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Neuro Symptoms -- Lyme vs Bart

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Posted 6/14/2017 8:18 PM (GMT 0)
I've been treating Babesia with Mepron and Zith for the past few months. My Babs symptoms are diminished, if not gone. Good news (which has been in short supply).

Bad news: my neuro symptoms are now through the roof -- tingling, burning, inner vibration -- and I also have worsening foot/hand pain (stiffness/achiness).

My LLMD initially went after the neuro symptoms with Bactrim for Bart. But, I herxed intensely on the Bactrim, even after moving to a half dose, and experienced more fatigue and a return of brain fog.

My LLMD then decided to switch gears and add Ceftin for Lyme, with the thought that we'll go after the Bart more seriously once I'm done with the Babs treatment.

Help, please -- my head is spinning.

How do you know whether Lyme or Bart is the main neuro culprit? How do you decide what medication to add to Babs when you have Lyme and Bart?

I've just added a low dose of Ceftin this week -- 250 mg x 2 per day, and will then move to 500 mg x 2 per day. The optimal dose, according to my LLMD, is 1000 mg x 2 per day.

But, now I'm wondering if I should have just tried to stick out the Bactrim. How much of this, with co-infections at play, is a science and how much as an art?

I see my LLMD in 10 days -- thanks for any ideas in the meantime.
Posted 6/14/2017 8:27 PM (GMT 0)
I took Ceftin 500 mg twice daily...never was prescribed any higher dose than that.

I have read that others take 1000 mg twice daily.

It's really hard to distinguish some symptoms - Babs or Bart (or even lyme)

I don't worry about lyme anymore because I did lyme treatment for close to a year...and there's always a 'lyme' med with the babs or bart treatment.

It's difficult to treat bart and babs together because Mepron and Rifampin don't go well together - so aren't prescribed.

People have taken the fluoroquinolones for bart while taking Mepron for babesia...but I personally wouldn't take that class of meds (black box warning label)

Bactrim does have some action against babs and bart...so it's a good one to add in.

So, I did lyme only, then bart, now Babesia. after a good run at Babs...if I still have symptoms, I will do another run at bartonella.
Posted 6/14/2017 8:37 PM (GMT 0)
Girlie, I know you're not an MD, but do you see any reason why trying Ceftin at this point would be misguided? I seem to just have too hard a time handling Bactrim right now.

Neuro symptoms -- how do you tease out which ones are Lyme and which are Bart in order to know what to add to Babs? Or, do you just work with your LLMD to pick one and ride it out, and then switch it up?

If most of my neuro symptoms are due to Lyme, Ceftin seems right. If Bart, it seems like I should try to stay on Bactrim. I just don't know how anyone can know.
Posted 6/14/2017 8:48 PM (GMT 0)
Ceftin is a good antibiotic - I have seen it prescribed with Rifampin for Bart.

I have trouble with Bactrim, too.

I have the 400 mg tablets...and I am wanting to take 800 mg twice daily..but I think have only managed that once.

Yesterday I did 400 in the morning - and a few hours later I had this strange blemish on my forehead...it was like a sore...of course I hit the panic button...all sirens going...(I have always been freaked out about bactrim - for two reasons: 1) the Stevens Johnson syndrome 2) bluelyme said it made his "blood boil".


So, I am only taking the minocycline with the Mepron today...at least until this 'blemish' goes away...

Very difficult to tease out which ones are lyme or bart. I know I did extensive lyme treatment so what I have left - I'm assuming is bart...or babs...or bart...or babs...(depending on the day...which way the wind is blowing...and my mood. tongue )
Posted 6/14/2017 8:50 PM (GMT 0)
If you do have bart - you don't have to use Bactrim...you can use Rifampin....separately from when you're using Mepron.

biaxin is supposed to have some action against bart.
Posted 6/14/2017 8:59 PM (GMT 0)
The answer is blowing in the wind, Girlie. That's for certain. It is so hard to know what bug is at fault for any given symptom.

I'm glad to hear that Ceftin is a good antibiotic. It seems like I can't go wrong being on it right now. And, like you said, once I transition off Mepron, I can look at Rifampin for Bart.

I wonder if I could (or should) also add a Bart herb to the Mepron/Zith/Ceftin mix? Maybe that's just too much.
Posted 6/14/2017 9:21 PM (GMT 0)
Yes, you can add a bart herb... but wait until you have the others' in at the right dose and are doing well on them.


Bart herbs: JK, Sida Acuta, Houttunyia

I had looked them up - because I was concerned about the cytochrome P450 interactions. I still don't know if it's that important ....on the fence about it.

I will check my notes...and see which ones are on the p450 list.

I'm pretty sure Crytolepis is (for babs).

You could take Hawthorn for your heart...that's one I do take.
Posted 6/14/2017 9:32 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks. I take Hawthorn, and my LLMD had mentioned Crytolepis for Babs early on. But, the Mepron is working I don't need to go after the Babs harder right now (perhaps I will transition off Mepron to that if necessary).

I will talk to my LLMD about adding a Bart herb once I'm on Ceftin with some stability.
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