Lyme Detectives - Please Translate What My Body Is Trying To Tell Me

Good Morning -

I really do try to solve as much as I can on my own - I have no doctor and am used to thinking and thinking my way through things. But I just can't crack the code on this one.

Other posts, if you've read them, reflect that as I was working my way up to 6 ADP oregano/day, I would have a neuro symptom "dance" in my legs every time I increased by one pill....where they ached, twitched like crazy, felt weak and stumbly (plus many other body symptoms, including terrible cystitits)...but after a day, I would seem to adjust.

When I hit the magic number of 6 a day, it happened....but this time the leg neuro symptoms wouldn't leave. In addition, I felt "high" - my mood was actually good because I actually was acting playful/silly, like I had been drinking or something like that. Because the scary leg symptoms weren't subsiding, I reduced for one day down to 4 pills. But I felt even worse symptoms.

So I stopped the pills for 48 hours. The legs got better, but my mind went to a really dark place. I felt so strangely depressed...not used to that feeling. I wasn't me mentally at all.

So I decided to take one pill before bed on 2/15. Did ok - poor mood but legs much better. Took another pill in the morning of 2/16. Mood started improving, legs fine! Then last night - took 1 pill and within hours legs hurt more than they ever did before. Hard time falling asleep. Twitching everywhere. This morning, feel like legs are made of cooked spaghetti noodles.

It appears that often just reducing dose alleviates symptoms. I even took a few day break. What my mind can't wrap around is if taking 6 unleashed some pathogen, disturbed some pathogen. I guess I am thinking of this as accidental pulsing maybe?

The reason it is important to me is because I am not knowledgeable yet to know when to press on with treatment vs stop immediately. I've said elsewhere I always listen to my body but it is speaking in a different language right now. Can anyone decipher this message?

Just so you know, I did decide to do Buhners VERY SLOWLY at first - Woodland Essence tinctures are on their way. Also bought some of the recommended detox, including Nutramedix Burbur and Parsley, to name just a few. So I am wondering if I should just 100% stop the ADP (reluctant due to terrible mood) or keep on maintenance dose, even if only one a day, until I can start new treatment.

Thanks detectives................Robin

cd3764 -

Thank you for explaining all of this to me...I think what was so new to me (therefore, scary) is herxing in such a neurological way. I never expected my legs to act like they were possessed! I expected aches and flu-like symptoms and brain fog, etc....feeling terrible overall....but not trusting my legs to drive, etc? That was a shocker.

While I have you - I absolutely will be at a snail's pace introducing the Buhner protocol - I hyper respond to pretty much everything anyway, so have to be slow and steady with anything. But you are talking about 1 drop PER DAY and holding at that for 4-7 days, right? Or do you literally mean 1 drop and assess for 4-7 days?

Thanks!

Happy to help.

To somewhat quote another member on here: "Herxes are like a box of chocolates - you never know what you're going to get."

I know what you mean about feeling like your legs are possessed. My lower legs always seemed to get a lot of "attention" when herxing - numbness, twitches and yes, "dances".

Take a peek at any symptoms list - we can herx with any of them. Blech

And, yes, I am talking about 1 drop PER DAY and holding at that dose for 4-7 days.

I know it sounds like titrating can take forever and it sure seems like that. However, I can tell you that herbs are still effective at low doses.

I remember posting on here in the fall of last year as I was transitioning to Buhner's Lyme protocol and starting his Babesia and Bartonella protocols. I was having trouble increasing the doses of the Babs and Bart herbs due to herxing. I lamented that it would be Christmas before I got up to full doses.

Well, I was up to only 8 drops each of the Babs and Bart herbs at the beginning of December. Yet, I was experiencing improvements that had been elusive after almost 6 months on the full Cowden protocol.

I was at about 90% healed when I started Buhner's protocols in early August 2014 and considered myself up to 98% by December - not bad for 1/8- 1/4 doses lol

Yep, slow and steady can still win the race.

Good luck!

cd3764 - again, thanks for such detailed support and guidance.....

May I ask if there is a thread out there where you spelled out how you approached Buhner? I ask because I don't want to bug you if it is already out there in print. I had (perhaps mistakenly) thought I shouldn't address the co-infection possibilities until I'd achieved full dose strength of the Lyme protocol. However it sounds like you introduced the herbs for all protocols, a drop at a time, to treat all at once? I like that idea, if I am understanding you correctly.

In my gut I really feel sometimes that I see myself quite vividly in the co-infection arenas, too. So perhaps I SHOULD be doing the slow, one drop daily for a week, of ALL of the protocol herbs (esp Bart, Babesia)?

I'm ok with slow and steady. I think it is so important for our minds to be in the right place before starting treatment, as challenging as that can be. I've really been working on making peace that this experience is a new chapter in my life. I am optimistic, no matter how long it takes, that I will feel better in the future. But I've also made peace with the fact that this is always going to be a part of my life, even if in remission or cured or what have you. Just like a person who has no evidence of disease after a successful cancer treatment protocol - you are forever changed. I know one day I will even see the positives of all of this pain - maybe lessons I will take with me on how to be better to my body, or helping someone else with illness. So I am ready for one day at a time and trying to stay in the now - I feel ready to start Buhner, even if a little scared.

Organic lemons are difficult for me to find sometimes of the year because I am in the mountains with no store. I trust Lakewood and Santa Cruz for their process of getting organic lemon juice. Lakewood is a lot less expensive than Santa Cruz.

Ingredients
Contains Only: Organic Juice and Organic Pulp from Whole Ripe Organic Lemons (5% Acidity).

This is the only thing in the bottle. No additives at all in Lakewood.

When I buy the organic lemons for squeezing I first have to really wash those lemons. I cannot count how many hands have handled them prior to getting on the shelf that is exposed to all kinds of coughs and sneezes. I am a bit of a germ-o-phob. Actually I take that back, I am a huge germ-o-phob!! LOL

Maybe the fresh lemon does have something in it that Lakewood doesn't, but the fresh squeezed may come with other surprises in my world.

Another good thing to look up.

ursamajor

I am truly happy to help. All the research I've done needs to count for something lol

I hope you can keep the great perspective you have about what's involved with these infections. Once I got the emotions out of the way, I was better able to focus on healing. Of course, not much I could do about the emotional herxing except detox more lol

It's clear you recognize that dealing with these infections is a marathon and not a race.....and healing will bring you to a new place. I am definitely different almost 2 years after the tick bite. Amazingly so, my grandmother (who prayed for me as a child to develop patience) got the answer to her prayers as a result of these infections. All in due time. (and I think Motherwort helped me get to this place ;)

The way I approached Buhner was based upon his books and what his associate, Julie McIntyre, has told members on here who use her as their herbalist. The latter being the source of the advice to get entire protocols going at low doses before increasing.

Now, that's not to say a person couldn't fully titrate a protocol geared to what they think might be their dominant infection (based upon symptoms) and then titrate another protocol in a similar manner. That's how LLMD's often do things with abx.

The difference with herbal protocols is that people usually just add protocols and wind up with quite the individualized protocol and that's really what most of us need.

Anyway, here's my convoluted story:

Since I'd herxed with Babesia-like and Bartonella-like symptoms on Cowden's herbs geared towards those infections....but didn't improve at all.....I decided to try Buhner's protocols for those infections along with his Lyme protocol.

I was 90% healed when I made this decision but I think I would have healed more quickly if my LLMD at least had me treat herbally for Babesia and Bartonella while he was treating me for Lyme.

These bacteria/parasites form biofilm with each other....people walk around with asymptomatic infections....there are more strains than tests available.

For me, these facts added up to treating for the "Big 3" (Lyme, Babs, Bart) to see what happened.

It worked for me. It might be a good starting point for you or could bring you to full healing.

That's the thing we these infections....because our bodies, our infections, our environments, etc. are all so different, our paths can be very different.

Still, Buhner's protocols have a 95% success rate (and this does include a decent percentage of people who continue to use herbs to prevent symptom recurrence).

I think you have a realistic perception and outlook as far as these infections are concerned. Buhner's protocols could very well be a good fit for you.

Pay attention to your body....you'll learn to understand what it's telling you. If you do things to help whatever issue you're having, that will expedite your healing (this makes sense, really) And, it makes sense that detoxing helps us heal faster.

The longer I'm following Buhner's protocols, the more I feel the supportive herbs and recommended supplements are healing me more than the fighting herbs.

How? Because my organs are being healed, my immune system is being healed.... my entire body feels like it's being healed. That's what we need to beat infections and not get new ones.

Oh, I highly recommend starting with a very small dose of Japanese Knotweed. It is potently anti-inflammatory, crosses the blood brain barrier, is neuroprotective and has countless other benefits that you can read about in Buhner's books (which I hope you will read)

You'll do great, ursamajor!! Just keep asking questions ;)