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Rifampin...elevated liver enzymes.

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Posted 2/26/2016 9:17 PM (GMT 0)
Hello All,

I just have a question.

My labs came back and my Liver enzymes are slightly elavated....Already knew that Rifampin can cause this.

Nephrolist says kidneys are holding up well.....CBC looks fine.

Would it be prudent to take a break? or stay the course (5 months on Azithro,5 weeks Rifampin...pulsed)

When do You know to "back off" maybe take a break (week or two) detox up and come back to throw these little b@st@rds a beating?

Sorry,thought I would throw some humor in this post.

)
Posted 2/26/2016 9:22 PM (GMT 0)
If they are slightly raised, you could keep an eye on them for a few months...unless they're really high.
I get them done every 4 weeks.

Prior to Rifampin, mine started to climb the end of 2014, and continued until my LLND told me to take a break in April, 2015. Within a couple months, they were back to normal...and I resumed treatment with Rifampin....my liver enzymes continued to drop (weird!) and are still good now.

In my case, I'm thinking my liver enzymes were climbing because of the untreated bartonella infection, so once Rifampin started to hit it, it continued to 'help' my liver.
That's just my theory...my LLND or my regular MD aren't interested in why this happened...they think it's insignificant.
So that's MY story, and i'm sticking to it.

How far out of range are yours? Is it your ALT and AST? ...what about bilirubin?

Are you also pulsing the Rifampin? Would you mind sharing your schedule?
Posted 2/26/2016 9:53 PM (GMT 0)
Hello Girlie!

Rifampin 150 2x per day....Azythro 250 1x per day (was 2x,however it was crushing me) Fluconazole 100mg
1x every three days.

I have Gilberts, so I run high on billirubin...1.7 avg

He is mailing results be here Monday

)
Posted 2/26/2016 10:19 PM (GMT 0)
So you're not pulsing Rif and Zith then?

I have - or maybe I should say 'had' Gilberts syndrome.

Since my bart treatment started, my bilirubin is in range...

makes me wonder...
Posted 2/26/2016 10:31 PM (GMT 0)
Can't believe You mention that! my billirubin is better than ever now?? dropped to almost normal at one point?

Yes,I am pulsing zith and rif.

Why does my LLMD not mention Bart?

wow
Posted 2/26/2016 10:35 PM (GMT 0)
"Why does my LLMD not mention Bart?" You mean in regards to the bilirubin levels?

Did you have high bilirubin for years prior to your lyme symptoms? I did..I was diagnosed with it in my late teens...so I'm thinking perhaps I had bart way back then...lots and lots of cat bites and scratches in my childhood.

So, are you taking Rif and Zith every day, but two weeks on, and one off...or??
Posted 2/26/2016 10:51 PM (GMT 0)
Rif 150 2x per day.

Azithro 250 1x every other day
Posted 2/26/2016 10:53 PM (GMT 0)
Billirubin has been near 3.0 for almost 14 Years.....so Drs called it Gilberts
Posted 2/26/2016 10:59 PM (GMT 0)
My last one was 6.0 range is < 17

Your lab is using a different unit of measurement...
Posted 2/26/2016 11:01 PM (GMT 0)
so are you saying that I most likely have Bart? and I have had Lyme for many years?
Posted 2/27/2016 12:20 AM (GMT 0)

reminder said...
so are you saying that I most likely have Bart? and I have had Lyme for many years?

I don't know. But, your Dr. must think you have Bart since he's prescribed Rifampin, right?

I know in my case - it is so very odd that I have high bilirubin levels since late teens...AND even when they were checked prior to my treatment - when we were trying to sleuth out what was wrong with me...high then, too.

After treating bart with Rifampin...first time in over 30 years my bilirubin levels go down - and have held so far.

I don't remember your story...when did your symptoms first start?
Posted 2/27/2016 1:06 AM (GMT 0)
Girlie,

How do I post my info at the bottom.....like You do?



symptoms......physical one year ago.....fog and other stuff even further back.

Thanks for all this info.....my llmd is conservative,he doesn't like to say it until the proof shows?
Posted 2/27/2016 1:55 AM (GMT 0)
That area is your 'Signature'

Go to 'My Profile'
- 'Edit Profile'

Scroll down to the bottom and type in the Signature box and submit to save it.

It will show up every time you post.
Mine needs updating...but I will have to remove some..because there is a finite number of characters in the Signature and I think I'm already at the maximum.

So your LLMD wants to see positive test results...or does response to treatment count as proof to him/her?
Posted 2/27/2016 2:20 AM (GMT 0)
Thanks

Response to treatment is what He seems to go with.

I really respect and trust His judgement.....seems very calm and sure.

Of course I do understand this is a complicated illness.

He wants to proceed with caution due to a low GFR....however,kidney Dr says we should be fine?

r
Posted 2/27/2016 2:23 AM (GMT 0)
250 mg of milk thistle (either capsules or tincture) once daily at 9pm decreased K's Alt/Ast back to normal with rifampin. We continue to take it nightly.

We had liver enzymes run monthly when on antibiotics, and for a couple of months after starting herbs to see if there was an adverse reaction. After the addition of milk thistle we had no further problems (and this was with abx combinations of plaquinel/malarone/azith/mino/tindamax).
Posted 2/27/2016 2:32 AM (GMT 0)
rowingmom,

Taking it with breakfast now?

Going to try evening on an empty stomach.

Thank You
Posted 2/27/2016 1:56 PM (GMT 0)
Not at breakfast. At 9pm with our other evening herbs/supplements.
Posted 2/27/2016 2:22 PM (GMT 0)
After asking My LLMD what His intentions were for the future,He said ween You off ABX onto herbals,I do take A Myco now also (including a host of supplements) diet is 90% paleo w green smoothies.

He says He wanted Me to start feeling better by now,however,I do see progress...gained some weight back.
Posted 2/27/2016 9:19 PM (GMT 0)
Staying on herbals after completing abx treatment is a good idea. That's great that your LLMD embraces herbal treatments.

Remind me - how long have you been treating?
Posted 2/27/2016 9:25 PM (GMT 0)
Since October 2015 pulsed between flagyl...Bactrum...now the Azith and Rif

eyes...this time of day...
Posted 2/27/2016 9:52 PM (GMT 0)
so maybe 4 months....that's not a real long time...don't worry...as long as you see some progress...and you're not backsliding...that is good.
Posted 2/27/2016 10:14 PM (GMT 0)
thanks Girlie....in the beginning i had Drs agreeing with me MS,Parkinsons (Grandfather) ALS,so when you hear Lyme....okay,then you hear....."i think you may have had this for some time"?.....okay,at least now i have a clue,this is one day at a time.

that is why i respect what i see here....very comforting.
Posted 2/27/2016 11:08 PM (GMT 0)
all of oct...so 5 months,i really feel i learned enough to detox.....it is every couple hours.....and sleep...in bed before 9....diet,light exercise (all i can do)....stress (that part is hard),however PATIENCE is something you learn with Lyme.

example....its 6:20 and i am feeling "decent"...happy to even have that!
Posted 3/22/2016 4:48 PM (GMT 0)
so are you saying that I most likely have Bart? and I have had Lyme for many years?
Posted 3/22/2016 5:58 PM (GMT 0)
I don't know enough about your symptoms and response to treatment to comment on if I think you have bart.

I'm thinking your Dr. who prescribed Rifampin must think you have bart? Or, did you ask for Rifampin?

some of your symptoms could be attributed to bart - the muscle wasting (that happened to me - but it can also be lyme), the brain fog, anxiety,blurred vision - could be bart or lyme. Bart likes the nervous system.

Your Rifampin dose is low - it should be 600 mg daily. Either all at once...or like I do 300 mg twice daily.
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