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Bartonella and jaw bone loss

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Posted 10/22/2016 12:29 AM (GMT 0)
Recently diagnosed with Bartonella henslae, and found that jaw bone loss is on the symtom list .
I noticed prior my own jaw seemed not as prominent/defined as I thought it was before. Maybe its because of swollen glands.. or im just paranoid.
Has anyone experienced this with bartonella?

Or can someone explain what that symptom means.. Im taking it at face value.. and have seen it on a number of websites as a symptom

Post Edited (Msloray) : 10/21/2016 6:45:41 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 10/22/2016 2:06 AM (GMT 0)
I have some jaw bone loss due to periodontitis - that wasn't recognized for several years.

Have you had X-rays at the dentist lately? They show the bone loss.

I don't have any changes in the look of my jaw, though.
Posted 10/22/2016 5:41 AM (GMT 0)
Bartonella has caused muscle wasting and collagen loss and nerve damage ..it is a tuff bugger
Posted 10/22/2016 5:56 AM (GMT 0)
Yup - tough is right, bluelyme.

After a year of treatment - blood test showed I still had bartonella in my blood. I hit the jackpot.

PCR blood test.

Got condolences from people...but I was happy...I already know I'm not well...so good to know it's most likely bart still causing my grief.
Posted 10/22/2016 6:13 AM (GMT 0)
I had so much bone loss teeth started getting loose and falling out. I had been to a dentist and had xrays done. The Dentist's verdict was I had some bad teeth and he commenced on pulling one out, with great difficulty. It was what I call an "eye" tooth. The loss of it made all of my front teeth go wonky and bucked, for the first time in my life.
Now, my Internist claims the damage is being caused by my taking Fosamax, (which I had quit taking, by the time I'd switched to using him), and that it was a garbage drug that would stay in my system for 100 years. That was disturbing, to say the least.

It seems to have taken a breather from bone dissolving. However my jaw joints come unhinged and/or lock up out of joint sometimes. Neither of these problems caught my attention before taking the Fosamax.

BUT, that being said, it's one of those things I am inclined now to blame on my tick diseases.
Posted 10/22/2016 6:26 AM (GMT 0)
I remember reading about Fosamax - a Dr. was taking it for osteoporosis and she stepped off the subway and broke her hip. (just by stepping down) - She stopped prescribing it for her patients after that...I think she filed a law suit.


My 75 year old father had hip surgery - not a replacement, but they had to pin his acetabulum (socket of the hip) when he broke if after a fall. It was a quick surgery.

Long story short...because of Psych meds prescribed to him - he ended up back in the hospital...where the Doctor on call one week-end - prescribed him fosamax. The surgeon had told me he had strong bones shortly after the surgery...so I did not want him on the fosamax. The Doctor argued that all elderly people who are in long-term care should take it...as they aren't getting enough exercise.
It took me a few months to get him off of it.
His bottom teeth were already getting loose.
Posted 10/22/2016 7:15 AM (GMT 0)
That is so heartbreaking Girlie!

Yes, that is what she prescribed it for, my osteoporosis.
Which reminds me of another problem I'm ignoring.

My Internist prescribed another kind of organophosphate that I am supposed to self-inject into my stomach every day for 14-17 months. Name escapes me right now. Of course. He claims my bones would be like that of of 16 year old again.
I am skeptical.

Any longer than 14-17 months and you have another lethal risk on your hands. I've put that off for a year now, at least, because I'm afraid of it in spite of what he says. I don't trust anyone any more.

And, in spite of the comment my rheumatologist (sp) made to me the last time I saw her, before the "I wouldn't rule out alzhiemer (another sp) disease", she said "Your bones" - with pause searching for right word- "are nothing but sawdust".
Posted 10/22/2016 11:42 AM (GMT 0)
Julymorning, I'm so sorry to hear about your situation!!

I've had a lot of jaw bone loss, more in my mower jaw than my upper jaw. I have always had "bad teeth" but never had any signs of periodonitis, which always surprised dentists.

I firmly believe it's been because of Lyme and Bart that I've had since childhood. I've had to get dentures at an early age, and now, dental implants a couple of years ago in my lower jaw as I no longer have enough bone in my lower jaw to support a denture.

I've been able to calm down the inflammation in the bone by oil pulling daily with coconut oil and tea tree oil, but I can't be sure that's actually enough as I think I may still be having the bone loss continue.

One of the saddest things in this country is how dental health is not considered part of our needs of health insurance. But just to clarify, that's because I believe that the issues with ignoring these infections is criminal, not sad.

I've had the body bone scans to determine if I have osteoporosis, and while I did enter into the early stages of that (osteopenia) at one time, it also healed after I had been through Lyme and co treatments successfully the first time, but the jaw bone loss has continued.
Posted 10/22/2016 11:52 AM (GMT 0)
Trav,

Hi. How did you heal osteopenia? Curious.

Msloray,

Sorry about your jaw pain/bart. I may have bart but have had jaw pain before lyme. I had an old root canal that got infected under the bone. Long story but had to get a bone graph in two lower teeth which helped a lot. I put a drop of Clove/Thieves on my gums every night. I also do a rinse of:water/peroxide and a drop of an oil called Oral defense. I just swoosh it around for two minutes. I have had no jaw pain since. I can get you the brand name of the oral defense if you are interested.
Posted 10/22/2016 12:03 PM (GMT 0)
Huddie, it was an unexpected benefit to adding EGCG to my supplements. It was the only thing I had changed during that time. So I went lo king and found studies that back this up:

/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2754215/


osteoporosisstudies.com/category/supplements/polyphenols/flavonoids/egcg/
Posted 10/22/2016 12:19 PM (GMT 0)
Julymorning - I don't blame you for being sceptical.
...and the fact that it becomes a lethal risk if you take it too long is scarey!

Traveler - that's amazing that successful Lyme treated halted osteoporosis.

To check for jaw bone loss progression is there a specific type of scan/imaging - or is it just the regular X-rays the dentist uses.
I know I have some loss, but I don't know if it's progressing anymore.
I don't have any loose teeth, though.

What is the standard test now to check for bone density - should I be asking my Dr. to check for this?
Posted 10/22/2016 12:25 PM (GMT 0)
I'm not sure of the name of the scan I had done, but I did find this is the recommendation now:

/www.nof.org/patients/diagnosis-information/bone-density-examtesting/
Posted 10/22/2016 10:48 PM (GMT 0)
Trav,

Thank you! Appreciating my Rishi green tea now more than ever. I'm impressed that you healed your bones while healing lyme. I would love a master list of what symptoms started going away when we began treating lyme. I think the whites of my eyes are whiter. I haven't gotten a fibromyalgia flareup.
Posted 10/23/2016 1:07 AM (GMT 0)
What wonderful news Huddie!! Congratulations!!
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