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Why some of us might cant get "ill"

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Posted 5/18/2024 9:50 AM (GMT 0)
So what we know is that Th17 function can be severly impaired in chronic infectious diseases, me/cfs, long covid and other diseases that are knowingly neglected by our governments.

In the urge of understanding whats going on and driven by the will to heal my immune disruption (of wich i am still 100% convinced is the root cause of pathogen persistance), I have found this:

said...
The active form of vitamin D (1,25-Dihydroxyvitamin D3) has been found to 'severely impair' [37] production of the IL-17 and IL-17F cytokines by Th17 cells. Thus, active form of vitamin D is a direct inhibitor for Th17 differentiation. In this way, oral administration of vitamin D3 was proposed to be a promising tool for the treatment of Th17-mediated diseases.[38] In young patients with asthma 1,25-Dihydroxyvitamin D3-treated dendritic cells significantly reduced the percentage of Th17 cells, as well as IL-17 production.[39]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/t_helper_17_cell

So according to the theory I have set up here is that:

Disease (Lyme, Bartonella, whatnot) -> Inflammation -> Vitamin D Receptor disruption -> 1,25-Dihidroxyvitamin elevation -> IL-17 impairment -> Lack of IL-17 response on pathogens -> "Not becoming ill anymore"

I just wanted to share this because I am really really convinced I just cracked my personal davinci code.
Posted 5/18/2024 9:53 AM (GMT 0)
The long way to adress this is obviously: treat the underlying disease, pathogen, whatnot.

The short way around it in order to be able to fight of common colds and other pathogens in a normal way it might be very wise to adress the elevated Calcitriol in order to dampen the il-17 disruptive effects.

Other IL-17 boosting drugs like reishi or thymosin alpha 1 peptide might be a good helper on this immune issue aswell.

cheers
Posted 5/18/2024 12:34 PM (GMT 0)
It must be individually variable. I'm glad you're figuring out how to help yourself. My son was one of the unusual Lyme patients who actually made enough immunoglobulins and antibodies to test positive on a Western Blot with six positive bands, even before receiving any treatment.

In his case, he does great with herbs that decrease IL-17 and terribly with any immune stimulating herbs or supplements (unless they polarize macrophages to an M2 type instead of the M1 type, like for example aloe does).

It's likely that Lyme patients have immune subtypes that still need to be studied more. Here is one fairly recent paper that gives an example of what one immune subtype might look like. This subtype would involve elevated Th17 responses.

"Control of Lyme disease is attributed predominantly to innate and adaptive T-helper 1 cell (TH1) immune responses, whereas the role of T-helper 17 cell (TH17) responses is less clear. Here we characterized these inflammatory responses in patients with erythema migrans (EM) or Lyme arthritis (LA) to elucidate their role early and late in the infection."

T-Helper 17 Cell Cytokine Responses in Lyme Disease Correlate With Borrelia burgdorferi Antibodies During Early Infection and With Autoantibodies Late in the Illness in Patients With Antibiotic-Refractory Lyme Arthritis

https://academic.oup.com/cid/article/64/7/930/2880723?login=false
Posted 5/18/2024 2:57 PM (GMT 0)
I’ve never quite grasped what you’re talking about here although I’ve seen it mentioned many times.

My main question you’re thinking that you figured out why people do not experience the symptoms of what?, The common cold?

I never understood this because I always get the common cold just not too often. My whole life, But not as much as some people that’s for sure.

Did you ever get Covid? I certainly did and I felt it.

The only part of the immune system I understand is the general basic conventional tested immune cells, which they completely ignore TH 17.
I am under range in IgG, IGA, T cells and some B cells. When conventional medicine measures T cells they just measure all of them together cumulatively.

Are there tests to measure IR 17 and TH 17? Or are people basing these levels on assumption?

I have had cytokine levels measured, but they never included this one.

And you’re thinking vitamin D supplementation covers up symptoms of what?

My thinking cap is not on yet this morning.

I will read that link later on.

Post Edited (astroman) : 5/18/2024 7:03:09 AM (GMT-8)

Posted 5/18/2024 3:40 PM (GMT 0)
Thank you Blazer, very interesting.
Posted 5/18/2024 4:06 PM (GMT 0)

astroman said...
I’ve never quite grasped what you’re talking about here although I’ve seen it mentioned many times.

what i mean this is despite being exposed to Common Colds and other infections from my girlfriend (wich works in an elementary school and gets sick often) i am not able to develop any symptom at all refering to a usual Cold or infection EVER since becoming more ill. User garzie has talked about this aswell and He has expierenced this Problem aswell before He became better. He agreed on It being a Common Problem in chronic infections Like lyme bartonella etc. While it might Sound Like a good Thing its actually a Nightmare for your immune system and Body. A normal inflammatory reaction Like developing Cough, fever and a runny nose is actually what we consider a good and wanted reaction to an intruder. We tend to asociate These Symptoms with sickness and as a Bad Thing while in reality it Just means our Body is working correctly. So Catching a Cold every now and then is actually an indicator of an working immune system. I Hope i could elaborate this

My main question you’re thinking that you figured out why people do not experience the symptoms of what?, The common cold?
its a theory why I BELIEVE I dont get them anymore. A comprehensive study of everybodys th17 and calcitriol with this Symptom would be warranted but it would be too much to Wish for XD

I never understood this because I always get the common cold just not too often. My whole life, But not as much as some people that’s for sure.
i mean after all These infections influence our Bodys very differently. I have Seen people with high th17 Levels, and people with bartonella getting sick all the time. Getting colds doesn't necessarily mean you dont have chronic infections, its Just in a Sunset of chronically ill

Did you ever get Covid? I certainly did and I felt it.
i got it when i was still moderate and i felt amazing Afterwards. Weird but it got me near Remission for 2 weeks, before everything came back

The only part of the immune system I understand is the general basic conventional tested immune cells, which they completely ignore TH 17.

this May come Off arrogant but i vew conventional doctors as complete donkeys, they let us the patients Figure all this out by ourselves ... Sorry for my harsh words!

I am under range in IgG, IGA, T cells and some B cells. When conventional medicine measures T cells they just measure all of them together cumulatively.

that doesn't necessarily exclude a th17 issue. You See th Stands for T-helper Cells. Th1 th2 and th17 are all subsets of T-helper Cells wich are rarely mesured

Are there tests to measure IR 17 and TH 17? Or are people basing these levels on assumption?

Well there is this TH1-TH2-TH17 Test that mesures the cytokine Expression after Stimulation...

I have had cytokine levels measured, but they never included this one.

to find an impairment it would be more interesting (atleast by my theory) to Check them after Stimulation wich is rarely done in Routine labs

And you’re thinking vitamin D supplementation covers up symptoms of what?


by my theory Vitamin d would make it worse
My thinking cap is not on yet this morning.

I will read that link later on.

Phew what an Long answer, I Hope to be helpful!
Posted 5/18/2024 9:16 PM (GMT 0)
Interesting. I'm one who hasn't been sick with a cold in years and has never had Covid symptoms. Four to five months ago, I had some cold symptoms but am not for sure whether it was a cold or herx.
Posted 5/19/2024 6:40 AM (GMT 0)
I found an old post of user palermo finding his IL-17 low aswell, maybe he chimes in and says a few words on my theory
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