High dose thiamine for neuro issues

I wrote a post on this a while back but never actually tried it myself (started the benfothiamine protocol, but stopped all supplements a week later due to a side effect from another supplement I was trying to pin down, never started back up).

Basically there’s an NP out there named Elliot Overton who claims that high dose thiamine can remedy a lot of chronic issues. The theory being that a lot of people are functionally, but not clinically, thiamine deficient due to disruption of enzyme activity by toxins and infections, and you have to supplement w high doses to overcome that enzymatic deficiency.

Had kind of forgotten about that until someone recently was telling me that thiamine supplementation cured her “internal vibrations”. Then I came across another post from a user claiming thiamine cured his dysautonomia:


https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/dysautonomia/comments/ctl3pg/ill_keep_pushing_the_thiamine_because_it_working/

Video by Elliot Overton (there are many you can search for):

https://youtu.be/o-aqhxp97oa

Also:

https://www.eonutrition.co.uk/post/mega-dose-thiamine-beyond-addressing-deficiency

There are several forms, and picking the right form for you is key, w benfothiamine being the one that doesn’t penetrate the BBB but is better for neuropathy (he recommends dosage up to 2g/day), and allithiamine/sulbuthiamine being better for low serotonin/dopamine, mood issues and dysautonomia.

Anyway, w the amount of neurological issues I’ve seen recently on this board, I thought I’d remind people of this potential treatment option. Maybe some people can try it and see if it helps anyone.

Possible that some of the people w resistant dysautonomia and mood issues could benefit from allithiamine/sulbuthiamine (better to start w allithiamine, I went down the rabbit whole a while ago on sulbuthiamine and it can cause some dependency if used for too long I think), I believe 200-600mg, and high doses of bento for neuropathy 2000mg

I plan on trying both benfo and allithiamine and will do it for the requisite couple months diligently this time to see if I notice anything

Post Edited (dcd2103) : 11/6/2021 2:02:25 PM (GMT-6)

Persistent dysautonomia is basically what I’m dealing with, sounds like I should give a BBB penetrating version such as allithiamine a shot. Are there any side effects/issues with taking say.. 200mg a day? Amazon has only a couple brands available but the capsules are 50mg, I’d be willing to try this for sure.

Started 50mg allithiamine 3 nights ago, will let y’all know how it goes. This morning I definitely notice a bit of an uptick in anxiety like DcD suggested. Not sure on what a reasonable timeframe is to look for potential efficacy but I’m guessing at least 3 months.

I started 50mg allithiamine today. I had a bout of dizziness that lasted about an hour then subsided.

Once I had used to the allithiamine I will add in the benfo

I’m almost wondering if it makes more sense to just start w the benfo since it is easier to tolerate and can get your thiamine levels up towards that 2000mg that Overton recommends, but have already started the allithiamine I will just do that

Plan is working too up to 100mg allithiamine and then 2000mg benfo adding one benfo 250 each week.


Good luck Solaris! Did the DNRS not give you any benefit?

interesting account in the link - but i read

mystery illness with
-cognitive problems
-angry periods
-headaches
-stretch marks - without any weight gain
-arthralgia and myalgias
-sibo/food intolerance/ gut issues
- all symptoms improved with IV ceftriaxone

all raises strong suspicion of Bart to me - i wonder if v high doses of B1 might be antibacterial to bart ?

dcd2103 said...
I started 50mg allithiamine today. I had a bout of dizziness that lasted about an hour then subsided.

Once I had used to the allithiamine I will add in the benfo

I’m almost wondering if it makes more sense to just start w the benfo since it is easier to tolerate and can get your thiamine levels up towards that 2000mg that Overton recommends, but have already started the allithiamine I will just do that

Plan is working too up to 100mg allithiamine and then 2000mg benfo adding one benfo 250 each week.


Good luck Solaris! Did the DNRS not give you any benefit?

The Gupta DNRS has helped my anxiety greatly - the dysautonomia is still there as of now despite the IVIG and 4-5 months of Gupta but I’m going to keep at the Gupta , IVIG I’m discussing with Dr K Friday but I don’t think I’ll be continuing much longer. My dysautonomia is not horrible, it’s basically a mild POTS - my heart rate just goes up high when I first stand (though early in the AM I seem to be much better with this) or go up stairs/do light to moderate exercise.

I also started 120mg daily coq10 about 4 weeks ago. Determined to see if One if these avenues pays off!

dcd- How do you think it might impact your autoimmune type issues? I'm not suggesting I have read a lot about how it can help.

Rosi said...
I have gotten up to 150 mg of lipothiamine and it was suggested I try higher to resolve some of my issues. Next week I will go to 200 mg and then I am also going to mix in some benfo because of the cost of lipo.

If I look at symptoms of thiamine deficiency a lot of my remaining symptoms I attribute to lyme could be related to this.

This was an interesting story https://www.hormonesmatter.com/thiamine-fibromyalgia-cfs-me-chronic-lyme-sibo/

The comments section of this link was really interesting. Cool discussion.

Overton commented:

“Some people criticize me for my hyper-focus on TTFD and thiamine, say that I am simply trying to sell yet another product.

But like Dr Lonsdale mentioned above… your story is not at all uncommon. I see this ALL THE TIME. TTFD is really very special and unique in its ability to restore energy metabolism. It never fails to amaze me.“

I guesss the ttfd form really is pretty unique

Very interesting garzie, and def not off topic. Maybe just adds another potential reason to give it a try. Think ill be going up too 100mg tomorrow

Interesting...so i was just reading about Pierre Kory and Ivermectin for covid, wondering why such a prestigious dr who basically invented the protocol for how to treat sepsis, would stake his name on a treatment which doesnt seem to work for covid.

Then i was googling his sepsis protocol and i came across this:

https://trialsjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13063-020-04289-z

The protocol is steroids, vitamin C and thiamine.

Kind of supports what i've always said, a small dose of steroids will not allow an infection to grow uncontrollably, as seems to be feared on this board.

But also thiamine is a part of the protocol which is intriguing

sepsis is a little different though i think

in that its an example of an acute infection - bacteria growing rapidly in the blood.

i think they are still working out the fine details - but in sepsis its already clear that its not so much the infection that kills people directly - but the immune systems reaction / over reaction to that infection that results in an intense cytokine storm and then triggers the clotting cascade - this is often so severe that you get organ failure and lose limbs etc.

it makes total sense in that situation to give pretty much anything that rapidly reduces inflammation signalling - as that is driving the other fatal effects . steroids short term fit the bill.

stealth slow growing infections are perhaps a bit different as they are already suppressing the immune system and the body is locked in a kind of status quo with them - and anything you do to weaken the immune system can tip the balance more in favour of the infections - which is where the caution comes from i think.

as i have often said though - the immune system is a complex thing - not one volume knob that you turn up or down and get more or less immune activity - but around 30 cytokines and chemokines that can each be individually turned up or down in endless combinations to fine tune the system to react in different ways to different threats.

i read recently that DR M often finds it necessary to give hydrocortisone in low doses ( eg 10mg pr day ) to help his Bart patients fight the disease - as without it they do not do so well. interesting as that would also otherwise be regarded as an immune suppressing steroid

interesting that thiamine was in there - must have a read to see if it explains or theorises what its doing

looks like the RCT is still ongoing -

here are the specifics of the VITCAS protocol in case its of interest :

The intervention consists of intravenous vitamin C (1.5 g), thiamine hydrochloride (100 mg), and hydrocortisone sodium succinate (50 mg) administered within 4 h of randomization and then every 6 h thereafter. The intervention continues until either the patient is discharged from the ICU or 16 drug administrations have been completed (96 h), whichever is first.

as expected way more steroids are given - up to 800mg of hydrocortisone over 4 days

in this paper the authors theorise the mechanisms by which it might work - but they are clearly still just guesses
diagram here -
https://ccforum.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13054-018-2217-4/figures/1

also it seems the mechanisms by which organ damage occurs in sepsis is even less fully bottomed out than i thought

Wow. It doesn’t affect me that way. That’s how I feel when I take even 50mcg of methylfolate. But the allithiamine doesn’t have that effect on me, haven’t noticed anything except for some dizziness the first day for an hour that may not have even been from that. We’ve all got such different chemistry, maybe it’s not for you. Could try the benfo, but I’m sorry the allithiamine has had that effect

You’ve tried a lot of modalities just like I have, gets frustrating after a while