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Dapsone, cefuroxime+clavulanic acid, doxy

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Posted 2/1/2022 6:21 PM (GMT 0)
Just started this combination today.
Dapsone 50mg x1
Ceftin for CNS penetration 500mg x2 + clavulanic acid 125mg x2; clavulanic acid since beta-lactamase produced by bacteria renders ceftin useless. Need to block the blockage of cefuroxime.
Doxy 100mg x2

1. Are their studies on if borrelia producing enzyme beta-lactamase? May be this is how it becomes a persister.
2. How long does it take to this kick in?
3. Doxy alone makes borrelia produce more biofilm, it evades; with dapsone biofilm is reduced. Any recommendation of dissolving biofilm?


thanks
Posted 2/1/2022 7:08 PM (GMT 0)
will answer what i can

1, there are no studies to date that show borrelia develop any true antimicrobial resistance mechanisms - despite many trials designed to provoke such mutations. instead it would appear it depends on persistence mechanisms rather than true anti-microbial resistance

2, depend on what you mean by kick in
-plasma concentrations reach useful levels in around 1-2hrs after taking it orally
-cephalosporins are regarded as time kill antibiotics - in that they interfere with proteins the bacteria use to build thier cell walls. these type of antibiotics are usually most effective when the bacteria are growing and dividing. but borrelia are very slow growing so this would typically work gradually. however individual reactions vary A LOT - and other bacteria may be present that die off much more quickly so each case is different.

3, i am not sure if borreilia form more biofilm when exposed to antibiotics like doxycycline. i have not come across that in the literature ( please do post a link if you have). what i have seen in the literature is that when exposed to bacteriostatic agents like doxycycline borrelia create more non-motile and cyst forms. these forms can later reawaken and start growing again. This is one of the persistence mechanisms mentioned above.
regarding biofilm agents - different LLMD's favour different agents - and some favour different agents for different infections.

bartonella for instance is not demonstrated to make any biofilm of its own - but has been demonstrated to cause th host to produce excessive fibrin deposits which perform similar functions
fibrin is broken down by fibrinolytic agents such as lumbrokinase, nattokinase, serrapeptase, bromelain etc.

borrelia certainly do produce their own biofilm - made mainly of lipoproteins and lipopolysaccharides.
some LLMD's prefer xylitol and lactoferrin as biofilm agents for this
some like stevia products ( another sugar alcohol - similar to xylitol)
some drugs such as methylene blue and disulfiram have anti-biofilm effects
as do some essential oils - like oil or oregano or cinnamon

which ever biofilm agents you chose i would advise waiting until you are stable on the antibiotic regime and have some extra capacity - then going low and slow with these agents as they can trigger surprisingly severe herx like reactions when added on top of existing antibiotic regimes.
Posted 2/1/2022 8:43 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks Garzie for taking time and spending energy on detailed reply!

This is going to be a good experiment.
I am particularly curious about dapsone and clavulanic acid.
I have taken doxy and ceftin in combination, and alone before. It produced zero results that time.

Dapsone to stop folic acid production in borellia, and clavulanic acid to stop bacterial defence against cephalosporins. Plus tetracycline for blocking RNA. Sounds like a good combination to kill borrelia in three different ways.

Biofilm is my concern, especially for people who had lyme for many years and failed many antibiotics before. Highly likey that borellia has made biofilms during their successful residance of years in the body.

How does disulfiram work, mechanism of action? Is it a good idea to add disulfiram in this mix?
Posted 2/1/2022 11:44 PM (GMT 0)
Hi newuser22,

In regards to your Disulfiram question, it can be very effective but I would not add it to your current protocol. That's doing way too much at once. Disulfiram comes with a lot of difficult side effects.

If you want to go the Disulfiram route I would do it as a standalone treatment, and then possibly add in antibiotics if it fails. But that's only after trying it as a stand alone drug for months.

I would just try the antibiotics protocol you mentioned first.
Posted 2/2/2022 10:47 AM (GMT 0)
i do not believe anyone has yet proven the exact mechanism of action of disulfiram on borrelia - its use is entirely based on empirical evidence so far. i think Dr Rajedas and his group are studying it to see if they can find molecules that are effective but easier to tolerate.

there is a disulfiram group on facebook with a lot of people sharing their experiences - might be worth a look - but it is well known as a very difficult treatment to withstand - with a variety of harsh side effects - including extreme herx reactions - and psychosis and neuropathy in some people - and for that reason tends to be used only when all other regimes have failed.

all chronic bacterial infections have a significant biofilm element - you don't need to have had the infection for years to have that - everyone who has had lyme et al for over a few months will have significant biofilm - its a part of their nature

unfortunately we don't know if the biofilm continues to get worse the longer we have the infections or gets to an equilibrium state after say 6 months or a year - and no worse from that point on.

i suspect that, what we see in terms of difficulty in treating people who have been ill for longer may be more to do with the degradation of the immune system - rather than more biofilm

i do however based on my own experiences ( see my microscopy thread) and extensive reading into the scientific literature on biofilms in general - believe that it is a significant and often overlooked aspect of treatment for chronic infections.

the science is quite well established now that its not a diffusion of antibiotics issue - most antibiotics diffuse well into biofilms within seconds - more a change in bacterial phenotype issue - the biofilm phenotypes are simply 1/1000x less susceptible to the antibiotics developed for planktonic bacteria.
Posted 3/26/2022 5:59 PM (GMT 0)
Hi newuser22,

I saw this today and it reminded me of your post:

https://ibb.co/bzqrrs6

Seems like it's a 2 in 1 tablet, but with amoxicillin + clavulanic acid.
Posted 3/26/2022 6:54 PM (GMT 0)
cefuroxime + clavulanic acid is available in other countries.
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