune function at their core.

chronic lyme disease also seems to have immune dysregulation at its core - is known to cause changes in the gut microbiota - and many people here also seem to have many signs of gut inflammation, leaky gut, gastritis, colitis, sibo etc etc - basically all associated with excess inflammation in the gut

i also wonder if this could be the mechanism behind the helpful symptom reducing effects of Alka-Seltzer Effervescent Gold in lyme patients - eg during herx - which is thought to be some kind of immune modulated inflammatory event.
and which i note contains similar doses of bicarbonate as used in the above
Potassium Bicarbonate 344 mg; Sodium Bicarbonate (Heat-Treated) 1050 mg

study here
https://www.jimmunol.org/content/200/10/3568

We speculate that the anti-inflammatory effects of oral NaHCO3 ingestion are mediated by activation of the cholinergic anti-inflammatory pathway. The cholinergic anti-inflammatory pathway has been reported to be the efferent arm of the anti-inflammatory reflex, which acts via vagal efferents to promote M2 macrophage polarization in the spleen and limit activation of the innate immune system, thereby preventing damage caused by excessive cytokine production

has anyone tried this ?

thought it worth discussion at any rate

I read about it a few times but never tried it. I believe it was Ellie who recommended it for herxing when doing BVT, said it helped quite a bit. Tried to find it years ago, but was tough to get. Readily available now, just checked. I didn’t read that study in its entirety yet but what’s the recommended dosage? Appeared they were testing it on rats in the study

dcd2103 said...
I did a post on this maybe a year ago. I tried ASG and noticed it seemed to help my symptoms (a little). Was asking why that might be, until I came across the information on vagal nerve stimulation and the spleen.

It does seem to work for me. It’s the bicarbonate that does it, so I prefer Alka seltzer gold because it has sodium and potassium bicarbonate I believe. Taking only one can throw the other electrolyte off (I read somewhere, dunno if that’s true).

dcd, yep defo the bicarbonate that is the useful agent

i had been trialling swapping some of my sodium chloride for potassium chloride recently - as low potassium is linked to heart arrhythmias and i had been getting those alot - was thinking maybe my salt intake with Keto could be high and not helping - or the small ongoing doses of Licorice with the buhner herbs could be messing with electrolytes - but made v little if any difference after 3 weeks so think its likley something driven by immune reactions - or just bart. but still might be better to take some as potassium rather than just load up on extra sodium

curious - how much did you settle on taking and how long before meals

Thinking it is the high PH in baking soda giving the effect so maybe the same healing would result from rising the general body PH..?

MooseSafari said...
Thinking it is the high PH in baking soda giving the effect so maybe the same healing would result from rising the general body PH..?

i think bicarbonate really acts more like a buffer than a strong alkali - absorbing the acid and neutralising the PH nearer to 7
part of the theory is that this causes the stomach to react by making more acid to compensate and restore lower PH ( acidity) once the buffer has gone - something i think they have demonstrated - presumably improving digestion by lowering PH and aiding protein digesting enzymes ( most / many antigenic compounds in foods are proteins ) - maybe also reducing bacterial activity in the small intestine - strong acid kills bacteria

how exactly the vagus nerve system is stimulated by the bicarb to reduce inappropriate immune activation is less clear - but that is one of the documented effects - and perhaps the one that is of more interest to those of us with lyme et al - as the dysregulated immune system seems to go hand in hand with lyme.

it doesn't seem to depend on alkalising the body or the blood - something else is at work involving the autonomic nervous system and its interplay with the immune system.

the study had a little movie of neuron like structures ( mini brain ???) firing in the spleen - its leading edge stuff but hard to interpret right now as the picture is incomplete
other studies have however show inter connected communication paths between internal organs

Post Edited (Garzie) : 9/22/2021 4:56:11 AM (GMT-6)

i am giving it a go

best plan i can deduce from the above is to start with about a gram of bicarbonate of soda in 250ml of water approx 2hrs before meals - currently taking it before lunch which is one of my bigger meals

i cant notice any difference at this low dose - but no adverse reaction either - so will try 2g next for a few days and report back