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Teasel, herx, return of some symptoms :(

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Posted 7/27/2016 1:11 AM (GMT 0)
Hi all,

Long time no talk. I have been doing a lot better over the past two months, and I have been very busy (back to work) hence why I have not been on the forum.

For a while I was only on 1-2 Japanese Knotweed and cats claw per day because I was running out of my supply.

I went about a week or two with no herbs whatsoever waiting for the my package to come in the mail. I was fine, almost symptom free except around my time of the month and full moons.

So I order the LB Tonic Protocol capsules from Green Dragon (which has JP, Cats claw, eluthero, and I think Dandelion something in it) and I also ordered Teasel root tincture. Well I started off with a low dose 3 capsules, working my way up to six, and 20 drops of the tincture per day. On the bottle it says 20-30 drops a day 3 times a day and it has a ratio of 1:1.

I didn't notice anything at first, then around the full moon, I started feeling crappy again. Sore muscles, exhausted, sore joints, depressed. I didn't think of the possibility of a herx at first, I just thought on no it is back. But I think I might be dealing with a herx.

In which case do you guys think I should back off on the teasel? I don't' know what my dosage should be really. It has been about a week now of feeling bad. I'm trying to detox but I haven't had time to get to the sauna so I just have taken a bath and taking charcoal.

I've heard a little bit about teasel that it can cause a strong herx and works by drawing out spirochetes from tissues. Well it must be doing a number on me. I don't' know if this is a good thing, since I was feeling better prior to this I am kind of upset that I even took it now.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. xo

Posted 7/27/2016 1:19 AM (GMT 0)
Reduce your dosage, I don't know how much you should take, I am sure some more experienced member will help you with this.
When it comes to detoxing, start to consume apple cider vineger, it is good for detox and you do not need extra time for taking it.
Posted 7/27/2016 3:18 AM (GMT 0)
In my herb world 3 capsules is not a low dose. Half a capsule and work up slowly.

20 drops of tincture is not a low dose either. I always start with one drop for the first day to see if I get an allergic reaction, which I did with 2 herbs.

Especially since you are doing a combo of herbs, you really need to go very low and slow. You may not find out which one is causing the problem with a combo herbal remedy.

But, stranger things have happened - you may find out this is your perfect herb combo!!

Just back it all down and start slower and lower.

And, let us know how you are doing.

Edited to add -- Detox.
Posted 7/27/2016 4:30 AM (GMT 0)
Thank for the replies! I know I tolerate knotweed, cats claw and eluthero well as I have taken them all before. I think it must be the teasel, which I have heard it very potent and can cause a massive herx. I stupidly followed the directions on the bottle and did a full teaspoon, but I really didn't think one drop would do much.

It is so depressing to feel symptoms again when I thought I was nearly cured. I am going to back off a bit go down to 1-2 drops of it a day, and ramp up detox again.

There is a herbalist named Matthew Wood who says teasel is very effective at treating lyme. I'll copy paste the exert of what I found here in case it could be of help to anyone:

Because Lyme disease spirochetes attack and penetrate into collagen tissue, affecting the joints and tendons throughout the body, teasel root seems to fit right in. Matthew Wood, a Registered Herbalist and well-known lecturer, is the first herbalist I know of who recommended Teasel for Lyme disease, and the buzz has spread. According to Wood, teasel, rather than killing the bacteria, changes the bodyʼs environment, so that the body itself can kill off the Lyme bacteria by bringing the bacteria into the bloodstream, where it can detoxify. (Lyme Disease Research Database Web site. March 6, 2010.- lyme-disease-research-database.com.) Other Lyme disease blogs are filled with testimonials about teasel and how it brings relief from Lymeʼs painful symptoms.
As Teasel root tincture is exceptionally powerful, many people with Lyme disease have reported experiencing what is called a “Herxheimer Reaction”
Posted 7/27/2016 5:04 AM (GMT 0)
Maybe teasel will get them out into the open for me ..thanks..maybe some more killers on board ..Andrographis or smilax ?
Posted 7/27/2016 12:29 PM (GMT 0)
I feel for you evianangel because I've been through similar (and I'm thinking of trying teasel root with full expectations of what you are going through).

We can never kill every single pathogen. The key is to get the infection load low enough that our immune system can handle it. Symptoms seem to be our only clue as to when this happens.

Remission seems like a more realistic expectation vs. cure.

That said, yes, lower your dose and slowly titrate.

And, please consider doing a lot more for detoxing. Here's a link to a thread wherein members shared what they are doing for detoxing:

www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=3602759

You'll get through this and will heal.
Posted 7/28/2016 12:02 AM (GMT 0)
Yes Bluelyme you could try teasel for sure, if you want to look more into it a herbalist by the name of Mathew wood has a book on it, buhner mentions it too. But mostly everything I read is that is causes wicked herxes so just keep that in mind too :)

CD - Thank you! If you are at 99% do you mind me asking why you want to try the teasel? How long were you on antibiotics for before you switched to the cowden protocol?

I didn't take any teasel today but I still feel kind of not great, I read the LB Tonic protocol pill bottle and saw there is sarsaparilla root in there too. So I could be having issues with that herb too. Although it is supposed to help relieve herxes.

Thank you for your kind thoughts.
Posted 7/28/2016 4:06 PM (GMT 0)
Interesting post. I posted about trying a "teasel test" to see if I herx off it or not. Not many people here use this, was more popular on forums five years ago.

But I still wonder if teasel cuases a herx in even non-lyme people, as it might even be killing non-lyme friendly stuff in you, which could case a herx too.
Posted 7/28/2016 4:22 PM (GMT 0)
astroman, did you herx off of the teasel? very curious about this herb, I tried it for the first time yesterday.
Posted 7/28/2016 4:41 PM (GMT 0)
holy smokes just took the teasel a little while ago, it is knocking me out with fatigue. I def think it is stirring up some herx symptoms for me. Is teasel mostly for lyme? does it hit other infections?
Posted 7/28/2016 5:29 PM (GMT 0)
I bought some while I was on ABX, but never used it.

ABX kills everything, I'm sure some herbs can too...?

Wouldnt it be possible to herx from "good" bacteria die-off too? Makes sense to me, debris is debris.
Posted 7/28/2016 5:38 PM (GMT 0)
I integrated teasel 2 (or was it three) weeks ago at the same time I added other things for breaking up cysts and bio-films (GFS extract, T. something) as well as another herb, sida acuta. Hard to sort out if the teasel was the root of the herx, but have had an increase in symptoms. Headache, sore throat (which may be gerd), ear pain, jaw pain, muscle cramping, and new symptoms of toe pain and shin pain and tingling in my feet. Pain flares all over body stuff (neck, mid back, hips, knees, elbows, jaws, teeth, ears, headache, forearms). Basically felt I went a bit backwards and relapsed. I am starting to feel a bit fresher now though. I have been a terrible example of going slow. I did give myself a day off from all herbs, and that seemed to help, so I may go that route in addition to all the detox stuff.
Posted 10/23/2021 3:46 PM (GMT 0)

evianangel said...
Hi all,


Long time no talk. I have been doing a lot better over the past two months, and I have been very busy (back to work) hence why I have not been on the forum.



For a while I was only on 1-2 Japanese Knotweed and cats claw per day because I was running out of my supply.



I went about a week or two with no herbs whatsoever waiting for the my package to come in the mail. I was fine, almost symptom free except around my time of the month and full moons.



So I order the LB Tonic Protocol capsules from Green Dragon (which has JP, Cats claw, eluthero, and I think Dandelion something in it) and I also ordered Teasel root tincture. Well I started off with a low dose 3 capsules, working my way up to six, and 20 drops of the tincture per day. On the bottle it says 20-30 drops a day 3 times a day and it has a ratio of 1:1.



I didn't notice anything at first, then around the full moon, I started feeling crappy again. Sore muscles, exhausted, sore joints, depressed. I didn't think of the possibility of a herx at first, I just thought on no it is back. But I think I might be dealing with a herx.



In which case do you guys think I should back off on the teasel? I don't' know what my dosage should be really. It has been about a week now of feeling bad. I'm trying to detox but I haven't had time to get to the sauna so I just have taken a bath and taking charcoal.



I've heard a little bit about teasel that it can cause a strong herx and works by drawing out spirochetes from tissues. Well it must be doing a number on me. I don't' know if this is a good thing, since I was feeling better prior to this I am kind of upset that I even took it now.



Any advice would be greatly appreciated. xo


Hey, I was just wondering what Brand you used for Teasel Root? By the way, one drop a day is enough if thats all you can handle. Maybe work up to 9 drops a day.
Posted 10/23/2021 3:48 PM (GMT 0)

multifacetedme said...
I integrated teasel 2 (or was it three) weeks ago at the same time I added other things for breaking up cysts and bio-films (GFS extract, T. something) as well as another herb, sida acuta. Hard to sort out if the teasel was the root of the herx, but have had an increase in symptoms. Headache, sore throat (which may be gerd), ear pain, jaw pain, muscle cramping, and new symptoms of toe pain and shin pain and tingling in my feet. Pain flares all over body stuff (neck, mid back, hips, knees, elbows, jaws, teeth, ears, headache, forearms). Basically felt I went a bit backwards and relapsed. I am starting to feel a bit fresher now though. I have been a terrible example of going slow. I did give myself a day off from all herbs, and that seemed to help, so I may go that route in addition to all the detox stuff.

Hey, did you end up feeling any healing from Teasel? Also what brand did you use? Thank you.
Posted 10/23/2021 5:27 PM (GMT 0)

LymePeace1 said...

multifacetedme said...
I integrated teasel 2 (or was it three) weeks ago at the same time I added other things for breaking up cysts and bio-films (GFS extract, T. something) as well as another herb, sida acuta. Hard to sort out if the teasel was the root of the herx, but have had an increase in symptoms. Headache, sore throat (which may be gerd), ear pain, jaw pain, muscle cramping, and new symptoms of toe pain and shin pain and tingling in my feet. Pain flares all over body stuff (neck, mid back, hips, knees, elbows, jaws, teeth, ears, headache, forearms). Basically felt I went a bit backwards and relapsed. I am starting to feel a bit fresher now though. I have been a terrible example of going slow. I did give myself a day off from all herbs, and that seemed to help, so I may go that route in addition to all the detox stuff.

Hey, did you end up feeling any healing from Teasel? Also what brand did you use? Thank you.

//////////////////////////////////////

Just an FYI - multifacetedme hasn’t been on the forum for almost a year.
But - she does have her email listed.

I recently purchased Teasel from Woodland Essence. (It is one of the sources from Buhners recommended list)
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