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For those of you who switched from antibiotics to herbs--

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Posted 12/20/2014 5:19 PM (GMT 0)
For those of you who switched from abx to herbs, what was the transition like?

If you had already been on the herbs and then stopped the abx, did you have a big flare up of symptoms when you stopped the abx? If so for how long?

di the herbs make you herx anew if you'd already stopped herxing from the abx?

Were there any good changes you noticed?

Please tell me your experience. I am ready to do it but just scared about the anxiety kicking up and not being able to knock it back with rifampin.
thanks
Posted 12/20/2014 6:02 PM (GMT 0)
I am now in treatment for 14 months. Initially, for 1 month, we started with the abx plus herbs and supplements. Some of my initial symptoms have cleared up, but after 2 months, herx reactions started for me and there have been many for me since. I am now on about 30 different herbals and supplements, but I am not familiar with rifmapin. xfmlg
Posted 12/20/2014 8:16 PM (GMT 0)
I was on oral abx for 15 months, then switched to a modified Cowden's protocol (over a year now).

My symptoms didn't flare, but I herxed bad again (like when on oral abx) when starting the herbals. They can be very powerful.
Herxing is as bad, but I experienced less stomach issues and a bit less intestinal issues (the issues that were specifically linked to the abx use).
I feel that with the protocol I'm doing, that I really need to keep the herbal dosage under controll. I have been trying to build up towards full dosage, but my body just can not handle that. That is fine for my dr, he says that I need to not go over my limits. I talk to my dr about it, and then we decide what will be tolerable for me.

I wasn't scared to make the transition, I'm glad I did it, 15 consecutive months of abx were enough back then.
Posted 12/20/2014 8:42 PM (GMT 0)
For me, I stopped abx (including Rifampin) cold turkey and began to take herbals. That was a mistake. The herbs that I began taking are not as strong as the abx, so when the abx cleared my system, the herbs had not accumulated enough in my blood to control the infection ( I started slow). I began to feel symptoms that I had not felt in a long, long time. Plus the current symptoms were still there so I felt very sick again.

I then stopped the herbs and went back on abx. Well, this caused a massive herx that for the first week after starting abx again I felt like I was gonna die.

What I am doing now is that I am still taking my abx but I have slowly began to add the herbs. So now I am taking both. This helps my body get used to the herbs, helps them accumulate in my blood, and allows me to begin to taper off the abx slowly.

One plus to doing both for me is that while on abx I wasn't herxing. Now that I am taking both I am herxing each day. I am able to control the herx by the amount of herbals that I take. Some I pulse, others I take every day but in different amounts. I can't say that I am feeling any better or noticed any improvement, but I am also not any worse than I was just on abx.

I am actually liking the feeling of herxing because it makes me feel like I am making progress, and as long as I can control the amount of herx, I am OK with that.
Posted 12/20/2014 9:13 PM (GMT 0)
I just quit abx cold turkey yesterday and started Byron White herbs today. I'll let you know how I do.
Posted 12/20/2014 9:53 PM (GMT 0)
Gosh I hope the 2 weeks I have been on the herbals already is enough for me to make the transition smoothly.

edited to add- but I am jus starting the houttuynia- I have been on lots of other herbals for 2 weeks-- so not sure about the transition off rifampin and to houttuynia . . .

Post Edited (Katebirch) : 12/20/2014 3:18:29 PM (GMT-7)

Posted 12/20/2014 10:04 PM (GMT 0)
I quit the abx then went back...because I thought I needed them - I couldn't sleep when I went off antibiotics. But the herbalist and ND both said no - that is another issue gave me a supplement and then I was fine- no abx. I still had a lot of days/months wondering if I did the right thing but slowly symptoms would change or drop off and become more annoying and less concerning.

I just think it is important if you can to find a good support system. HW is a great one for support/ advice but I liked having an herbalist to call too. :)
Posted 12/20/2014 11:58 PM (GMT 0)
opugirl- I have an llmd, a local herbalist, a phone consult person who knows lots about healing lyme, and the herbalist who made my herbal formulas who I can call and email with questions and do periodically.

I just find that I can get some really good info on here from people who have been through this.
Posted 12/21/2014 4:14 AM (GMT 0)
dazedpete- what I am learning is that the herbs are effective if done in high enough doses.

The doses recommended to me by the misty meadows herbalist who put together the protocol is: 4 cups of lyme defense tea+ 2 tbspns of chronic tonic+ 3 drops 3 times a day of teasel tincture. I am at that dose now and doing well with it.

I also just started the houttuynia tea- which is supposed to really help with bartonella- and which I have been told to take it SLOW to start as it is powerful. I am going to build up to three cups a day.
So the trick I have been learning with the herbal stuff is to ( when you have built up to the full dose so you are not herxing too bad) keep consistent and keep enough of it flowing through your blood to make it work.
Posted 12/22/2014 12:54 PM (GMT 0)
I do not have major symptoms - only slight dizziness from time to time and deep breath need/yawning
I am starting herbs after doxy+tinidazole and azithromycine - enough the doctor said.
cat's claw 2x2, eleuthero 2x2, resveratrol 2x1 - all from NOW because I have a shop nearby, I don't see them recommended
some herb teas - Potentilla Reptans, Taraxacum Officinale - I have no idea of these are useful for Lyme
silymarine+vit B for liver help for 30 days after abx- doctor's advice
serrazimes (now) 1x1 - saw that someone takes it for cyst busting
vit B, magnesium and multivits
bitter apricot seeds for amygdaline 3x3 seeds
I hope at least they do not do any harm even if they don't help LD, they have to help the general health status, right?
too many pills, it is crazy - I never took pills or vits, only magnesium at some point
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